Accidents on club runs or group rides

[Racing roadkill]

And that's why you can't apply the normal "safe stopping distance" premise on a group ride. Everyone rides too close to stop safely

It is when the rider in front goes down (and thus you do) due to their negligence. Or you get rear ended due to the rider behind's negligence

And that’s the main reason I don’t do many ‘club rides’. Too many heros, who don’t understand how to do it properly. I’ve seen a lot of nasty accidents, caused by this, some have ended up in hospital stays.

 

[screenman]

Rightly so, and don’t push the bike backwards as you stand up.

Which what I feel happens, rather than the other view posted.

 

[boydj]

On a club ride, the guys at the front have a duty to call out problems, including having to slow down. The guys at the back also have a duty to watch not just the wheels in front, but the road further ahead so they can anticipate likely problems. We generally ride a fairly tight 2-up formation and the only time I've seen a back-marker run into somebody in front is when somebody at or near the front has gone down. If somebody causes damage through not paying attention, then I'd expect them to pay.

 

[Ajax Bay]

how much is not significantly?

OK - Insignificant. The rider + bike's speed does not reduce when the rider moves from sitting pedalling to standing pedalling: what is the force 'slowing' the combined mass? There is a conservation of momentum.
A rider with a power meter could test this quantatively - any offers? Does the power record show a dip just at the standing up point? Does the power record show a sudden spike when the rider sits back down?

don’t push the bike backwards as you stand up.

I'm not suggesting a rider 'pushes their bike backwards' as they stand up. They stand up and the standing position moves 90% (say) of the mass forward. Now even if that CoG movement is only 20mm (relative to the bike) compared to the sitting position, this means that the bike (and therefore the rear wheel) seems to move 'back' towards the drafter - about 180mm.
When the standing rider sits down the drafter sees the rear wheel in front of them shift forward the same amount (because the relative movement of the CoG is to the rear. Do my colocutors suggest that there's a sudden acceleration when the rider sits down?
So if you're a spinner behind a grinder (standing) you can be assured the rear wheel will only go forward (relative to your front wheel) (assumes no use of brakes).
Riding behind a tandem where the riders stand up (in unison of course) shows this relative bodies/bike movement even more clearly.

 

[AlanW]

As l see it and as others have already eluded to, if you run into the back of someone then you should be expected to take responsibility for your actions.

However, I also accept that its not that clear cut and each incident will have to be judged on its own circumstances.

I also accept that riding in a group comes with it's own set of hazards the same as driving a car or motor bike does. But that does not in anyway add an excuse for not paying attention.

 

[fatjel]

I sometimes wish I inhabited the same black and white world as some seem to.

A couple of years ago when drafting with one other cyclist I fell off whilst taking a turn at the front

Inevitably the guy behind ran straight over the top of me

Result bent frame and broken collar bone

Our joint response was a few ongoing jokes

Who was to blame ?

 

[kipster]

I once dropped a chain mid group, of course instant speed decline, rider behind hit my bike and came off, damaged hanger and rear mech, only a young lad, I offered to meet some of the cost, he declined. Also when a rider in front of me got out of the saddle and his bike went backwards I bent a spoke as the bikes overlapped and the spike hit his rear skewer, no one came off, but I had to wait forever for a new spoke from italy, I was disappointed if wanted made of the space age material the cost of it implied. I didn't ask for any money.

Things happen on group rides, if we all claimed when they do, there would be no group rides.

 

[PK99]

And (yet again) accident? Collision! It sounds like someone goofed, whether the front rider braking too suddenly or the following rider not braking hard/soon enough.

Some 'Saturday cyclist' guys I know were riding down hill in tight formation and the guy freewheeling at the back overlapped wheels and came down heavily - whose fault? The guy at the front who did not know that in tight formation the guy at the front needs to pedal down hill as he is the only on with no protection from the wind. I would never ride in tight formation with inexperienced riders.

 

[NorthernDave]

I don't do club runs, not my thing.

However, I have been on the receiving end of ridiculously close passes from club runs on several occasions, including one the other week where I was squeezed in to the road edge as they cut back in front of me.

Not all clubs, not all runs, but you'd imagine that they'd have an idea how to carry on around other cyclists.

 

[TheDoctor]

Some 'Saturday cyclist' guys I know were riding down hill in tight formation and the guy freewheeling at the back overlapped wheels and came down heavily - whose fault? The guy at the front who did not know that in tight formation the guy at the front needs to pedal down hill as he is the only on with no protection from the wind. I would never ride in tight formation with inexperienced riders.

With respect, I'd personally say that the onus is on the following rider not to overlap wheels, as they can see what's going on. However, I (obvs) wasn't there so I can't really comment.
I usually leave a larger gap when descending, as you don't need the drafting effect so much and an off at 40 mph gets a bit ouchy. I'm also very nervous about riding in a bunch with people whose skills I don't know. That said, it wouldn't occur to me to try and claim off another rider for an incident in a group ride, as you're usually too close to avoid a collision. That's how bunches work. If you're six inches off someones back wheel, whatever happens has happened before you've even seen it, let alone reacted.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I don't do club runs, not my thing.

However, I have been on the receiving end of ridiculously close passes from club runs on several occasions, including one the other week where I was squeezed in to the road edge as they cut back in front of me.

Not all clubs, not all runs, but you'd imagine that they'd have an idea how to carry on around other cyclists.

Indeed, you do get stupidly close passes by club riders. It is a bit like third car overtaking syndrome. So desperate are they to keep on the wheel in front that they ignore the safety of others and themselves.

 

[Drago]

I don't do club runs, not my thing.

However, I have been on the receiving end of ridiculously close passes from club runs on several occasions, including one the other week where I was squeezed in to the road edge as they cut back in front of me.

Not all clubs, not all runs, but you'd imagine that they'd have an idea how to carry on around other cyclists.

I once had some organ donor on a club run try and overtake me while I was turning right, such was the desperation to keep up with the other power rangers.

 

[vickster]

I once had some organ donor on a club run try and overtake me while I was turning right, such was the desperation to keep up with the other power rangers.

And the buggers never say hello as they pass or indeed anything to make their f'ing presence known

 

[mgs315]

With respect, I'd personally say that the onus is on the following rider not to overlap wheels, as they can see what's going on. However, I (obvs) wasn't there so I can't really comment.
I usually leave a larger gap when descending, as you don't need the drafting effect so much and an off at 40 mph gets a bit ouchy. I'm also very nervous about riding in a bunch with people whose skills I don't know. That said, it wouldn't occur to me to try and claim off another rider for an incident in a group ride, as you're usually too close to avoid a collision. That's how bunches work. If you're six inches off someones back wheel, whatever happens has happened before you've even seen it, let alone reacted.

Agreed. Regardless of what the leader is doing I’d err on the side of ‘if you’ve got brakes use them and never overlap the rider in front’. On descents in groups I let everyone around me disappear a good length or two away from me and keep a predictable line, making sure to give a lifesaver if I plan to change line.

 

[Lonestar]

Not all clubs, not all runs, but you'd imagine that they'd have an idea how to carry on around other cyclists.

I wouldn't bet on it...it's a bit like expecting all coppers to be good drivers.