An open letter to all condescending male chauvinist cyclists

[deptfordmarmoset]

I don't know whether I should be offended on behalf of everyone with dwarfism here.

Are we talking about some dwarves here or all dwarves....?

 

[swansonj]

...

Even if no CC member ever behaved liked that it is useful for all men to read it because it helps us to reflect on what many women experience on a daily basis.

Surely it's more than that. Being part of the class "male" is not something those of us who belong to it can opt out of, any more than we can "white" or "British". We can (with varying degrees of success depending on our self-awareness) attempt to opt out of certain behaviours, but we can't opt out of our experience of formation and living as males in a male-dominated society*. What Pat's letter should help us males to reflect on isn't something comfortably outside ourselves - the behaviour of other men, not like us atall - but on the structures of our society, that create the situation where those men behave the way they do, and that we are most definitely part of.

PS I fix people's mechanicals too. Most often men who've already destroyed two inner tubes, used up all their CO2 and didn't bring a pump.

On one of my early Fridays, before I'd entirely worked out who you were and I'm quite certain before you knew who I was, I passed you repairing a puncture. "Need any help?" I called; "no I'm fine" you called back; and I cycled on. I've subsequently made the same offer to male cyclists. But no-one should kid themselves that the subtext to those various offers was not significantly different.

*there's a fascinating parallel with the debate on whether the prior life experience of trans women means that they have a different character of being a woman from cis women.

 

[Dogtrousers]

Just about on topic: I offer tools/tubes/patches/spare links etc to people of either sex but I really hate it if they actually accept the offer and I have to stop and talk to them. I don't like to touch their bikes, due to my own hamfistedness - I don't want to end up with a zillion pound bill after accidentally snapping a wispy carbon bike clean in two. Nor do I like to offer advice because, while I know my own bikes very well, other people's could be weirdly different with unfamiliar components. In fact, I don't like advising anyone on anything, because I'm normally wrong. I still live in fear of retribution from the Tesco delivery driver I once sent on a hideous twisty wrong road after he asked me for directions.

 

[Welsh wheels]

I don't doubt that the OP's experiences happened and that they were unpleasant. Bear in mind though that this doesn't speak for all men. It's a fact of life that there are some idiots and some lovely people wherever you go. I have met both types of men. I have also met both types of women. Yes, the men the OP encountered were tools, but this isn't because they were men, it's because they were nasty and immature people.
That addresses what the OP came across like, but I acknowledge that wasn't the intention of the OP. The intention was to draw attention to the sexist behaviour of some cylists, and for the discussion to be about what some cyclists are like not what men are like. For the sexist behaviour she experienced, the OP has my sympathy.

 

[Julia9054]

There is a difference between offering help to someone repairing a puncture which i would always do (I'm crap at repairing punctures but i do carry the right tools) and offering unsolicited "advice"
Have just been reminded by the "on this day" facility on Facebook of a good ride spoiled by some mansplaining pratt last year. I was out riding on my own and just at the start of a descent when i passed a travellers camp with lots of animals. It was interesting so i applied my brakes to have a better look rather than whizz past. I was aware of a group of cyclists coming the other way when the bloke at the head of the group started with " don't be nervous on hills love - you won't get any better at them if you ride on your brakes like that"
I was too gobsmacked to think of anything to say back.
What does get out of saying something like that? Does he genuinely think his comments are helpful in some way? Does it make him look like a big man in front of his mates?

 

[Julia9054]

I don't doubt that the OP's experiences happened and that they were unpleasant. Bear in mind though that this doesn't speak for all men. It's a fact of life that there are some idiots and some lovely people wherever you go. I have met both types of men. I have also met both types of women. Yes, the men the OP encountered were tools, but this isn't because they were men, it's because they were nasty and immature people.

Of course it is not all men and of course both men and women can be tools but this is a particularly male way of being one. As any woman (not just those who cycle) will be able to tell you

 

[MontyVeda]

I'm incredibly nervous on downhills... I never used to be until the day i came across i nice steep one and whizzed my way down, only to find a potholed, gravel ridden dogleg at the bottom. If i don't know what's coming i don't 'let go' any more. Brake pads are two a penny, my knees and elbows aren't.

 

[Inertia]

Its an enlightening thread, for myself, Im a little like Dogtrousers, I hope they wont accept the help. I usually just ask if they have everything they need, I would never just stop and butt in without invitation.

Its also interesting at people taking offence, I didnt think Pat meant all men, since I am a man and I dont behave in this way. I recognise that being a man I dont run into a lot of difficulties that woman do. I also recommend Master of none episode 7, Ive felt like Dev from time to time

NSFW

 

[kingrollo]

Jesus, can't everyone just get on there bike and ride it. Do we have to shoebox, divide and categorise every cyclist. Its just bods on bikes, most people are doing it because they enjoy it.

 

[smutchin]

most people are doing it because they enjoy it.

Some of them are stopping other people from enjoying it. This is why we're talking about it.

 

[winjim]

I see the thread title's been changed. Shame, I think it made more sense before. This way feels like a capitulation to political correctness and male chauvinism. I would explain why but it would feel a bit patronising and mansplainy, I think those who get it would not need it pointing out and for those who don't get it, there's probably no point anyway.

 

[smutchin]

This way feels like a capitulation to political correctness and male chauvinism.

It feels like exasperation to me.

 

[jonny jeez]

It feels like exasperation to me.

It feels like lack of clarity to me.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

Feels like some bloke told her to do it....

 

[SteveF]

It feels like lack of clarity to me.

Feels like this thread should be in the Politics sub forum to me