Another Unidentified Carlton

[charliemac74]

Hi All

Long time bike fan but new visitor to this forum, please feel free to set me straight if I repeat anything previously answered!

I have today been given a Carlton by an ex colleague of mine who has neither the time or space to give it any TLC. He told me that it was given to him by the father of a friend, who used to work for Carlton in Worksop. He was told it was a Criterium and 531, but nothing I can find online seems to validate these claims.

There is a 7 digit number stamped onto the left hand rear dropout, and that is the only number I can find, so that leads me to believe it dates from 68-72 (thank you http://www.carltoncycles.me.uk). The frame has been hammerited by the loks of it in part, but the original colour seems to be the metallic blue seen in the photos. The only other mark I can find in 'BCM' (I think - definitely B [something] M) on each of the upper and lower head tube lugs. These are chromed, the others are all painted.

The fork does not appear to be original, it is an (originally) chrome lugless job. I would put money on the fact that the MA2's with Shimano hubs are recent additions as well!!

Down Tube

Head Tube

Head Tube Side

Seat Stay Bridges

Seat Cluster

LH Rr Dropout

BB Shell


Heres hoping someone out there can help, thanks for looking.

Charlie

 

[Baggy]

Spokesmann's has some pics from the 1973 Carlton catalogue, which has the 5 speed Criterium listed as available in royal blue, and had chrome forks. I think they were made from 531, but am sure someone else can confirm this.

 

[charliemac74]

Thanks Baggy, I stopped looking at 1972 after finding the frame number dating info, but it does seem to fit.

Sloping crown forks, decals on the down and top tube and chrome Bocama head lugs listed. From the photo the pattern on the seat tube is the same, allbeit white and red on my model. Also on the seat tube after a bit of rubbing (this has been painted) is the remains of a pump peg that seems to have been cut off and rubbed down. Unfortunately both chainstays have been painted over, but will give them a gentle rub tomorrow to see if any transfers are hiding below.

Happy days, back to Google!!

 

[charliemac74]

No bridge for the centrepull brake though I just noticed...

 

[Baggy]

No bridge for the centrepull brake though I just noticed...

Very true! Still, it's not often that a Carlton goes unidentified on here, so am sure there will be more suggestions soon...

There's a similar one on ebay that's just sold, very similar headset, but again no rear brake bridge.

Wish I hadn't gone near ebay, have just seen another carlton thet's taken my fancy

 

[biggs682]

what does the stamping on drop out start with as normally on old Carltons they are letters , i know s is 63 or 65 i think , but they are listed somewhere . spokesman will be along soon to help he can smell a Carlton 110 miles away if wind in right direction .

 

[charliemac74]

The frame number is 0203xxx which is listed here as potentially 68-72. looking at the catalogue scans from Spokesmann a 73 Criterium is just about an exact match apart from the brake hanger bridge. This bridge seems to appear in the next 74/75 catalogue, but everything else changes.

The same goes for the eBay link courtesy of Baggy - seems identical apart from the hanger bridge.

 

[charliemac74]

Gingerly removing some of the inch thick paint on the chainstay reveals the remnants of some red and white decals as shown in the 73 scan and the eBay bike.

 

[charliemac74]

A cheeky 5 minutes in the shed while the kids have their tea and I find 4 holes under the headtube badge. The top pair (one of which is visible to the right on the photo) are the ones used to fix the badge and the lower pair are about 5mm lower and a couple of mm inboard of these.

Might be another clue, might add to the mystery, might be completely normal, or might even just be here because I'm so chuffed with myself at learning how to put photos up on a forum

 

[Spokesmann]

Great looking old frame, would say its a Criterium, it had a few extra accoutrements like all chrome front forks and chromed headstock lugs.

 

[charliemac74]

Would you say it is a 73 then Spokesmann, could the design have changed to incorporate centre pull brakes part way through the year? And if so would it be made from a Truwel tubeset?

Any advice for the restoration?

 

[Spokesmann]

Would you say it is a 73 then Spokesmann, could the design have changed to incorporate centre pull brakes part way through the year? And if so would it be made from a Truwel tubeset?

Any advice for the restoration?

A set of Weinmann 999s would be nice on the machine, most probably Truwel. Carlton seems to be constantly changing and upgrading their specs for their machines I would say it would be around that 72/73 mark. Much earlier Criteriums had side pull brakes, but by this stage the CP brake was used as far as I now on all their better machines.

Here is the image from the Catalogue of around 72/73...

From my own experience of Carlton bikes and Im no expert, they tended to stir the colours around every year. Previous incarnations of the Criterium I have seen feature a deep flamboyant purple as well as very pale mauve and light blue finished off with yellow.

 

[charliemac74]

Thanks guys, I really appreciate the help - my bike knowledge kind of fizzles out before my own personal experience from around 1988. Feel free to keep the comments/advice coming!

Am I likely to need a dodgy Raleigh size bottom bracket and seatpost for this?

 

[Baggy]

There's a Criterium listed on ebay with a rear brake bridge!

The Raleigh botom bracket question will really depend on what year it was manufactured - my Corsa is 1974 and has Raleigh threads, we put a Velo Orange threadless BB in as we wanted to run a new crankset.