Are cats sickly little beasts?

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Accy cyclist

Legendary Member
My Zeus has gone missing again
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Lyndon Avenue area.
The same happened a couple of years ago and he came back after 2 weeks.
I last saw him early yesterday morning, but he hasn't come back
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He's chipped and neutered.
I'm going to have a walk around the area, see if there's any sign of him
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This is on the local facebook page. I hope they find him, but how can you spot/find a black cat without a shiny/ fluorescent/reflective collar when it's dark, or going dark?




 

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All of the kitties that have lived with us were rescued from certain euthanization. Once you take them home to live with you in a major city, letting them run around outside is a death sentence. Call it unfair if you like, but you're not in our shoes, so perhaps don’t criticize so quickly. Our kitties have all lived long, happy lives with plenty of interaction with our other kitties and us. They enjoy their “locked up” lives as you call them. So do we. We all enjoyed living in the country more, but life sometimes brings changes you just have to roll with. Our cats have an outside-window patio. We wish WE did. But we all manage. 🙂🐱🙂🐱
Sorry, have to disagree. After watching the BBC series on the movement of cats, all the 50 cats tagged showed the same pattern of movement around the respective homes and their wider territory. It became apparent that it was their natural instinct. I learnt a lot from that. They are very unlike dogs that prefer to be with their owners and their home.

Maybe a better approach is to find homes that allow cats to do it. We should not accommodate our lifestyles and limitation and blame it by suggesting a "death sentence". Cats survival instincts compared too many domestic animals are excellent.

It no different to having pets with heavy coats in a hot climate and owners giving all sorts of reasons for having them.
 
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Archie_tect

De Skieven Architek... aka Penfold + Horace
Location
Northumberland
We've had 2 cats since 1990 ... always made it clear to them that if the vet's bills cost more than a new one from the cat shelter...
 
Sorry, have to disagree. After watching the BBC series on the movement of cats,

I honestly think that the cats in countries like the UK - where not only is it the culture to let them roam but also (relatively) safe to do so, are different mentally (and some of them definitely different physically) to those in - especially - the US, and also other countries where for a range of reasons it has not been the culture to permit free-ranging, but rather to keep them largely or even entirely indoors.

Cats are fast breeders and in the US, most kittens will probably be descend from many generations of indoor, or at least partially, indoor cats, which have thrived in that environment. It seems to be largely the cats that are mentally 'ready' to live and thrive with an indoor lifestyle - be they 'breed' or 'moggie' - that get successfully bred and passed on, or sold, to other indoor-only owners; in the UK our cats - definitely the moggie and to some lesser extent the breeds - are more 'multi-purpose' as it were.

Also not to forget that coyotes are often city dwellers in the US now, rather like foxes in the UK, and find cats and small dogs to be an easy dinner; even in suburban areas one hears of bears and cougars; there are poisonous snakes and of course with every interaction that a cat has with another mammal there is a rabies risk. Caiman in Florida too - and probably trigger-happy folks in every alternate back-yard; your pet wouldn't get a bucket of water thrown at it as happens here but a hail of bullets.

So no wonder that indoor cats are a 'thing' in the US. It's probably not strictly necessary , in that unneutered cats in a semi-protected environment (eg a farm) would likely breed fast enough to maintain their population despite a combination of predators and disease, but it's human nature to treasure the thing one has nurtured and want to protect it, so cats will have been - even if not deliberately - bred to 'accept' a more indoor life than here; many US cats would just be confused and stressed by being expected to go outside to occupy and entertain themselves, and to do their business - and how do they do it when there's 6ft of snow outside for several months of the year as in some parts of the US? Also not to forget that an indoor cat in the US will generally have much greater range than an indoor one in the UK - apparently 6 average UK houses could fit inside one average US house!

There's an additional issue, exclusive to the US, in rehoming cats from a rescue, that in the US (alone among almost all of the developed world, I believe) it is still legal to perform onychectomy/phalangectomy (partial digital amputation - approximately equivalent to cutting off the fingers at the fingers at their first joint - and euphemistically known as declawing) for reasons of owner's 'convenience'. A cat without its claws has no defence and is basically helpless in the face of even the mildest aggression from eg another cat or a small domestic dog, and must not be allowed out for its own safety.

So I think that when we compare UK domestic cats with US domestic cats, although on the surface we think we are comparing like with like, in actual practice I think we are comparing two creatures and two lives which are more different than we know. One is not 'better' than the other, but one creature is adapted to one lifestyle and the other, to the other.

Neither is likely to thrive if suddenly expected to cope with 'the other' without an adequate period of transition, and even then it may well not be possible for it to adapt.
 
We have 6 cats, mainly because my wife volunteers as a kitty cuddler at the local RSPCA. They are all rescue cats and only a couple of them are lap cats, but they are happy and permit us to look after them.
We also have 2 or 3 that come and visit at feeding time. We did have one that moved in permanently for a few years from a neighbour, but as our brood grew, he found a home elswhere.
One of the visitors (a Bengal) dicovered where the food was kept and on a couple of occasions, he would jump through the living room window, run into the kitchen, steal a pouch of food from the box and disappear through the cat flap, into the garden. Later we would find a clawed open sachet with no food in it. He was far more intelligent than our moggies (or not depending how you look at it, ours are happy to just sit and wait to be fed!)
 
One of the visitors (a Bengal) dicovered where the food was kept and on a couple of occasions, he would jump through the living room window, run into the kitchen, steal a pouch of food from the box and disappear through the cat flap, into the garden. Later we would find a clawed open sachet with no food in it.

:laugh:

Hrmph...

I have to decant cat treats from the packets into clip top tubs. Because a certain tortie madam will either a) chew the packet open, or b) knock the box off the work surface and keep bashing it till the lid falls off.

N.B. Have to say, Tesco's own brand dreamies in the new catnip flavour are a *MASSIVE* hit here...
 

kayakerles

Have a nice ride.
I honestly think that the cats in countries like the UK - where not only is it the culture to let them roam but also (relatively) safe to do so, are different mentally (and some of them definitely different physically) to those in - especially - the US, and also other countries where for a range of reasons it has not been the culture to permit free-ranging, but rather to keep them largely or even entirely indoors.

Cats are fast breeders and in the US, most kittens will probably be descend from many generations of indoor, or at least partially, indoor cats, which have thrived in that environment. It seems to be largely the cats that are mentally 'ready' to live and thrive with an indoor lifestyle - be they 'breed' or 'moggie' - that get successfully bred and passed on, or sold, to other indoor-only owners; in the UK our cats - definitely the moggie and to some lesser extent the breeds - are more 'multi-purpose' as it were.

Also not to forget that coyotes are often city dwellers in the US now, rather like foxes in the UK, and find cats and small dogs to be an easy dinner; even in suburban areas one hears of bears and cougars; there are poisonous snakes and of course with every interaction that a cat has with another mammal there is a rabies risk. Caiman in Florida too - and probably trigger-happy folks in every alternate back-yard; your pet wouldn't get a bucket of water thrown at it as happens here but a hail of bullets.

So no wonder that indoor cats are a 'thing' in the US. It's probably not strictly necessary , in that unneutered cats in a semi-protected environment (eg a farm) would likely breed fast enough to maintain their population despite a combination of predators and disease, but it's human nature to treasure the thing one has nurtured and want to protect it, so cats will have been - even if not deliberately - bred to 'accept' a more indoor life than here; many US cats would just be confused and stressed by being expected to go outside to occupy and entertain themselves, and to do their business - and how do they do it when there's 6ft of snow outside for several months of the year as in some parts of the US? Also not to forget that an indoor cat in the US will generally have much greater range than an indoor one in the UK - apparently 6 average UK houses could fit inside one average US house!

There's an additional issue, exclusive to the US, in rehoming cats from a rescue, that in the US (alone among almost all of the developed world, I believe) it is still legal to perform onychectomy/phalangectomy (partial digital amputation - approximately equivalent to cutting off the fingers at the fingers at their first joint - and euphemistically known as declawing) for reasons of owner's 'convenience'. A cat without its claws has no defence and is basically helpless in the face of even the mildest aggression from eg another cat or a small domestic dog, and must not be allowed out for its own safety.

So I think that when we compare UK domestic cats with US domestic cats, although on the surface we think we are comparing like with like, in actual practice I think we are comparing two creatures and two lives which are more different than we know. One is not 'better' than the other, but one creature is adapted to one lifestyle and the other, to the other.

Neither is likely to thrive if suddenly expected to cope with 'the other' without an adequate period of transition, and even then it may well not be possible for it to adapt.
Thank you, @KnittyNorah, for sharing your insights with @Arrowfoot and the rest of us. I agree with most everything you said about those of us that live with our feline friends here in the States, (except the likelihood of kitties being chased by a hail of bullets from a back yard, 😆) as I have no idea what it is like to live with cats in the UK or other countries. My wife and I have had two or three cats living with us at all times over the past 25 years in different states. They have been happy cats, as are our two boys that currently live with us now in a city of 82,000 people. Cats that roam free here get flattened pretty quickly. I have seen maybe 3 cats outside since we moved here 8 years ago, to give an idea of how much a major city is NOT a place to let our furry friends roam outside. If my wife and I still lived out in the country they could go outside, but this is a different place, for all four of us. For me even riding my bike here is a world different from being the country. Our two kitties are now quite old and content. Life is good for all 4 of us.

Hopefully Arrowfoot and I can simply agree to disagree. ✌ We are not on this forum for arguing over bikes, politics, cats or anything else. I think you hit it on the head when you said, “… in actual practice I think we are comparing two creatures and two lives which are more different than we know” from what you and others have described. We live in different worlds.
 

kayakerles

Have a nice ride.
My Zeus has gone missing again View attachment 604472 View attachment 604473 Lyndon Avenue area.
The same happened a couple of years ago and he came back after 2 weeks.
I last saw him early yesterday morning, but he hasn't come back View attachment 604474
He's chipped and neutered.
I'm going to have a walk around the area, see if there's any sign of him View attachment 604475


View attachment 604476
@Accy cyclist, I hope Zeus comes home soon, and has a good excuse for not telling you he'd be gone for a while! Looking forward to your report (hopefully soon) that he is home again and has offered you his apologies for worrying you. He's a gorgeous boy. Keep us posted.
 

Mo1959

Legendary Member
Thank you, @KnittyNorah, for sharing your insights with @Arrowfoot and the rest of us. I agree with most everything you said about those of us that live with our feline friends here in the States, (except the likelihood of kitties being chased by a hail of bullets from a back yard, 😆) as I have no idea what it is like to live with cats in the UK or other countries. My wife and I have had two or three cats living with us at all times over the past 25 years in different states. They have been happy cats, as are our two boys that currently live with us now in a city of 82,000 people. Cats that roam free here get flattened pretty quickly. I have seen maybe 3 cats outside since we moved here 8 years ago, to give an idea of how much a major city is NOT a place to let our furry friends roam outside. If my wife and I still lived out in the country they could go outside, but this is a different place, for all four of us. For me even riding my bike here is a world different from being the country. Our two kitties are now quite old and content. Life is good for all 4 of us.

Hopefully Arrowfoot and I can simply agree to disagree. ✌ We are not on this forum for arguing over bikes, politics, cats or anything else. I think you hit it on the head when you said, “… in actual practice I think we are comparing two creatures and two lives which are more different than we know” from what you and others have described. We live in different worlds.
I agree with you on this one. In fact many pedigree cat breeders here actually ask that you keep their cats indoors. I am constantly reading of lost, injured and killed cats on my local Facebook page and lost my last Siamese who got out accidentally. Seeing your beloved cat squashed on the road is heart breaking so I will continue with indoor cats.
 

fossyant

Ride It Like You Stole It!
Location
South Manchester
Dreamies sell a 'large' box of treats as well as the pouches. It says 'claw proof' on the case. Nope it's not. I'll find a picture of the lid. The packets are no problem for Kyoto, the boxes slightly more tricky.
 
Dreamies sell a 'large' box of treats as well as the pouches. It says 'claw proof' on the case. Nope it's not. I'll find a picture of the lid. The packets are no problem for Kyoto, the boxes slightly more tricky.

Well, girl cats have more brains than the boys.

You should be thankful that Madam Kyoto isn't a tortie :laugh:
 
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