Bus Lane Boris

[Eat MY Dust]

Boris might increase car traffic, but hopefully he'll make all the traffic flow more smoothly too, no more 10 second green followed by 2 minutes red! I'm optimistic!

I thought the whole point in having the red lights staying on longer was to make it more of a pain in the arse for drivers thus discouraging them from using their cars in central London. I'd be happy if no cars were allowed into central London.

 

[zimzum42]

that's nice and fair..... just ban everything you don't like eh?

and Spinners, oyu know what you've got to do to get me to stop, there's a thread waiting for you to make the admission we're waiting for.....

 

[spindrift]

that's nice and fair..... just ban everything you don't like eh?

and Spinners, oyu know what you've got to do to get me to stop, there's a thread waiting for you to make the admission we're waiting for.....

So, because I choose not to discuss my future plans with some tedious anonymous talkboard self-gratification artist you are going to barge into any and every thread here, in Soapbox or in Touring and demand to know where I plan to live? Why?


Do you think that's gonna encourage people to visit the forum or encourage sensible debate here?

 

[MERV]

Whether it's a good idea I dont know.Good for motorcyclists but not so good for cyclists IMHO.

I already use a cycle lane anyway which we seem to share with motorcyclists.

Good point by domtyler.I don't particularly like seeing motorcyclists sprawled over The Mile End Road.

I don't mind that so much but I wish they would see themselves as "guests" and show a bit more consideration when using "our" cycle lanes.

 

[Eat MY Dust]

that's nice and fair..... just ban everything you don't like eh?

I never said that. I just don't see any need for people driving in central London especially seeing as how Ken done so much for TfL.

 

[Aperitif]

Here's the mail I wrote before posting the 'OP'
(And please have a bit of a debate about this eg: Dom's valid point... not just act in a witless way - clear off to soapbox and leave 'us' minor players to talk rather than insult. Ta.)


Dear Mayor,
This is a ridiculous decision that will remove sanctuary for cyclists in
their daily commute through London.
ALL engine powered vehicles can put cyclists at risk. Motorbikes, sometimes
deadline hunting messengers, with their immense and quick acceleration will
cause major problems if they are allowed to roam the whole road.
You are wrong to allow this.
This also means that mopeds and very inexperienced engine drivers will be
allowed similar 'freedom'.
Whilst statistics can prove lots of things, they cannot account for the near
misses, anger and plain difficulty in conducting a commute on a stop start
basis when a clearer path for pedal power allows for reasonable
concentration on the part of the cyclist.
Cyclists cannot compete against the acceleration of all powered vehicles,
they cannot defend against the rapid braking technology allowed to be in
front of them, around them...
You are wrong to allow this.
Forget this, and put more 'plain clothes' police, real police, on bikes to
catch the couldn't care less idiots who drive their cars while texting, or
holding a telephone to their ear. Ban cars altogether if you like but leave
the cyclist a bit of space in which to contribute to London.
I thought that your election would be a 'change of air' in the stuffy room
that is London Government - but, Boris, you are starting on the wrong foot -
for sure.
Yours sincerely,
very sincerely,

Martin -
A cyclist in London

 

[LLB]

Go Boris

 

[CotterPin]

And here is my letter....

And Linford - if you haven't got anything constructive to say, go play with your bull bars.

I am very disturbed about your proposals to allow Powered Two Wheelers (PTWs) in bus lanes in London.

As a cyclist I feel that this will make my journey to and from work more dangerous. This is already happening to some extent when they illegally use bus lanes and travel at speed. I am a confident cyclist but even I feel unnerved when I hear a motorbike engine coming up behind me. I cannot be sure if it will come up on my inside or on my outside. At the moment it tends to be on the outside but if they are legally allowed to use bus lanes I could find myself buzzed on either side. Also if I have to move from my current line to go around a pot hole or similar in the bus lane then there is a greater chance that it may not be able to avoid me given the excessive speeds they travel sometimes.

I do not want motorcyclists penalised but I feel that this is a step too far and in any case they are already exempted from the congestion charge.

You have ambitious plans to treble cycle journeys in London. Allowing PTWs into bus lanes will have a detrimental effect upon these plans.

Your sincerely

 

[spindrift]

The discouragement aspect is the most worrying. Nervous cyclists will be bullied off the roads, exactly what we don't want.

 

[LLB]

And here is my letter....

And Linford - if you haven't got anything constructive to say, go play with your bull bars.

I am very disturbed about your proposals to allow Powered Two Wheelers (PTWs) in bus lanes in London.

As a cyclist I feel that this will make my journey to and from work more dangerous. This is already happening to some extent when they illegally use bus lanes and travel at speed. I am a confident cyclist but even I feel unnerved when I hear a motorbike engine coming up behind me. I cannot be sure if it will come up on my inside or on my outside. At the moment it tends to be on the outside but if they are legally allowed to use bus lanes I could find myself buzzed on either side. Also if I have to move from my current line to go around a pot hole or similar in the bus lane then there is a greater chance that it may not be able to avoid me given the excessive speeds they travel sometimes.

I do not want motorcyclists penalised but I feel that this is a step too far and in any case they are already exempted from the congestion charge.

You have ambitious plans to treble cycle journeys in London. Allowing PTWs into bus lanes will have a detrimental effect upon these plans.

Your sincerely

Considering that motorcyclists are the most vulnerable of road users. I think it is a major step forward in their safety. I applaud Boris's recognition of this fact, where Red Ken totally ignored it.

The policy of m/cycles in bus lanes has worked very well in Bristol for the last 20 odd years.

Sorry, but your attitude comes across as a bit NIMBYist.

 

[domtyler]

The discouragement aspect is the most worrying. Nervous cyclists will be bullied off the roads, exactly what we don't want.

I must admit I am feeling a little trepidation myself. I can't help feeling that cycling is going to get a whole lot less enjoyable now.

 

[MERV]

Considering that motorcyclists are the most vulnerable of road users.

They aren't.Cyclists are.

 

[spindrift]

The policy of m/cycles in bus lanes has worked very well in Bristol for the last 20 odd years.

Wrong:


A subsequent survey of cyclists found that 31% of cyclists had experienced problems with motorbikes in these bus lanes, leading Bristol City Council to conclude it had a negative effect.
One of the reasons we are so worried is because of what happened in Bristol, where motorbikes have been allowed to use many bus lanes for several years. This started initially as an experimental scheme. There were - amazingly - no proper 'before' and 'after' studies, but a subsequent survey of cyclists found that 31% of cyclists had experienced problems with motorbikes in these bus lanes, leading Bristol City Council to conclude

'it appears that the experiment had a measurable effect on cyclists.'

Nevertheless the scheme was made permanent, firstly because the local council said it could not afford to remove it. Secondly, the Chief Constable said that after allowing motorbikes into bus lanes it would be too difficult to enforce banning them again.

So if motorbikes are allowed into bus lanes, even as an experiment, we might be stuck with them for good. It would also set a precedent for other towns and cities. Transport experts have told us that if powered two-wheelers are allowed into bus lanes in 'cycle city' Cambridge, then this will set a standard for elsewhere in the country.

There is also concern that this would be the start of a 'slippery slope.' Once motorbikes and mopeds are allowed into bus lanes, we will see campaigns for them to be allowed into cycle lanes and advanced stop boxes at traffic lights, and even onto off-road facilities. In the Netherlands, mopeds are not only allowed to use cycle lanes, but also many off-road cycle paths. In west London, mopeds are allowed to use the cycle tracks alongside the A4.

 

[CotterPin]

Considering that motorcyclists are the most vulnerable of road users. I think it is a major step forward in their safety. I applaud Boris's recognition of this fact, where Red Ken totally ignored it.

The policy of m/cycles in bus lanes has worked very well in Bristol for the last 20 odd years.

Sorry, but your attitude comes across as a bit NIMBYist.

(A) last time I looked this was a forum for CYCLISTS
( I live and cycle regularly in London whilst you apparently tootle around country lanes so I think I know more about the experience of cycling on major roads than you do and what the impact of PTWs close up to me will be.

 

[LLB]

The policy of m/cycles in bus lanes has worked very well in Bristol for the last 20 odd years.

Wrong:


A subsequent survey of cyclists found that 31% of cyclists had experienced problems with motorbikes in these bus lanes, leading Bristol City Council to conclude it had a negative effect.
One of the reasons we are so worried is because of what happened in Bristol, where motorbikes have been allowed to use many bus lanes for several years. This started initially as an experimental scheme. There were - amazingly - no proper 'before' and 'after' studies, but a subsequent survey of cyclists found that 31% of cyclists had experienced problems with motorbikes in these bus lanes, leading Bristol City Council to conclude

'it appears that the experiment had a measurable effect on cyclists.'

Nevertheless the scheme was made permanent, firstly because the local council said it could not afford to remove it. Secondly, the Chief Constable said that after allowing motorbikes into bus lanes it would be too difficult to enforce banning them again.

So if motorbikes are allowed into bus lanes, even as an experiment, we might be stuck with them for good. It would also set a precedent for other towns and cities. Transport experts have told us that if powered two-wheelers are allowed into bus lanes in 'cycle city' Cambridge, then this will set a standard for elsewhere in the country.

There is also concern that this would be the start of a 'slippery slope.' Once motorbikes and mopeds are allowed into bus lanes, we will see campaigns for them to be allowed into cycle lanes and advanced stop boxes at traffic lights, and even onto off-road facilities. In the Netherlands, mopeds are not only allowed to use cycle lanes, but also many off-road cycle paths. In west London, mopeds are allowed to use the cycle tracks alongside the A4.

As opposed to 100% of motorcyclists who have had trouble with car drivers when forced to mix with them 24/7

They like cycles reduce congestion. This can be no bad thing.