Cambridge Dutch roundabout.

[figbat]

The irony of that BC video is that the large roundabout they are using for demonstration purposes has a cycling lane marking all away around the outer lane of the roundabout, perhaps implying that cyclists should stay in that lane when using the roundabout - an option that the Highway Code endorses. It is almost certainly the view that some other road users will infer, not unreasonably, and could lead to conflicts of intention.

 

[MontyVeda]

The irony of that BC video is that the large roundabout they are using for demonstration purposes has a cycling lane marking all away around the outer lane of the roundabout, perhaps implying that cyclists should stay in that lane when using the roundabout - an option that the Highway Code endorses. It is almost certainly the view that some other road users will infer, not unreasonably, and could lead to conflicts of intention.

yep... get shut of the stupid feckin 'cycle lane.

Not a roundabout, but this crossing between Morecambe and Lancaster is supposed to give cyclists priority...

it's got a give way sign, a raised red hump and the faded markings show how long it's been in place... but I've never seen a single driver give way when turning left off the main carriageway 🤬

 

[Blue Hills]

The problem I have with the layout shown is that the route for the cyclist goes against all current recommendations.

See BC video:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6uP59WRFT4


On a current roundabout I take control of the lane.
If entering at E1, and leaving at E4 I take control of the lane (as per BC video) and cross no traffic streams

In the Cambridge arrangement, I cross 4 traffic streams R L R L relying on my and 4 drivers to observe correctly.

On the roundabout as shown, I would feel safer, when entering at E1 and leaving at E4, staying on the main carriageway and controlling the traffic behind me by my positioning as per current RA design and use.

interesting point - yes, i ride round roundabouts as a car would.
have never had any serious problems with this.
i once tried to tell a couple of italians (one a london rider, one an italian rider) that this is what you should do in order to minimise conflict, obvs making relevant changes because of italy driving on the other side, but fear that they both thought me mad.
maybe they knew more about italian drivers than me and had been scarred.
that cambridge design does mean you have to have a lot of faith in the drivers.

 

[matticus]

that cambridge design does mean you have to have a lot of faith in the drivers.

Isn't it the same amount of faith as at any junction where drivers need to Give Way to you? (your "vehicular" roundabout technique - which I also use - is still vulnerable to a driver charging into your from your left without looking. I've had it happen!)

 

[matticus]

Saw on facebook this morning - can't access it now - a picture from some group like the Urban Cycling Institute of a roundabout in BE/NL - it could have been a carbon copy of this one! The layout/colours were the same to a few inches.

 

[Fab Foodie]

Isn't it the same amount of faith as at any junction where drivers need to Give Way to you? (your "vehicular" technique - which I also use - is still vulnerable to a driver charging into your from your left without looking. I've had it happen!)

My limited experience of driving in the Netherlands is that you have to adjust your field of vision and awareness when approaching/stopped at these roundabouts (and junctions where cyclists crossing have priority) as the cyclists are coming now in a different direction/angle to the regular 'car' traffic. So you have a little more looking to do, both the road lanes and the cycling lane. Hard to explain, but it is an adjustment that takes a while to do.

 

[HLaB]

Saw on facebook this morning - can't access it now - a picture from some group like the Urban Cycling Institute of a roundabout in BE/NL - it could have been a carbon copy of this one! The layout/colours were the same to a few inches.

Was it this one. It popped up on a few of my feeds.

 

[dutchguylivingintheuk]

This looks indeed like a copy of many dutch roundabouts, in all honestly in The netherlands it works fine, because the outer (cycle lane) circle is much wider, it very hard to get caught in the death corner of of van or truck. (also because of the grass bed in between the car corner) Then if you come off the roundabout as i car they also copied the dutch road markings, which are fine in the Netherlands because lawfully and traffic etiquette wise cars useally stop if there is a cycle approaching. However as i understand the rules here are slightly different so i don't understand why after the zebra crossing and before the cyclepaths they did'nt make an stop line and the triangles that indicate that traffic on the crossing lane have priority over other traffic. I know dutch roundabouts had that when they where introduced years ago.. it only slowly evolved in the current model.
I saw i clip on the daily fail about this roundabout and it was just like mario kart, and then they claim it is unsafe..
don't understand where they spend the 2.4 million on tough

 

[GlamorganGuy]

I use it all the time - as a cyclist it's a completely different experience to a regular roundabout and way superior. Obviously as a cyclist you need to make sure that car traffic is slowing down and stopping as it should, but you are in a far more commanding and secure position compared to the usual set up. Traffic flow is calm and smooth and the whole thing is absolutely superb in my opinion - wish there were more of them. Massively improved experience as a pedestrian too.

 

[sheddy]

Have any locals shot a bike cam video yet ?

 

[GlamorganGuy]

Have any locals shot a bike cam video yet ?

Will give it a try Sheddy.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I have photos from when I went round it in Sept. Let me check whether I did any video as well.

 

[mjr]

Videos from opening day but of course, that's with more cyclists than normal and obvious cameras around, so may not be typical driver behaviour:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K20Ol8MGinI


Curiously, the signs on the posts seem to be "dedicated cycleway" (which is OK) but also "compulsory turn left" which I think cannot legally be limited to cyclists under current law (there is a different sign combination to do that) so, according to the signs, all motorists MUST turn left onto the cycleway which they also MUST NOT use... but the mandatory turn left signs legally must be backed up by a Traffic Regulation Order, which I bet they are not because it would effectively close the roundabout to motorists and I hope someone would have spotted that during drafting!

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Videos from opening day but of course, that's with more cyclists than normal and obvious cameras around, so may not be typical driver behaviour:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K20Ol8MGinI


Curiously, the signs on the posts seem to be "dedicated cycleway" (which is OK) but also "compulsory turn left" which I think cannot legally be limited to cyclists under current law (there is a different sign combination to do that) so, according to the signs, all motorists MUST turn left onto the cycleway which they also MUST NOT use... but the mandatory turn left signs legally must be backed up by a Traffic Regulation Order, which I bet they are not because it would effectively close the roundabout to motorists and I hope someone would have spotted that during drafting!

That was typical driver behaviour when I was there.

 

[Mike_P]

Probably not unsurprisingly it has apparently resulted in more accidents https://www.aol.co.uk/uks-first-dutch-style-roundabout-150633486.html

North Yorkshire Council this week announced one planned for Harrogate will not go ahead. Not particularly disappointed as its not an especially busy roundabout and would vastly increase the distance to be cycled if the cycle lanes were to be followed.