Carbon Clinchers

[jowwy]

"As you can see, Mrs Smith, once you've paid me. You simply won't be able to afford carbon tubs"
View attachment 29868

carbon tubs were the same price as the clinchers - so could have had either

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

carbon tubs were the same price as the clinchers - so could have had either

Don't ruin it

 

[jowwy]

Don't ruin it

ruin what?????

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

That man is a financial advisor

 

[Rob3rt]

no - just get fed up of people quoting this and that rather than making their own minds up - not every review or quote will satisfy every user - but using the product and finding out for yourself and then passing on the experience of riding them, is far more beneficial than just quoting somebody elses reason for using or not using them.

@Mr Haematocrit uses the same wheels as me and so does @PaulSecteur so their real world perspectives are a better indication of how the wheels run and perform, not some forumight using quotes to justify why he wouldn't use them.

as far as i can read all @Dusty Bin does is give negative response on reviews based on other people's quotes or justifications, not based on his own personal usage

rant over

as i'm off to ride my carbon clinchers while the sun shines on the welsh valley

To be fair to some of those posting, you do seem to have created a thread asking for opinions and have received them. Both sides have made robust, and some less robust points.

Jowwy you do seem to shoehorn the mention that you have and ride Zipps into lots of posts as if you want everyone to know you ride Zipp wheels, great you like them and are enthusiastic. But you also seem to have some sort of axe to grind as to you being able to have whatever you want and justifying your purchase (even though you claim you don't need to, you spend a lot of words doing it), which I don't really perceive as being called into question.

With regards to other people on the forum using the same wheels and their input being more valid than a review or other analytical comment, I would say both are equally as useless on the most part as far as I am concerned (although I do give some weight to Mr Haematocrit since he is pretty reasoned and have discussed various things with him in the past, usually via pm and I value his input). The opinion of a pair of high end racing wheels, put forth by some heavy sportive/leisure rider regarding how well said wheels perform is hardly an opinion I would give much weight to, similarly I don't give much thought to online or magazine reviews as they are usually just a combination of paraphrased manufacturer spiel and meaningless stock phrases. I also call into question published aero data from wind tunnel testing, there is no common test protocol hence the results are virtually meaningless.

Was the wheel spinning or static during the test?
What tyre was used?
What tyre pressure was used?
Was the wheel mounted in a frame during the test?
If it was, what frame?
Did the frame have a person on it and pedalling?
What are the dimensions of the person, are they similar to you the end user?
How fast was the test simulating?
What was the yaw angle?

etc etc.

 

[Dusty Bin]

no - just get fed up of people quoting this and that rather than making their own minds up - not every review or quote will satisfy every user - but using the product and finding out for yourself and then passing on the experience of riding them, is far more beneficial than just quoting somebody elses reason for using or not using them.

@Mr Haematocrit uses the same wheels as me and so does @PaulSecteur so their real world perspectives are a better indication of how the wheels run and perform, not some forumight using quotes to justify why he wouldn't use them.

as far as i can read all @Dusty Bin does is give negative response on reviews based on other people's quotes or justifications, not based on his own personal usage

rant over

as i'm off to ride my carbon clinchers while the sun shines on the welsh valley

there you go again - more 'post purchase justification', but this time with added 'straw man' and a bit of 'ad hominem' thrown in for good measure...

 

[jowwy]

To be fair to some of those posting, you do seem to have created a thread asking for opinions and have received them. Both sides have made robust, and some less robust points.

Jowwy you do seem to shoehorn the mention that you have and ride Zipps into lots of posts as if you want everyone to know you ride Zipp wheels, great you like them and are enthusiastic. But you also seem to have some sort of axe to grind as to you being able to have whatever you want and justifying your purchase (even though you claim you don't need to, you spend a lot of words doing it), which I don't really perceive as being called into question.

With regards to other people on the forum using the same wheels and their input being more valid than a review or other analytical comment, I would say both are equally as useless on the most part as far as I am concerned (although I do give some weight to Mr Haematocrit since he is pretty reasoned and have discussed various things with him in the past). The opinion of a pair of wheels, put forth by some heavy sportive/leisure rider is hardly an opinion I would give much weight to, similarly I don't give much thought to online or magazine reviews as they are usually just a combination of paraphrased manufacturer spiel and meaningless stock phrases. I also call into question published aero data from wind tunnel testing, there is no common test protocol hence the results are virtually meaningless.

Was the wheel spinning or static during the test?
What tyre was used?
What tyre pressure was used?
Was the wheel mounted in a frame during the test?
If it was, what frame?
Did the frame have a person on it and pedalling?
What are the dimensions of the person, are they similar to you the end user?
How fast was the test simulating?
What was the yaw angle?

etc etc.

in the same way as people constantly post on here about the bikes, wheels equipment etc etc etc they use, thats why its called cycle chat

and your right, i don't race, i am a portly gentleman at just under 17st, but then so is Dr Jamie roberts and i wouldn't call him fat at all......the question i posted originally was whether people used them or not and if not why...........

and to be quite honest as a portly gentleman its good to hear constructive views from other people that have used carbon clinchers to see how they ride and is there a problem using them at my weight. Thatis irrispective of whether they are mavic, zipp, enve or lightweight, yes i do ride zipps and i have quoted it in a few posts when asked about wheels, i have also quoted that i ride handbuilts too and did i mention that i have a titanium road bike as well, if not my apologise.

but what i don't spew out is constant gruel on power numbers, aero tests, wind tunnels etc etc etc in a way that some people do. You may race rob3rt and you might be pretty good at it, but please don't abuse my size and weight, i'm a cyclist like yourself and enjoy it.

 

[Dusty Bin]

That wasn't a very long ride....

 

[Rob3rt]

in the same way as people constantly post on here about the bikes, wheels equipment etc etc etc they use, thats why its called cycle chat

and your right, i don't race, i am a portly gentleman at just under 17st, but then so is Dr Jamie roberts and i wouldn't call him fat at all......the question i posted originally was whether people used them or not and if not why...........

and to be quite honest as a portly gentleman its good to hear constructive views from other people that have used carbon clinchers to see how they ride and is there a problem using them at my weight. Thatis irrispective of whether they are mavic, zipp, enve or lightweight, yes i do ride zipps and i have quoted it in a few posts when asked about wheels, i have also quoted that i ride handbuilts too and did i mention that i have a titanium road bike as well, if not my apologise.

but what i don't spew out is constant gruel on power numbers, aero tests, wind tunnels etc etc etc in a way that some people do. You may race rob3rt and you might be pretty good at it, but please don't abuse my size and weight, i'm a cyclist like yourself and enjoy it.

I did not abuse your size, at all!

 

[jowwy]

That wasn't a very long ride....

cause i havent been yet, my wheels might melt in the sun

 

[jowwy]

I did not abuse your size, at all!

then i will apologise for the misread of your post

 

[Rob3rt]

Nevermind.

 

[Mr Haematocrit]

The first quote from Mr Haemo contained an 'absolute'. The actual quote contained a 'conditional'. The difference should be obvious. Let's not get into another round of 'post-purchase justification' again, pls...

So just for clarity purposes. I accidently misquoted which has been been pointed out.. This however simply detracts from the clear facts that clinchers are becoming popular choices for the performance driven pro-peleton.
Cycle and wheel companies continue to invest greatly in technology to seek any advantage, and when they start using uncommon components I personally take notice and interest.

Ultimately OPQ won the team time trial, which suggests that whatever wheels and tyres they were using did not disadvantage them. At the worst they were no worse off than the teams using tubs, and the performance required to win came from somewhere, it could just be the wheel/tyre choice... who knows

 

[Dusty Bin]

Ultimately OPQ won the team time trial, which suggests that whatever wheels and tyres they were using did not disadvantage them.

Sorry, I'm not trying to be difficult - but you can't possibly say that with any degree of confidence. It's perfectly possible that their wheel/tyre choice did disadvantage them, but the team's collective fitness and performance still gave them the winning advantage. Their winning margin might have been even greater on a different wheel/tyre combo, potentially.

It's important that we don't start making claims about carbon clinchers that cannot currently be verified

 

[PaulSecteur]

Jowwy: Do you use them

Me: Yup

Jowwy: Why?

Me: They make my chubby face look like this