MontyVeda
a short-tempered ill-controlled small-minded troll
- Location
- Lancaster... the little city.
My thoughts
Me too... I don't know who this guy drinks with but it aint any of the women i know!
Do young gurls drink too?
- Thread starter Crankarm
- Start date
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Me too... I don't know who this guy drinks with but it aint any of the women i know!
- Location
- The TerrorVortex
Your basic question was about gears, IIRC. One fairly new member (who didn't actually know all that much) took the piss, then a few other members backed you up and told the other chap he was being daft. Hardly pack mentality...
Did you report it to the Mods at the time? That's what we're here for.
You are lucky that this will have to wait, as I'm about to nip off over the Black Mountain. Someone else might oblige - I suppose that would make him or her a Usual Suspect?
biggs682
Itching to get back on my bike's
- Location
- Northamptonshire
having seen partners daughter grow from 11 - 18 i can say most certainly yes they do
ttcycle
Cycling Excusiast
Also due to head out but I find it strange than I'm classed with anybody as a usual suspect.
Moving on:
Unless you missed the subtlety in my post:
Characterising women who drink as not safe against the behaviour of men whether drunk or not really does do a disservice to both men and women.
Firstly, the sexism against women is that they need protecting, is there ever gong to be any moralising about men need protecting after a drunken night out. Now why is this?
Secondly, painting a bleaker than bleak picture of men as dangerous does them a disservice.
God forbid people men and women may actually want to go out and have a shag.
Yes alcohol does complicate things, this is why I recognise that as a topic is worth talking about
What is crass though is the very quick jumping to when women and alcohol are mentioned issues of sexual assault, girls crying wolf and victim blaming. She got drunk so it's her fault is subtly being reinforced as an idea. Rape and sexual assault doesn't have to take place when both sexes are tanked up. It doesn't even have to happen on a night out or when someone is dressed up.
Talk about the drinking but please think about why you are making value judgements about girls and why you don't make those value judgement about men/boys in the same way. Please consider how in society the stereotype of men and women may inform the above.
Can we leave the stereotypes at the door? Maybe discuss alcohol usein this country? I wanted to respond to Montyvedas post about drinking culture in the UK and how differs tithe continent and other countries. Why is this? However if the same reductive characters of the sexes are trotted out time and time again, it would make it a redundant conversation. Really as the case would be, we wouldn't be talking about drinking but actually making judgements and revealing what our attitudes are about men and women. This is why I asked crank to illuminate, he hasn't done so.
Talk about either but let's be clear we are either talking about drinking in UK or UK youth or we are talking about gender roles, if you cone up with stereotypes I know I will question you on their validity.
I could say more but Im off out
Moving on:
Unless you missed the subtlety in my post:
Characterising women who drink as not safe against the behaviour of men whether drunk or not really does do a disservice to both men and women.
Firstly, the sexism against women is that they need protecting, is there ever gong to be any moralising about men need protecting after a drunken night out. Now why is this?
Secondly, painting a bleaker than bleak picture of men as dangerous does them a disservice.
God forbid people men and women may actually want to go out and have a shag.
Yes alcohol does complicate things, this is why I recognise that as a topic is worth talking about
What is crass though is the very quick jumping to when women and alcohol are mentioned issues of sexual assault, girls crying wolf and victim blaming. She got drunk so it's her fault is subtly being reinforced as an idea. Rape and sexual assault doesn't have to take place when both sexes are tanked up. It doesn't even have to happen on a night out or when someone is dressed up.
Talk about the drinking but please think about why you are making value judgements about girls and why you don't make those value judgement about men/boys in the same way. Please consider how in society the stereotype of men and women may inform the above.
Can we leave the stereotypes at the door? Maybe discuss alcohol usein this country? I wanted to respond to Montyvedas post about drinking culture in the UK and how differs tithe continent and other countries. Why is this? However if the same reductive characters of the sexes are trotted out time and time again, it would make it a redundant conversation. Really as the case would be, we wouldn't be talking about drinking but actually making judgements and revealing what our attitudes are about men and women. This is why I asked crank to illuminate, he hasn't done so.
Talk about either but let's be clear we are either talking about drinking in UK or UK youth or we are talking about gender roles, if you cone up with stereotypes I know I will question you on their validity.
I could say more but Im off out
The whole point of my post was in reply to an issue of consent, and the validity of this when drunk.
It is applicable as judgement is impaired. How many office parties (now there is a sterotype!) have been the subject of disciplinary action, red faces and regrets the following day?
My point is that there is a responsibility for safe sexual practice that is blurred and eroded by alcohol intake. Nothing at all to do with gender stereotyping or victim blaming - Both males and females have the responsibility and both are affected by the outcomes. In a drunken encounter there is equal and unequivocal responsibilty to avoid STDs pregnancy etc.
I wholeheartedly agree with this statement which is why I only drop in occasionally to see if the standard has improved. I asked a basic question once and wouldn't dare to ask anything again because of the 'mob mentality' that answered it but 'pack of hyenas' describes it more accurately.
I have never understood why some people have been banned yet others are allowed to remain to spew forth a malicious diatribe and then claim that the recipient is at fault for taking offence.
Does the bit in bold constitue a malicious diatribe or have you created a paradox?
The 'usual suspects' just for a collective name have actually created a paradox by mixing the OP and Globalti's post. Crankarm was raising the point of the safety of the women and societys' acceptance of firstly women drinking to excess so openly & secondly with so little respect for themselves.
The point is that a lot of us, male, female, neither, both, have been trashed. Gender is irrelevant.
Two drunken women encounter a group of 5 males (drunk or sober it matters not) how safe are they? One man (drunk/sober) encounters 5 very drunk females (who in the real scenario are described as 'very forward ..... & aggressive) he is the one who is likely to be the victim of sexual assault unless he has gone equipped with a means to subdue a number of people.
Words fail me; if only you had the same problem
Rape victims are not exclusively female - the majority are as is the case in other 'dominance/power/controlling' crimes which are all heinous and which society still tries to ignore. Before you all tear this reply to pieces which seems your sole purpose responding to anything, ask yourselves one question "How qualified am I to comment on this' because without 1st hand experience your opinion is worthless and it's something you should maybe bear in mind before writing a vitriolic reply just to appear superior and witty.
Open goals are irresistable
OP
OP
Crankarm
Guru
- Location
- Nr Cambridge
I am pleased that others have posted moving the topic along so we have some sort of reasonable discussion.
Wrt to the rather inebriated young ladies I encountered on friday evening, one of whom collapsed in front of me on the pavement, my intentions were purely honourable. Firstly I was immeditately concerned as to whether this girl was actually ok as she had fallen quite heavily and looked totally out of it fumbling around on the pavement. Secondly I was totally shocked by what I saw. How many here would have helped a drunk stranger up out of the gutter? I suspect many would have crossed the road.
Wrt to those claiming sexism and mysogeny in my OP all I can say is go get a life
. If I can be accused of anything then it is flippancy but then this is practically laughable given the seriousness of the real content of my OP - why young girls/women feel the need to get totally plastered. If I was either mysogenistic or sexist I would not have been concerned for the girls' welfare or helped one of them up from the pavement. TTcycle - so a man who holds a door open for a woman is a sexist mysogenist 
.
I still find it shocking that two genuinely attractive ladies can let themselves get so drunk that they 1)make a scene of themselves. I am not talking merry but totally sh1tfaced. 2)Drink so much to put themselves at risk either from hurting themselves ie falling over as they stumble home or more seriously put themselves in a state making it easy for a malevolent person to take advantage of them. I just don't understand. Perhaps they lost their chaperone.
The PC brigade want it both ways. They want women to be able to go out and get plastered just like men which is fine if that's what they want to do but then they are shocked when some drunken chap or even sober psycho takes advantage of them. The ironic thing is the PC whingers probably wouldn't even be out on the town drinking to oblivion ending up on the floor of the toilets or on the pavement starring in the next episode of Police Camera Action. Bizarre.
Just to balance things out, saturday night 4 very drunk chaps werewalking staggering down the High Street in very high spirits, shouting, chanting, abusing, kicking at anything that caught their fancy. Yes some men do drink to excess but which we all know and frankly expect but the frequency of young women now trying to emulate men is frankly shocking. I have seen other very drunk ladies staggering home so the very drunk two young gurls I encountered on friday was not an isolated occurrence. This after noon 2:30pm going to the supermarket I saw two girls 16-17 years old walking toward me drinking from tins of Carlsberg lager.
Wrt to the rather inebriated young ladies I encountered on friday evening, one of whom collapsed in front of me on the pavement, my intentions were purely honourable. Firstly I was immeditately concerned as to whether this girl was actually ok as she had fallen quite heavily and looked totally out of it fumbling around on the pavement. Secondly I was totally shocked by what I saw. How many here would have helped a drunk stranger up out of the gutter? I suspect many would have crossed the road.
Wrt to those claiming sexism and mysogeny in my OP all I can say is go get a life
. If I can be accused of anything then it is flippancy but then this is practically laughable given the seriousness of the real content of my OP - why young girls/women feel the need to get totally plastered. If I was either mysogenistic or sexist I would not have been concerned for the girls' welfare or helped one of them up from the pavement. TTcycle - so a man who holds a door open for a woman is a sexist mysogenist .I still find it shocking that two genuinely attractive ladies can let themselves get so drunk that they 1)make a scene of themselves. I am not talking merry but totally sh1tfaced. 2)Drink so much to put themselves at risk either from hurting themselves ie falling over as they stumble home or more seriously put themselves in a state making it easy for a malevolent person to take advantage of them. I just don't understand. Perhaps they lost their chaperone.
The PC brigade want it both ways. They want women to be able to go out and get plastered just like men which is fine if that's what they want to do but then they are shocked when some drunken chap or even sober psycho takes advantage of them. The ironic thing is the PC whingers probably wouldn't even be out on the town drinking to oblivion ending up on the floor of the toilets or on the pavement starring in the next episode of Police Camera Action. Bizarre.
Just to balance things out, saturday night 4 very drunk chaps were
Glow worm
Legendary Member
- Location
- Near Newmarket
I don't see how their attractiveness has any bearing on things Crankarm. Are you saying if they were boot ugly it would be fine?
OP
OP
Crankarm
Guru
- Location
- Nr Cambridge
No I am not, but you are.
funnymummy
A Dizzy M.A.B.I.L
- Location
- Lancing West Sussex
I'll pass this paragraph on to the women I know that can drink men under the table. Having read it it will educate their endocrine systems to behave in a more gender specific manner and give the fellers a fighting chance in the drink offs.
That'll be me then
I'd rather not re-live my teenage years, it's taken me the last 20 to redeem myself from some of the stunts I pulled...But you can be my friend now
Glow worm
Legendary Member
- Location
- Near Newmarket
Easy tiger - it was a question rather than a statement! I'm not having a dig C - just trying to get a handle on where you are coming from on this. Surely substance and alcohol abuse among young people is something of enormous concern, as you quite rightly point out, but irrespective of sex (and certainly irrespective of how fit they are)?! I would just have left the attractive bit out myself as it's irrelevant that's all.
ttcycle
Cycling Excusiast
Crank when did I mention anything about opening doors? Please quit with the red herrings as that's an old and rather tired idea to be frank. Deal with the issue at hand not door opening unless it's relevant.
Keeping this short and sweet.
You say in your post that group of drunken men kicking things about is to be expected. Can I press you on why this is expected? I also ask as glow worm asks that what has the attractiveness of the girls got to do with them being drunk.
Apart from that rather telling viewpoint, I have to point to you is you haven't really answered any of the things asked of you.
Keeping this short and sweet.
You say in your post that group of drunken men kicking things about is to be expected. Can I press you on why this is expected? I also ask as glow worm asks that what has the attractiveness of the girls got to do with them being drunk.
Apart from that rather telling viewpoint, I have to point to you is you haven't really answered any of the things asked of you.
