Engine off in car park.

[Brandane]

Isn't leaving a car unattended with the engine running quite a serious offence

Not quite serious, but an offence none the less:

Road Vehicles Construction and Use Regulations 1986, reg. 107

Leaving motor vehicles unattended
107. (1) Save as provided in paragraph (2), no person shall leave, or cause or permit to be left, on a road a motor vehicle which is not attended by a person licensed to drive it unless the engine is stopped and any parking brake with which the vehicle is required to be equipped is effectively set.

(2) The requirement specified in paragraph (1) as to the stopping of the engine shall not apply in respect of a vehicle—

(a)being used for ambulance, fire brigade or police purposes; or

(b)in such a position and condition as not to be likely to endanger any person or property and engaged in an operation which requires its engine to be used to—

(i)drive machinery forming part of, or mounted on, the vehicle and used for purposes other than driving the vehicle; or

(ii)maintain the electrical power of the batteries of the vehicle at a level required for driving that machinery or apparatus.

(3) In this regulation “parking brake” means a brake fitted to a vehicle in accordance with requirement 16 or 18 in Schedule 3

 

[Mr Celine]

Isn't leaving a car unattended with the engine running quite a serious offence @CopperCyclist? A friend's Jack Russell knocked his automatic car into drive once while barking at a passing cat, or so he says (the car owner, not the Jack Russell). The car hit a lamp post.

I thought the thread was about parking, not barking.

Hard to tell though.

 

[Arch]

The best one is people leaving the car running with nobody in it when they go into the corner shop to get a paper in the morning..see it all the time. Bonkers !

A couple of weeks ago we were working in a street and there was a car sitting, engine running, completely unattended - eventually it transpired that a chap was swapping two cars in parking spaces, but had just buggered off inside for some reason. If I'd been minded, I could have just jumped in and driven off.

Then only on Thursday, we came out of a courtyard we service, to find the narrow street blocked by a car in the middle of the road, engine running, driver's door open (thus widening the blockage) by 50%. As I sneaked past, half on the pavement (I know, I know...) the driver returned and I commented through my open window how good her parking was. Her excuse was that she was trying to access a garage entrance further down, but there was another vehicle blocking it, so she'd gone to have a go at them. I couldn't be bothered to suggest she might have at least pulled to one side or the other and shut her door. I don't suppose she got the irony of blocking the road in order to complain about someone blocking the road. But again, it would have been the work of a few seconds to get in and drive off.

And I bet her insurance company would have a field day with that one!

 

[Arch]

I had an auto mini, and don't remember having to put the footbrake on, but it was 20 years ago.

 

[swansonj]

Is the criterion about "engine running" in relation to using a phone actually in the original rules? I seem to recall something about the original definition being "in control" of the vehicle, and that had been interpreted by police and courts as having the engine running?

 

[screenman]

Is the criterion about "engine running" in relation to using a phone actually in the original rules? I seem to recall something about the original definition being "in control" of the vehicle, and that had been interpreted by police and courts as having the engine running?

You point it out a lot better than I did.

 

[Bromptonaut]

It's a long time since I owned an automatic, but I don't remember that. However, I did say that was his story - and one should never let facts get in the way of a good one .

My memory of cars goes back to my Dad's in the seventies and I'd say footbrake/transmission interlock is a modern innovation. Even where it's present you can probably move between neutral/N and Drive.

Remember being in a relative's Audi c 1977. I was in back and she was in front passenger seat, her husband left the engine running and autobox in Neutral while he nipped back into house for something he'd forgotten. She then moved and nudged the the selector into Drive - the car began to creep forward. I leaned forward, nudged it back to N and firmly applied the handbrake which he'd not done.

She was of the generation where Ladies didn't drive and hadn't a clue - all she could do was panic and shout for her husband.

 

[Arch]

[QUOTE 2906021, member: 45"]I think minis in those days had a button on the side of the gear knob.[/quote]

Possibly, I don't remember. I know it had a weather safety feature. In ice, snow, rain, fog or sometimes heat, it refused to start, thus preventing me driving in dangerous conditions....

 

[400bhp]

Isn't leaving a car unattended with the engine running quite a serious offence @CopperCyclist? A friend's Jack Russell knocked his automatic car into drive once while barking at a passing cat, or so he says (the car owner, not the Jack Russell). The car hit a lamp post.

My next door neighbour does this at 7am. Starts her noisy effin diseasel and leaves it running whilst she swans off back in the house doign god knows what.

I often leave the house at the same time and am soooo tempted to drive the bleeding thing roud the corner, trouble is she doesn't have a cycle carrier.

Feckwit almost mowed me down on Friday - appaling driver too.

 

[slowmotion]

I may have misunderstood but do driving laws apply in a private (McDonalds) car park. If I owned a field, can't I drive round it doing handbrake turns at 90 mph, absolutely shoot-faced on absinthe, yelling into my mobile? I was rather hoping The Police might leave me alone.

 

[slowmotion]

Yes, and no. It depends on whether or not there is routine public access.

I'll have to lock the gate then...

 

[vernon]

Seeing that no one seems to have been bothered to look up 'the rules'....

I may have misunderstood but do driving laws apply in a private (McDonalds) car park. If I owned a field, can't I drive round it doing handbrake turns at 90 mph, absolutely s***-faced on absinthe, yelling into my mobile? I was rather hoping The Police might leave me alone.

You might find the answer below:

Most of the provisions apply on all roads throughout Great Britain, although there are some exceptions. The definition of a road in England and Wales is ‘any highway and any other road to which the public has access and includes bridges over which a road passes’ (RTA 1988 sect 192(1)). In Scotland, there is a similar definition which is extended to include any way over which the public have a right of passage (R(S)A 1984 sect 151(1)).

It is important to note that references to ‘road’ therefore generally include footpaths, bridleways and cycle tracks, and many roadways and driveways on private land (including many car parks). In most cases, the law will apply to them and there may be additional rules for particular paths or ways. Some serious driving offences, including drink-driving offences, also apply to all public places, for example public car parks.

from: https://www.gov.uk/using-the-road-159-to-203/the-road-user-and-the-law

 

[vernon]

I'll have to lock the gate then...

That is one of the deciding factors, gates and barriers that exclude the public.

 

[slowmotion]

That is one of the deciding factors, gates and barriers that exclude the public.

I suppose you could argue that a private car park that charges for parking ( price of admission: buying a burger) is not actually available to the general public.

[wannabe lawyer clutching at straws mode] OFF

 

[slowmotion]

I'm sure you could argue that

If I was being paid handsomely for grasping at straws, I most certainly would put forward my learned opinion.