Given up on tubeless

[Domus]

Moved to tubeless on my winter / tourer last summer after two tiny punctures on tour in France. I figured the two I had would have been no problem for sealant as they were microscopic wire fragments. After a 50 Km ride in Rossendale last week I found the rear tyre down at 20 psi. Re inflated and heard a leak right in the crown of the tyre which the sealant could not seal, tried a plug, still leaking. Removed the tyre to patch on the inside, what a blooming mess. Loads of vulcanising cement applied and left for a coffee break, patch applied and clamped for an hour or so. Tyre re fitted but could not for the life of me get it to seat even using my compressed air line. So after much faffing and swearing fitted a tube and rode 80+ Kms on Sunday. Monday morning went to clean the bike and the rear tyre was completely flat. After checking the tyre several times I could not find any foreign object, checked the rim, the rim tape had a very tiny nick on the edge and was sticking out with a sharp edge. The tubeless tape was binned the rim cleaned again and Shimano blue tape fitted and a new tube inserted. This morning I did the front. The faff and mess was bad enough in a dry garage I shudder trying something similar out on the road in the cold and wet.

 

[13 rider]

With 2 road bikes 1 tubeless 1 not I have a foot in both camps . Wether I've been lucky but I've done 25000 miles on the tubeless one without ever stopping at the side of the road ,no plugs used . I find setting up new tubeless tyres easy however once they are used they become much more difficult to reseat I try everything to unseat as little bead as possible once past the initial set up . When I fit a new tyre I also always change the rim tape and valve as a precaution
A question did you periodically top up your sealant ?

 

[Drago]

Despite the performance and comfort benefits (which were a bit limited for me as my lard weight means I cant go too mucn lower on the pressures without causing problems) I also never felt it was worth the faff either. Don't think I lasted a year before going back.

 

[geocycle]

Out of interest what size tyres were you using? I’ve had a lot of problems with trying to get 28 mm and smaller tubeless to work at pressures 60-80 psi. Worms to plug bigger holes get spat out and ive struggled to get darts in at the roadside. But the 38 mm tyres have been good so far. My current theory is tubeless is better at lower pressures in bigger tyres.

 

[Domus]

A question did you periodically top up your sealant ?

Yes, with a syringe through the valve. As you say seating new was quite easy but I found it impossible after.

Out of interest what size tyres were you using?

32 mm Panaracer GKs

 

[Ian H]

I've been tubeless for over four years now, first on 38mm Panaracers, and lately also on 25mm GP5000s. In that time I've put in tubes a couple of times at the roadside, with very little more difficulty than for replacing a tube. I've plugged two or three holes, and patched a tyre. Mostly it's no more difficult than tubes (I have other bikes still with tubes for comparison), very often easier. Mess? Very little if you're just a bit careful.

 

[wafter]

My current theory is tubeless is better at lower pressures in bigger tyres.

Indeed, all else being equal this is a given. Tubeless makes a lot of sense on an MTB - where you're more likely to encounter a puncture and due to the high volume low pressure tyres tubeless is more likely to seal.

I think the push for road tubeless only serves to illustrate how desperate manufactures are to push anything on us if it keeps us spending. My road and touring bikes run middling tyres in terms of puncture protection and in about 3.5k miles between the two of them I've had one puncture; which was entirely my fault. I see zero value in going tubeless on either of these bikes.

Conversely the gravel bike has had something like 11 over about 4.5k miles (the vast majority being picked up off-road) so tubeless would make a lot more sense.

Yes, with a syringe through the valve. As you say seating new was quite easy but I found it impossible after.

What was the viscosity of the sealant like when you took the tyre off? It needs to be pretty mobile to get to the affected area quickly. I think breaking its behaviour down to "fine" and "dried out" over-simplifies the situation.

Conceivably as it dries out it becomes more viscous (so less effective at getting to where it needs to be) and while adding more will thin it out again, it will remain thicker than original thanks to the greater percentage of solids present.

 

[mangid]

I've come across enough riders stuck at side of road who are waiting to be picked up after their tubeless systems have failed to really not see the point :-) Couple of spare tubes, patches, and you're very unlikely to find yourself in the same situation.

 

[mustang1]

I heard the results for tubeless are a lot better at lower psi large tyres. So think MTB stuff or wide gravel side tyres. Not saying they won't work with road tyres, just that I have heard more bad news with slim tyres than with large tyres.

 

[wafter]

I've come across enough riders stuck at side of road who are waiting to be picked up after their tubeless systems have failed to really not see the point :-) Couple of spare tubes, patches, and you're very unlikely to find yourself in the same situation.

You can always carry a spare tube, but obviously stuffing it into a tubeless tyre is going to be more of a pain than just replacing a normal tube due to the presence of the sealant, need to remove the valve and potentially tighter tyre fit on the rim.

Rightly or wrongly I tend to view tubeless as making the situation more extreme - small punctures potentially become a non-issue while those it can't instantly fix are more of a ballache..

 

[fossyant]

I've never bothered. My MTB is running tubeless wheels and tyres, but it's got tubes in. It's the mess, and potential mess if you 'burp' the tyre. I don't get enough punctures across the five bikes I have. I probably had two punctures last year - big piece of glass through the commuter's tyre (tubeless won't have helped in this case) and one on the CX bike - big thorn. Just doesn't seem worth the expense and faff setting up.

 

[Alex321]

I heard the results for tubeless are a lot better at lower psi large tyres. So think MTB stuff or wide gravel side tyres. Not saying they won't work with road tyres, just that I have heard more bad news with slim tyres than with large tyres.

The issue really is that most road riders expect to be using tyre pressures that tubeless really doesn't work with.

Even some of the tubeless ready road tyres specify a minimum pressure that is too high for them to really self seal or for plugs to work. I find that anything above about 60psi is too high, and that is after trying it with Hutchison Fusion 5 tubeless ready tyres, that specified a minimum pressure of 75psi. I could not get a plug to stay in at that pressure. It usually blew out at just above 60.

 

[wafter]

The issue really is that most road riders expect to be using tyre pressures that tubeless really doesn't work with.

Even some of the tubeless ready road tyres specify a minimum pressure that is too high for them to really self seal or for plugs to work. I find that anything above about 60psi is too high, and that is after trying it with Hutchison Fusion 5 tubeless ready tyres, that specified a minimum pressure of 75psi. I could not get a plug to stay in at that pressure. It usually blew out at just above 60.

60psi in road tyres isn't a lot though, is it? I'm running more than that in the (less loaded) front tyre of my tourer, and that's on 32s..

 

[Sharky]

The horror stories you get with tubeless vs the benefits has deterred me from making the switch.

 

[Alex321]

60psi in road tyres isn't a lot though, is it? I'm running more than that in the (less loaded) front tyre of my tourer, and that's on 32s..

I know. That is the point I was making with "The issue really is that most road riders expect to be using tyre pressures that tubeless really doesn't work with."