helmets and high viz

[Slick]

I hadn't watched that video before, but yes, it's fascinating.
'Less tan 1% of Dutch cyclists wear a helmet, yet they have the lowest incidence of cycling fatalities.'
It's part of their way of live. He says, 'While cycling they dress for the destination, not the journey.'
I lived in the Netherlands for a couple of years - and it really is cycling heaven. To be honest, while there you take it for granted after a while, and the only real chance of an accident is your own stupidity (like my cycling into a major roadworks hole!).
It's only when you go somewhere else and compare back, that you realize just how good it is.

That was a stat that stood out for me as well.

I did a very small mini tour in the Netherlands before covid and the first leg was Imjuiden to Utrecht and I was gobsmacked.

It actually started to get embarrassing as I stood in awe like a typical tourist except I was staring at the bike parks.

Really should have went back this year.

 

[Slick]

I'm very much aware that I live in a comparatively bike friendly part of an increasingly bike friendly country, so my perception of risk will be different to the UK. It was certainly a shock when I visited the "cycle city" of York in summer, and realised how far behind the UK really is.

My experience in Germany is that most people don't wear a helmet, apart from children, sports cyclists, or very inexperienced cyclists; my observations tally with those of @Drago that many helmet wearers are best given a wide berth.

Another reason people may ride less if there are mandatory helmet laws is the cost; my clients on income support rarely if ever wear helmets because they are an extra expense for people who have to watch every Euro, and for whom a 95€ bike is a big investment; having to pay for more equipment would make cycling prohibitively expensive.

To be fair, my perception its much the same here amongst people who don't have the disposable income and just use a BSO to get around because its quicker than walking.

I'm not sure about giving people who make a different choice to me need a wide berth, everyone to their own for me.

 

[Slick]

Motorists shout at me quite regularly, enquiring where my helmet is.

I always thank them for noticing.

I actually had quite a good discussion like that with a taxi driver on a dual carriageway approaching a roundabout at 6am.

Surreal to say the least.

 

[Andy in Germany]

I'm not sure about giving people who make a different choice to me need a wide berth, everyone to their own for me.

It's more that I find a Helmet if often a sign of an inexperienced and/or wobbly cyclist who is likely to turn or brake without warning, so I give them extra space.

This may of course be 'worse' here because cyclists have less need to learn the roadcraft I learned in the UK, as we have infrastructure that keeps people safe, as seen below:

I think that's the point Boardmann is making: This bridge in Freiburg is crossed by 10 000 cyclists a day. Infrastructure keeps cyclists safe and encourages cycling, which in turn helps in many other areas like health and reducing pollution. Helmets don't.

 

[MontyVeda]

Motorists shout at me quite regularly, enquiring where my helmet is.

I always thank them for noticing.

I've never had a motorist shout at me for my lack of helmet. Where do all these concerned motorists live?

 

[vickster]

Where do all these concerned motorists live?

In anecdote-land?

 

[Deleted member 1258]

I've never had a motorist shout at me for my lack of helmet. Where do all these concerned motorists live?

When I was riding I experienced that, but it didn't happen very often.

 

[Andy in Germany]

By a happy coincidence, someone has just made a video of Freiburg, showing how safe bicycle infrastructure fits into making a city liveable. the bike bridge and RadStation I photographed above are featured:

 

[Ian H]

A few people have asked, mostly other cyclists.

 

[Sharky]

I've never had a motorist shout at me for my lack of helmet. Where do all these concerned motorists live?

One such motorist overtook me when I was riding our club 10. He could see I was very overheated and sweating a lot with effort. He very kindly turned his windscreen washer on as he passed me to cool me down.

 

[All uphill]

I get that being a novice bike rider in the UK is very challenging and understand the tendency to ride in the gutter, or on the pavement, and to dress up in lots of shiny plastic.

As @Drago says I find common sense unhelpful; the more assertively (but never aggressively) I ride the better I get along with other road users. Clear signals in good time, good positioning and good all round awareness work for me.

 

[MontyVeda]

I get that being a novice bike rider in the UK is very challenging and understand the tendency to ride in the gutter, or on the pavement, and to dress up in lots of shiny plastic.

As @Drago says I find common sense unhelpful; the more assertively (but never aggressively) I ride the better I get along with other road users. Clear signals in good time, good positioning and good all round awareness work for me.

in other words, (so called) common sense is no substitute for road sense

 

[ianrauk]

I've never had a motorist shout at me for my lack of helmet. Where do all these concerned motorists live?

It's happened to me too...a lot over the years. In London. But not only idiot motons, other cyclists too sometimes feel the need to not mind their own beeswax.

 

[gzoom]

It’s alright for CB to ride thro London on their lovely cycle lanes it’s another thing here mixing it with traffic who don’t give a damn about the cyclist.

There is a fundamental difference in culture on how cyclists are perceived in the UK. Essentially many drivers don't see us as 'human', especially when wearing high viz and helmet.

I had two drivers shout at me on Friday because they viewed me undertaking them whilst I was in a bus/cycle lane as 'ridiculous'. You could literally see the 'hate' in their eyes, I suspect if no witness around neither would give a 2nd thought to running me off the road.....In their eyes I was almost certainly seen as nothing more than road kill that shouldn't be on the road.

I really have mixed views on cycling in the real world these days. I enjoy the excerise (even on an eBike ), its great way to start/end a working day versus stuck in traffic, but there is a very real risk to health/life on UK roads. If my life was just my own to worry about the risk is 'OK', but I have a family and it worries me about the impact on them from any cycling related RTA.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1369847823001018

 

[Mo1959]

There is a fundamental difference in culture on how cyclists are perceived in the UK. Essentially many drivers don't see us as 'human', especially when wearing high viz and helmet.

I had two drivers shout at me on Friday because they viewed me undertaking them whilst I was in a bus/cycle lane as 'ridiculous'. You could literally see the 'hate' in their eyes, I suspect if no witness around neither would give a 2nd thought to running me off the road.....In their eyes I was almost certainly seen as nothing more than road kill that shouldn't be on the road.

I really have mixed views on cycling in the real world these days. I enjoy the excerise (even on an eBike ), its great way to start/end a working day versus stuck in traffic, but there is a very real risk to health/life on UK roads. If my life was just my own to worry about the risk is 'OK', but I have a family and it worries me about the impact on them from any cycling related RTA.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1369847823001018

Starting to feel the same. My cycling has gone from several thousand miles per year to gradually reducing over the last five years to just a handful of rides. The ever increasing traffic and impatience and aggression have finally got to me.