HR Training

[V1nyl]

Hi, I am a 50 year old cyclist who has been riding for just over two years. More than a lesiure rider, however not a racer. Approx 3K per year (Road bike only).

I have a couple of questions regarding HR & Zone training.

I understand that we are all different and that using some general equations when analysing inputs and outputs can be flawed. However and to get to the point.

I have worked out that my max HR using the straight 220 - age is approx 170, albeit it I have only seen 168 when out riding. My resting HR is between 45 and 50. Sitting here composing this message with HR monitor strapped to chest(sad I know) is 50.

Question 1 - My riding partner who is only 1 year younger at 49, possible other factor is he is 14 stone and I am 11 stone 10 pound, when comparing garmin outputs for the same ride over two hours his average is 157 with a max of 185 and mine is average 127 and max 162. Why is there such a difference?

Question 2 - When out riding in the right company (people who are just a little better) I can record average HR of 148 and a max of 166, which is a little better, albeit I am not sure how effcetive this is for my progression towards being fitter, stonger and therfore a little faster. When riding in doors (I have both a turbo trainer, with winter bike and a static spin bike) I find it very difficult to get my HR up around the 140 - 150 mark unless I get out of the saddle and simualte climbing. I can work around 140-145 for about 10 minutes, howevre I cannot get this level sitting in the saddle, no matter how fast I spin or what resistence I push. Can you throw any light on why this maybe the case.

Any helps would be appreciated.

Stewart

 

[rockyraccoon]

Max HR is not age related and it shouldn't be calculated by that age formula. Have a look at this article from Joe Fiel: Quick Guide To Setting Zones

 

[black'n'yellow]

I have worked out that my max HR using the straight 220 - age is approx 170, albeit it I have only seen 168 when out riding. My resting HR is between 45 and 50. Sitting here composing this message with HR monitor strapped to chest(sad I know) is 50.

170 is almost certainly not your max HR. The 220 formula does not work for the majority of people. The only way to be certain of your individual max is to test it.

Question 1 - My riding partner who is only 1 year younger at 49, possible other factor is he is 14 stone and I am 11 stone 10 pound, when comparing garmin outputs for the same ride over two hours his average is 157 with a max of 185 and mine is average 127 and max 162. Why is there such a difference?

You cannot compare individual HR readings - regardless of age. They simply will not compare.

Question 2 - When out riding in the right company (people who are just a little better) I can record average HR of 148 and a max of 166, which is a little better, albeit I am not sure how effcetive this is for my progression towards being fitter, stonger and therfore a little faster. When riding in doors (I have both a turbo trainer, with winter bike and a static spin bike) I find it very difficult to get my HR up around the 140 - 150 mark unless I get out of the saddle and simualte climbing. I can work around 140-145 for about 10 minutes, howevre I cannot get this level sitting in the saddle, no matter how fast I spin or what resistence I push. Can you throw any light on why this maybe the case.
Any helps would be appreciated.

Again, HR on turbo and HR on the road do not really compare. Take a look in the health & fitness forum - there are a number of recent threads in there which should help with your understanding.

 

[V1nyl]

170 is almost certainly not your max HR. The 220 formula does not work for the majority of people. The only way to be certain of your individual max is to test it.




You cannot compare individual HR readings - regardless of age. They simply will not compare.




Again, HR on turbo and HR on the road do not really compare. Take a look in the health & fitness forum - there are a number of recent threads in there which should help with your understanding.

Can I test for my max using the static spin bike and my HR monitor?

 

[black'n'yellow]

Can I test for my max using the static spin bike and my HR monitor?

probably, but if (as you said earlier) you have trouble raising your HR on the trainer, then it might be more sensible to do the max HR test on the road.

 

[V1nyl]

Sound reasonable. I would like to have a go on the static bike. I can get the HR up if I simulate climbing. The more I think about it then I can only get my HR up over 160 climbing on the road. This could be that I do not do many intervals on the road and ride faily steady, putting max effort into climbing. Could a sustained climbing effort on the static bike be used as a measure?

 

[black'n'yellow]

Sound reasonable. I would like to have a go on the static bike. I can get the HR up if I simulate climbing. The more I think about it then I can only get my HR up over 160 climbing on the road. This could be that I do not do many intervals on the road and ride faily steady, putting max effort into climbing. Could a sustained climbing effort on the static bike be used as a measure?

Anywhere that you could simulate a very hard 3-4min effort, with the last 30secs or so to be ridden at (or preferably beyond) your absolute, maximum effort, should see your HR rise to within a couple of beats of max. Make sure you are thoroughly warmed up for 30 mins or so before you try this. I'm also assuming that you do not have any underlying health problems which could be affected by such an intense session.

 

[V1nyl]

No OK, I can warm up well on the staic bike and then go really hard for 4 mins and then flat hard for 30-40 seconds and see the HR output. Thanks for the advice.

Stewart

 

[Herzog]

No OK, I can warm up well on the staic bike and then go really hard for 4 mins and then flat hard for 30-40 seconds and see the HR output. Thanks for the advice.

Stewart

Another method of max HR. From Pete Reed's Black Book (a bit old...6 gears):

1. The Test:
   Warm up briskly in a small gear for approx 10 minutes.
   Engage the big ring and the lowest of your top six gears (52x18?) And pedal at a consistent cadence of 95 RPM for 2 minutes
   Then change up one sprocket while maintaining the same revs.
   Continue by changing up one sprocket every two minutes until you cannot continue because of total exhaustion.
   This must be a 100% plus, all out effort.
   Change onto a small gear and keep your legs moving. Do not stop immediately the test finishes, it is extremely dangerous to do so.

Before actually reaching your true max you will have passed through a stage which is known by a number of names such as . . . The anaerobic, lactate or ventilatory threshold, or more commonly as the point at which we go into oxygen debt.
In most cases this will show up as a “leveling out” of the graph two or three minutes before you have reached max. Conconi called this the pulse deflection and it generally coincides with the heart rate at which the majority of cyclists are able to race for approx 30 minutes.
Always remember, your personal maximum heart rate could be anywhere between 160-220 beats per minute with a pulse deflection point of around 15 beats below your max.

 

[V1nyl]

Failed. Unable to get HR up beyond 150 on static bike. Either the cadence is to high or the gaering to hard to push for the 3 mins. Seems I can only get there by upping the resistence fopr climbing and this brings it up to 150 and I can hold it there. I have seen 160+ when climbing on my road bike, never over 168. At this HR I have fallen off my bike with exhaustion when climbing. I can only hold 164-168 for a few moments.

 

[fossyant]

You need a feck off hard hill that you have to keep climbing or fall off. Works.

 

[Crackle]

Take 168 as your max then and work your zones out from that. It'll only take a few weeks of riding to 'feel' if those zones work. it's a fairly common approach to take. Plus, whichever advice you read may use slightly different HR percentages and finding one which suits may take some experimenting anyway.

And once you've done all that, you can do what I did and think fark it, why bother!

 

[V1nyl]

That's the point. I have hard hill where I live and apporox 80 meters from the top I have fallen off with HR at 168 due to exhaustion. I just cannot turn the pedals anymore so an even bigger hill would maen I would fall off earlier at the same heart rate. The point I am trying to get to is what is my max HR. All the advice is great, however I know when I'm blown and I can reda my HR of my garmin stats once the ride is over. I have never gone above 168 and trust me I don't fall off my bike eaisly as I have had to many offs and injuries. So I think I will stick with 170 as my approx Max HR and work from there.

 

[V1nyl]

Good point Crackle. I use my HR and cadence senors on my bike to track progress. My real goal is to enjoy rdining a little fsater and to climb a little better.

 

[derrick]

Hi, I am a 50 year old cyclist who has been riding for just over two years. More than a lesiure rider, however not a racer. Approx 3K per year (Road bike only).

I have a couple of questions regarding HR & Zone training.

I understand that we are all different and that using some general equations when analysing inputs and outputs can be flawed. However and to get to the point.

I have worked out that my max HR using the straight 220 - age is approx 170, albeit it I have only seen 168 when out riding. My resting HR is between 45 and 50. Sitting here composing this message with HR monitor strapped to chest(sad I know) is 50.

Question 1 - My riding partner who is only 1 year younger at 49, possible other factor is he is 14 stone and I am 11 stone 10 pound, when comparing garmin outputs for the same ride over two hours his average is 157 with a max of 185 and mine is average 127 and max 162. Why is there such a difference?

Question 2 - When out riding in the right company (people who are just a little better) I can record average HR of 148 and a max of 166, which is a little better, albeit I am not sure how effcetive this is for my progression towards being fitter, stonger and therfore a little faster. When riding in doors (I have both a turbo trainer, with winter bike and a static spin bike) I find it very difficult to get my HR up around the 140 - 150 mark unless I get out of the saddle and simualte climbing. I can work around 140-145 for about 10 minutes, howevre I cannot get this level sitting in the saddle, no matter how fast I spin or what resistence I push. Can you throw any light on why this maybe the case.

Any helps would be appreciated.

Stewart

Have you got a link to the ride, was it logged on garmin connect.