Jeremy Vine.

[newfhouse]

Why do you believe that a lorry turning right would be travelling at any other speed than the speed he was overtaking in the twitter clip

All but the most foolhardy lorry driver would slow down for a sharp right turn whether traffic light controlled or not.

In answer to your question, inappropriate speed, I spend most of my road riding on roads that are probably less than 4M wide, it would be physically impossible to give 1.5M on all occasions, as long as the overtaker does it with consideration then it's something we outside of the centre of the universe live with.

London and its suburbs is of course famous for having no narrow streets whatsoever

The point is that a squishy human was doing something unwise such that there was a real risk of them being hurt. Like it or not, the driver has a responsibility to lessen the chances of that happening.

What is unacceptable is when I get overtaken with less than 0.5M by cars doing 60-70mph when they are doing it on purpose & have no reason to do so.

We can agree on that, although I’m curious about when you think they would have a reason to do so.

If the 1.5M rule is to be adhered to then that road needs to have the white line removed & made into a single lane.

I agree. I think the white line gives a false sense of both safety and entitlement.

 

[DRM]

Why do you believe that a lorry turning right would be travelling at any other speed than the speed he was overtaking in the twitter clip?

In answer to your question, inappropriate speed, I spend most of my road riding on roads that are probably less than 4M wide, it would be physically impossible to give 1.5M on all occasions, as long as the overtaker does it with consideration then it's something we outside of the centre of the universe live with. What is unacceptable is when I get overtaken with less than 0.5M by cars doing 60-70mph when they are doing it on purpose & have no reason to do so.

If the 1.5M rule is to be adhered to then that road needs to have the white line removed & made into a single lane.

I was going to reply, but @Phaeton has written what I was going to say, no point in repeating it, only a fool would ride so close to the white line on their right, my belief is this plod was trying to be a clever so & so who through lack of road craft has made the Alps out of a small pimple, he isn’t fit to be cycling on behalf of the met police and needs further training & experience, and was being deliberately provocative

 

[BoldonLad]

On this occasion it passed without causing injury. Are we saying that close passes are acceptable as long as no contact is made and that the white paint is not crossed? What is the point of the 1.5m guidance if 0.5m is normalised?

No.

 

[Deleted member 26715]

All but the most foolhardy lorry driver would slow down for a sharp right turn whether traffic light controlled or not.

I believe you are speaking from a point of zero experience of driving a HGV in traffic, as to why you have invented a sharp right turn I'm unsure, I said right turn, which could be at as little as 10 degrees

We can agree on that, although I’m curious about when you think they would have a reason to do so.

You would have to ask them not me

 

[DaveReading]

Is there a difference between a slow moving lorry passing stationary cyclists in order to turn right, and one that appears to be travelling at near the speed limit passing close to wobbly cyclists?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it was a slow-moving lorry. Unless you have evidence that it was travelling in excess of the 20 mph speed limit ?

 

[wiggydiggy]

Has no one else on here done the odd tactical wobble to try to discourage a driver from being a daffodil?

Not a wobble but I have taken a more primary position after a close pass, especially if I can hear another vehicle coming.

This may or may not be sensible, but I sometimes wonder if they even saw me before close passing so in my head me moving out makes me more visible.

I was lucky that my old commute although on a busy A Road was quite wide, a lot wider than the one in the original video and a lot of it you can pass with a 1.5m gap and not need to cross the centre line.

 

[newfhouse]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it was a slow-moving lorry. Unless you have evidence that it was travelling in excess of the 20 mph speed limit ?

I said:

one that appears to be travelling at near the speed limit

Like you, I can’t judge from the video if it was under or over the limit but that’s not the point at issue. It passed a poorly positioned but highly visible cyclist too close. That’s the problem here.

 

[mjr]

As @mjr has decided to ignore my question at Post 101 maybe you would like to answer it?

You made various incorrect extrapolations but ask no question in that post and I'm enjoying time with family and friends this weekend, plus preparing for bike week UK next week so maybe you can understand why I was not guessing your non question post wanted a reply.

 

[newfhouse]

I believe you are speaking from a point of zero experience of driving a HGV in traffic,

This is true.

as to why you have invented a sharp right turn I'm unsure, I said right turn, which could be at as little as 10 degrees

Yes it could. Nevertheless, a careful driver of any vehicle probably wouldn’t race through a traffic light controlled junction at the maximum permitted speed, whatever the angle.

 

[Deleted member 26715]

This is true.

Yes it could. Nevertheless, a careful driver of any vehicle probably wouldn’t race through a traffic light controlled junction at the maximum permitted speed, whatever the angle.

Where has the idea he was 'racing' come from?

You made various incorrect extrapolations but ask no question in that post and I'm enjoying time with family and friends this weekend, plus preparing for bike week UK next week so maybe you can understand why I was not guessing your non question post wanted a reply.

Okay

 

[newfhouse]

Where has the idea he was 'racing' come from?

It comes from turning through your invented junction at full speed. I accept that this is your fantasy scenario, not mine, so I may have missed a vital detail.

Are you sure we’d not be better focusing on things that definitely happened?

 

[Deleted member 26715]

Are you sure we’d not be better focusing on things that definitely happened?

By all means but we differ on that as well, I accept it's not a particularly good road layout, but I don't see that the driver did anything wrong, he didn't deviate from his path, he didn't cross any white lines, he didn't appear to be speeding.

In this layout of 2 separate lines I think it would be unrealistic to expect him to have waited behind this group of cyclists until such time s he could have overtaken with 1.5M clearance especially in a 20MPH zone. I don't like to victim blame but I do feel that the Police officer caused some of the perceived aggravation, his skills didn't appear to be as such that he should be given the duty of outrider.

Had there been bollards or a kerb between the 2 lanes the distances would not have changed, I do wonder had there been a kerb would the rider been as far out.

 

[newfhouse]

In this layout of 2 separate lines I think it would be unrealistic to expect him to have waited behind this group of cyclists until such time s he could have overtaken with 1.5M clearance especially in a 20MPH zone.

If I see a group of poorly positioned wobbly cyclists I try to give them more clearance than normal, not less, even if I am momentarily frustrated because they have cost me a few seconds of my day.

Nobody is perfect but simple mistakes should not be life threatening.

 

[winjim]

If I see a group of poorly positioned wobbly cyclists I try to give them more clearance than normal, not less, even if I am momentarily frustrated because they have cost me a few seconds of my day.

Nobody is perfect but simple mistakes should not be life threatening.

Where you see poorly positioned wobbly cyclists another driver might see a confident experienced police officer riding in a protective position. As such, one might assume that the police officer is expecting, and has given implied permission for, traffic to pass him relatively closely on the off side, while keeping that traffic at a greater distance from the inexperienced riders on his near side.

 

[newfhouse]

Where you see poorly positioned wobbly cyclists another driver might see a confident experienced police officer riding in a protective position. As such, one might assume that the police officer is expecting, and has given implied permission for, traffic to pass him relatively closely on the off side, while keeping that traffic at a greater distance from the inexperienced riders on his near side.

I think that’s quite a stretch, and one I hope I wouldn’t make.