MTB's without front derailleur, When/Why?

[Andy K]

Triples will be back in fashion soon, you just need to wait a few years.................

Yeah I think my current mtb will be ever more retro than it is now by then

 

[Andy K]

Also, extra clearance to stop chain ring strikes and not forgetting the all important aesthetics of the bike.

In terms of having one chainring can you get the same range and speed as what can be achieved with three?

 

[Smokin Joe]

In terms of having one chainring can you get the same range and speed as what can be achieved with three?

You can't get the same range, but 50*11 gives the same speed on a single as on a triple. Gearing is entirely personal, it all depends on the type of riding you do as to what suits.

With 11 and 12 speed cassettes becoming the standard now there is little call for triples, particularly on road bikes.

 

[fossyant]

On a side note, do you (or anyone else) ever hit the dropper post control by mistake, looking for a shifter that's no longer there?

I'm still 2 x 10 on the best MTB and have a dropper

 

[fossyant]

In terms of having one chainring can you get the same range and speed as what can be achieved with three?

Yes but bigger gaps. The low gears on a 1 x 12 are lower than my 2 x 10, so more spinny uphill which helps over technical terrain. If you are doing trail centres and techy stuff, 1x is easier to deal with, but if you are doing XC a fair bit, then 2x gives you closer ratios for flatter sections.

Unfortunately 12 speed cassettes are big bucks, but they do last if you look after them.

 

[Jody]

In terms of having one chainring can you get the same range and speed as what can be achieved with three?

Not really. You sacrifice some top end which doesn't really matter on the trails.

You still have a wide range but I find it spins out mid/high twenties.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Yes but bigger gaps. The low gears on a 1 x 12 are lower than my 2 x 10, so more spinny uphill which helps over technical terrain.

The low gear on my triple mountain bike was 16.8 gear inches. Not sure I’d want much lower than that for technical terrain.

 

[wafter]

I know a chap who used to work for a large aluminium extrusions company; one of their products being double-glazed window frames. I believe the standard finish was colourless anodising - as we all know a very hard and chemically inert coating.

Apparently the marketing muppets decided people wanted white windows but they couldn't anodise this colour so they powder coated them instead - a cheaper process yet they priced them higher due to perceived demand and they flew off the shelves.

Same applies here IMO - it's a marketing-led construct that's sold as a superior option (with a price to match) when actually it's cack.

 

[chriswoody]

The arrival of 1x systems has also allowed Mountain Bike manufacturers greater freedom in the way they design their bikes, especially full suspension bikes, because they no longer need to worry about accommodating the front changer. It's also a popular option on gravel bikes now because the lack of front changer allows for greater tire clearance. Out of curiosity the other month I offered up a spare front derailleur onto my Kona and was not surprised to see the cage fouls on my 47mm tires.

1x, like the other controversial topic, tubeless, is a fantastic option in the environment for which it was designed, off-road. Most of my rides are over 75% off-road and it's not uncommon to be riding hard packed gravel one moment and soft sand the next. The ability to change multiple gears at once, without worrying about also changing the front, is brilliant, it also means that the so-called gaps between the ratios is irrelevant because I need to change multiple cogs at once to keep momentum.

The one fly in the ointment was caused by just accepting the standard drivetrain specced by Kona, that is a 10 - 42 cassette married up to a 36 tooth chainring. I rode 400 odd kilometres and 8500m of ascent, through Slovenia on that set up and nearly killed myself. The lowest gear of 23 inches was far to high. I soon realised, while I couldn't change the rear cassette, (42 teeth is the max capacity of the shifter and MTB shifters won't play nicely with drop bar changers.) I could simply and cheaply change the front chainring. A replacement steel chainring for my RaceFace crankset is only 25 Euros, so I now have a 32 tooth for day to day riding and a 28 tooth for my off-road bikepacking trips. Below is a gear inch calculation for my original 36 tooth chainring, my current day to day set up of 32 and my touring set up of 28. Whilst I know not everyone will agree, for me, this is a brilliant set up and suits my riding perfectly.

 

[Smokin Joe]

Same applies here IMO - it's a marketing-led construct that's sold as a superior option (with a price to match) when actually it's cack.

It isn't sold as a superior option, it is sold as an altenative option. As I've said before, gearing choice is entirely personal and based on the type of riding I now do a single chainring suits me perfectly where as it would not have done ten years ago.

As for cost, I paid £28 quid for a single chainset with narrow/wide teeth and a tenner for a bottom bracket to convert my bike from a double.

 

[GuyBoden]

I know nothing about 1x12, so I'd ask the shop/manufacturer/designer a few questions:


What is the chainline line when using the extreme rear sprockets on a single chainring 1x12?

Has the BB length changed for a single chainrings 1x12 chainline?

If the BB length has not changed, has the frame design changed to accommodate a single chainring 1x12 chainline?

 

[bonzobanana]

I know nothing about 1x12, so I'd ask the shop/manufacturer/designer a few questions:


What is the chainline line when using the extreme rear sprockets on a single chainring 1x12?

Has the BB length changed for a single chainrings 1x12 chainline?

If the BB length has not changed, has the frame design changed to accommodate a single chainring 1x12 chainline?

I think the chainline is going to be pretty good in comparison to 2x or 3x when cross chaining or close to cross chaining. The single chainring should I assume sit near enough in the middle so you won't get the same extreme chain angles.

Also 1x allows for narrow wide teeth for better chain retention which can't have a front derailleur and of course if you are riding in fast changing terrain the simple up/down gear changing is ideal. It's definitely a competitive edge for off-road cyclists in my opinion.

However many people don't do serious off-roading with mountain bikes they just like mountain bike style bikes and use them for general riding and then the advantages of 1x are gone and its detrimental I would say to the experience.

One thing that is important to say is you can take a 3x or 2x mountain bike to 1x without issues but many 1x frames are really limited and can not be upgraded to 2x or 3x easily without a very bad chainline as the stays often flare out to accommodate bigger tyres. So you don't have the choice to go 2x or 3x later.

 

[GuyBoden]

I think the chainline is going to be pretty good in comparison to 2x or 3x when cross chaining or close to cross chaining. The single chainring should I assume sit near enough in the middle so you won't get the same extreme chain angles.

Also 1x allows for narrow wide teeth for better chain retention which can't have a front derailleur and of course if you are riding in fast changing terrain the simple up/down gear changing is ideal. It's definitely a competitive edge for off-road cyclists in my opinion.

However many people don't do serious off-roading with mountain bikes they just like mountain bike style bikes and use them for general riding and then the advantages of 1x are gone and its detrimental I would say to the experience.

One thing that is important to say is you can take a 3x or 2x mountain bike to 1x without issues but many 1x frames are really limited and can not be upgraded to 2x or 3x easily without a very bad chainline as the stays often flare out to accommodate bigger tyres. So you don't have the choice to go 2x or 3x later.

Many thanks, good info, so the 1x frame chainline is designed specifically for a single front chainring and wider tyres. Makes sense.


When using a front triple, the usual method is to use the small front ring with the large rear sprockets and the large front ring with the smallest rear sprockets to avoid a bad chainline.

 

[Jody]

Same applies here IMO - it's a marketing-led construct that's sold as a superior option (with a price to match) when actually it's cack.

I'm going to take a punt here and say non of your bikes are 1x and you aren't interested in them.

 

[presta]

I think there's a good reason why Shimano have stopped publishing the weight of their components: either they aren't any lighter or the difference is negligible.
If someone wants to post the weight of their 12sp, 34t, 10-51t Deore transmission, I'll post my Deore 9sp, 22/32/44, 11-34t.