Now the freaking school are at it!

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Siadwell, if you are doing say 20 mph and you fall of or have to do a sudden stop at what speed would your head hit the object, I would suggest at less than 20mph. Now does the helmet help the first 12mph or the second 12 mph.

The answer is the helmet might or might not help with the first 12mph (the jury is out on that one) but the second 12mph it doesn't help with and that does three times the damage of the first 12mph.
 
Perhaps you should be expressing concerns about the numbers of rowers you see who are not wearing lifejackets when afloat?:evil:

Yep, ejector crabs are not that uncommon in rowing and you really shouldn't rely on the child being able to swim unaided.
 
Abstract
Bicycling accidents cause many serious injuries and, in the United States, about 1300 deaths per year, mainly from head injuries. Safety helmets are widely recommended for cyclists, but convincing evidence of their effectiveness is lacking. Over one year we conducted a case-control study in which the case patients were 235 persons with head injuries received while bicycling, who sought emergency care at one of five hospitals. One control group consisted of 433 persons who received emergency care at the same hospitals for bicycling injuries not involving the head. A second control group consisted of 558 members of a large health maintenance organization who had had bicycling accidents during the previous year.
Seven percent of the case patients were wearing helmets at the time of their head injuries, as compared with 24 percent of the emergency room controls and 23 percent of the second control group. Of the 99 cyclists with serious brain injury only 4 percent wore helmets. In regression analyses to control for age, sex, income, education, cycling experience, and the severity of the accident, we found that riders with helmets had an 85 percent reduction in their risk of head injury (odds ratio, 0.15; 95 percent confidence interval, 0.07 to 0.29) and an 88 percent reduction in their risk of brain injury (odds ratio, 0.12; 95 percent confidence interval, 0.04 to 0.40).
We conclude that bicycle safety helmets are highly effective in preventing head injury. Helmets are particularly important for children, since they suffer the majority of serious head injuries from bicycling accidents. (N Engl J Med 1989;320:1361–7.)
Supported by the Foundation of Group Health Cooperative and a grant (CCR 49–002570) from the Centers for Disease Control.

Anyone who quotes Thompson, Rivara and Thompson's totally discredited paper as evidence helmets work clearly doesn't have the first clue about the subject. Even the authors have semi-disowned it. In summary they compared the head injuries in kids riding alone without helmets on deprived inner city roads with kids riding with helmets with their parents in middle class suburban parks and attributed the difference to helmets alone. Their data also shows that helmets prevent 75% of leg injuries too.

Now do you have any real evidence that helmets work?
 
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Norm

Guest
Thanks for answering that. As a family we have had a few hard landing on the head, funnily enough whilst training and not racing in each incidence. We have totally destroyed 3 helmets which I am sure helped prevent some head damage, however of course this I cannot be prove.
No problem. I am not anti-helmets. I am anti-compulsion. :thumbsup:

Strangely, the times that I've fallen off (both when riding off road) my head hasn't gone anywhere near the dirt whereas the times that the helmet has made a difference (such as the two above) I have not come off.

I'm a bit perverse like that. :thanks:

Yep, ejector crabs are not that uncommon in rowing and you really shouldn't rely on the child being able to swim unaided.
Last week was the first week in 2 months that no-one had capsized (they are starting from a low base!). I think that the air and water temperatures were the incentive to stay in the boat, though, as someone went in yesterday. :laugh:

Their data also shows that helmets prevent 75% of leg injuries too.
Always got to love that one. :dry:
 

dellzeqq

pre-talced and mighty
Location
SW2
Norm, my sympathies. Setting aside our collective outrage, you must find this stuff really disheartening. I think your response is very measured.
 
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Norm

Guest
Norm, my sympathies. Setting aside our collective outrage, you must find this stuff really disheartening. I think your response is very measured.
Indeed, dell, and thanks.

I'd love the chance to discuss it with him, I'd love to know whether anyone has assessed the possibility that Mr xxx's broken neck was caused, or worsened, by his helmet, I'd love to know whether they are mandating helmets for the kids who walk to school, or what protection they are giving to those who play rugby and hockey... etc But doing all that would, as Dan has pointed out, have made for a very lengthy letter. And a HOOOOGE public thanks to everyone who has participated and kept a possible helmet thread away from the brink, especially Dan B who slapped me (metaphorically) and dragged me away from the emotional response I first put together.

This is what I'm about to send:



Dear Mr xxx

I am hugely grateful that /my son/ has the opportunity to be part of the Boat Club. Rowing was my main sport at school and I’m delighted that /my son/ has shown the same level of interest - I don’t think that there is much else which would get him in to school at 7am.

I’ve just read your letter about the cycle security and the safety policy. I was sorry to read that two bikes were stolen earlier this week and I’d like to thank you for raising the awareness of the issue of security. Fortunately, /my son/ does have two good locks which he always uses but this incident will reinforce the need to always consider security. I was also pleased to see that you have addressed the issue of bike maintenance and lights, even a cursory look round the bike sheds shows a number of machines which are in serious need of some TLC.

I was, though, extremely disappointed that you intend to introduce a helmet policy for any boys who cycle to the Boat Club. /my son/ does always wear a helmet, so he shouldn’t be affected by this instruction but your letter discourages cycling , it may exclude children from the Boat Club and also makes cycling appear to be a dangerous activity. This is fundamentally not true as cyclists live, on average, considerably longer than non-cyclists. I believe that we should be doing everything that we can to encourage the boys to partake in regular exercise and that making cycling appear dangerous with the unjustified mandating of helmet-wearing will have a negative effect, removing the many attendant benefits.

We were all sorry to hear of Mr xxxx’s accident and we are delighted that he is recovering. However, statistical evidence gathered from around the world shows that there is absolutely no benefit arising from wearing a helmet. Research has shown that cars pass considerably closer to cyclists who are wearing a helmet and that the snag points on helmets may cause or increase neck injuries. Your letter also makes no mention of the need for a helmet to be properly fitted.

Because of this, I feel that mandating the use of helmets is not the best approach to promoting safety amongst cyclists and I hope that this policy will be swiftly reversed.

Alternative approaches to increasing the safety of boys who cycle to or around the school would be to organise cycling training to teach the boys the best way to ride on the road, or to make a basic maintenance course available so that the boys’ bikes are in sound mechanical condition or even to ensure that those who do wear helmets have them properly fitted.

If you would like to discuss this further, I would be delighted to have the opportunity to do so.
 
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summerdays

Cycling in the sun
Location
Bristol
I think the reworded letter is much better and particularly like the suggestion to improve cycle safety:

Alternative approaches to increasing the safety of boys who cycle to or around the school would be to organise cycling training to teach the boys the best way to ride on the road, or to make a basic maintenance course available so that the boys’ bikes are in sound mechanical condition.
 

benb

Evidence based cyclist
Location
Epsom
Maybe also suggest a "bike train" for people coming from the same direction?
 

classic33

Leg End Member
Taking the letter that started this.

Which you rather have your child using, whilst riding to & from school given the time of the year. Lights or helmet?
First is a legal requirement, second is personal choice.

I ask because some schools near me are taking advanyage of the fact that many may have received a bicycle for Christmas & have started giving cycle training/cycling lessons. Those running the training have put helmets over lights, priority wise.
 

400bhp

Guru
Good letter Norm.

Very pleasant to read - hopefully, the letter will get the Head involved in some discussions with you.
 
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Norm

Guest
Thanks, 400. :thumbsup: I did make one last change before sending it, the penultimate paragraph reads:

Alternative approaches to increasing the safety of boys who cycle to or around the school would be to organise cycling training to teach the boys the best way to ride on the road, or to make a basic maintenance course available so that the boys’ bikes are in sound mechanical condition and also to ensure that those who do wear helmets have them properly fitted.

Which you rather have your child using, whilst riding to & from school given the time of the year. Lights or helmet?
First is a legal requirement, second is personal choice.

I ask because some schools near me are taking advanyage of the fact that many may have received a bicycle for Christmas & have started giving cycle training/cycling lessons. Those running the training have put helmets over lights, priority wise.
Just in case it isn't obvious, I'd favour the lights over the helmet every time. To the extent that I use lights on my bike at almost any time, even in daylight I have a flasher at both ends. :giggle:
 

classic33

Leg End Member
Thanks, 400. :thumbsup: I did make one last change before sending it, the penultimate paragraph reads:




Just in case it isn't obvious, I'd favour the lights over the helmet every time. To the extent that I use lights on my bike at almost any time, even in daylight I have a flasher at both ends. :giggle:

Three on a bike, is that legal?
 
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Norm

Guest
I'm in two minds about whether to progress this one, as there is a large part of me that thinks it is right for kids to wear helmets. Were it not for the compulsion element, if it was strongly recommended for instance, I wouldn't have said anything.

However, I have received a reply:


Many thanks for your email regarding our Bike and Cycling Policies. I am sorry that you are “extremely disappointed” by the policy regarding boys wearing a helmet.
The policy has been brought in after discussion at a xxxx Committee meeting and in discussion with the School Management. The reason for enforcing the rule, rather than just strongly encouraging it, is that in my experience, and after asking numerous boys, one of the main reasons why many boys do not wear a helmet is due to peer pressure, and thus fear of having the “mick” taken out of them for doing so. After speaking to parents, many of them wished that their son did wear a helmet, but had lost the battle due to sustained peer pressure. No parent wants there son to be the center of “mickey taking”. By enforcing the rule, hopefully we take away this aspect as they all have to do wear them should they cycle.
I have challenged the Boat Club boys to try and take a lead role in changing Young Person perceptions on wearing a helmet. I agree with you that cycling is an on the whole a safe activity for anyone to get involved with, however there are risks involved, as with any life activities, and some aspects of riding a bike are relatively dangerous. I feel that we should be ensuring that boys are fully aware of all the risks, and ensuring that they are as prepared for them as possible. I agree with you that other considerations such as cycling proficiency and bike maintenance awareness courses would be beneficial, and I know that the school management is looking at these areas as part of the whole school cycling policies. Having seen many boys display anything but safe practice on their bikes this is very much needed.
I believe that wearing a helmet does make cycling safer for everyone, along the same lines as wearing a seat belt does in a car. You don’t need a seat belt until you need a seat belt. Likewise with a helmet, you don’t need one until you need one. The trouble is we have no idea when we will need one, and thus being prepared is the only way to be, and we need to encourage the boys. I agree with you that wearing a helmet can cause other problems such as neck injury. In Mr xxxx's case, while he has been left with a neck injury that may or may not have been caused by wearing a helmet, but he is also sure that if he had not been wearing a helmet he wouldn’t be worrying about his neck.
With regards to ensuring that the helmets are correctly fitted, I agree totally with you, and will add to the policy a statement to that effect.
I think it's good that they have thought about it and consulted, but I think it is bad that they have only looked at the superficial "If I bang my head wearing a helmet, it hurts less" level rather than actually checking any facts or stats.

He agrees that the helmet may have made the neck injury worse but I don't think he realises how little energy they absorb when saying that "...he is also sure that if he had not been wearing a helmet he wouldn’t be worrying about his neck"

Risk transference, or whatever it's called, makes the seatbelt analogy completely redundant. That would be akin to me taking the airbag out of everyone else's car and replacing it with a spike.

I don't think I'll get anywhere, but I do think it is worth another response, just to try and open their eyes to the facts about the increased dangers from other road users, and to the facts about the very low amount of energy a cycling helmet does absorb.

Still, if it only means that the kids get some more training in riding and maintenance, and that a fewer helmets are badly fitted, that might be as close to victory as I can hope to get.
 
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