Oh. My. God! Who's to blame?

[BentMikey]

I can't see how any blame could be placed on either the pickup driver or the bus driver in that video clip. It's blatantly 100% the cyclists' fault.

 

[Camgreen]

Surprised no one has picked up on the cyclist in purple (36 secs in) who exhibits almost as poor judgement in using the same gap, albeit at a much more cautious pace; he/she must've seen what had just happened but blithely followed suit. Amazing.

 

[semislickstick]

His front wheel looked a bit mangled, I expect thats why he chucked it....he couldn't wheel it. Do you think it got run over or the sudden stop? His rear wheel almost goes over him.

So are both those lanes for straight on into a single lane? Is anything from the bus lane supposed to merge into the right lane(and signal)? Is the bus/left lane for turning left and the right lane for right turn and straight on?

Bus was getting a bit close to the van! Lucky lad. Lucky, lucky lad. 'Put some money on the lottery' lucky.

 

[Asprilla]

a little harsh there, I think it's quite easy to tie a link between 'time saving' risk taking and SCR - yes, I know there are rules for SCR but there are rules for lots of things, doesn't mean they get followed.

Did anyone ask the chap in this clip if he was playing SCR or even knows what it is? No, so it's just speculation. This was a guy cycling too quickly for conditions and going for a rapidly closing gap that he didn't make.

It's not easy to tie a link, it's lazy. If a journalist tied a link between this video and all cycle accidents we'd be up in arms.

 

[MacB]

Did anyone ask the chap in this clip if he was playing SCR or even knows what it is? No, so it's just speculation. This was a guy cycling too quickly for conditions and going for a rapidly closing gap that he didn't make.

It's not easy to tie a link, it's lazy. If a journalist tied a link between this video and all cycle accidents we'd be up in arms.

the link is not if he's indulging in SCR it's if he's indulging in risk taking to shorten his journey time, which I think he clearly is. I'm sure you are an exemplary example of playing SCR strictly by the rules and only indulging when it's safe to do so. But surely you can see there might be a link between the existence of SCR and increased risk taking?

 

[marinyork]

How?

The positioning of the pick up truck appears to be poor. Contrary to popular myth, a stationary vehicle does not absolve people completely and utterly from responsibility - it just reduces it drastically. You do have a duty to position your vehicle as well as possible in such scenarios. Sadly that doesn't happen in real life every single time and you get someone aggressive come along and you get situations like this - very similar with car v car.

 

[Origamist]

It's the junction with Old St and Central St and Golden Lane (the pick-up was trying to go right into Central St). Two narrow lanes (bus lane, traffic lane) into one traffic lane and a cylce lane when you're through the junction. It creates a pinch point.

The bus lane ends before the junction and most left turning cars move into the left lane and most cars going straight on stay right. However, if there is a right turning vehicle blocking the junction, most cars move from the right lane, to the left in order to go straight ahead (squeezing cyclists usually). When you're through the junction it's a cycle lane and traffic lane.

 

[marinyork]

I'm intrigued to see how/why the truck driver gets any blame in this.. and also some reasoning for the 25% for the bus driver when you then go on to say that he probably couldn't have seen the cyclist until the last second anyway. Have I misunderstood something in what you put?

About the pick up see my other post, as for the bus driver lanes, space and markings matter. The very short version is the bus driver gets some of the blame because he executed a very poor manoeuvre moving over into the virtual other lane (just) with a change of direction and he didn't even indicate (which some would say he should do and others not). We all know why he was doing this and it's very laudable, but it still doesn't change that it is a bloody stupid thing to be doing both undertaking and overtaking traffic when you have a bad junction and a badly slung pick up truck. A bus is a large and wide vehicle and has a particular care of duty overtaking. Strictly speaking there's not that much wrong with the hipsters movement, if you look carefully he's back in lane before the junction. He might as well have let the bus go though. So we're left with other factors - about 6-8 seconds from the lights going green to the collision that's a very small amount of time to take in such huge distance and so many vehicles. The reason why I'm sympathetic to the bus driver is it is a busy urban setting with many vehicles and in that context it's a very narrow window to take a lot in. The bus driver is not driving with greatly excessive speed either and as been typical of when I've riden in London, allows a good weighty amount of time before pulling out.

I know people often query this when I say it, but lanes and overtaking really do matter. So if you run into a ninja cyclist it's partially your fault, if a vehicle is doing 100mph behind you and you pull off a stunt of overtaking someone else and then 100mph vehicle ploughs into the back of you in spectacular fashion then again it's partly your fault. A simpler 2 or 3 vehicle scenario is different to one with about 10 or 15 like here. This is why I apportion little blame to the bus driver in this scenario. I was just contrasting it with the excusemongers who come up with stuff for much simpler happenings and then say they didn't have time to react.

 

[Rhythm Thief]

Contrary to Marinyork's rather ridiculous assertion, the pickup truck driver wasn't doing anything wrong. Neither the bus driver. Blame there lies solely with the cyclist, who is clearly an idiot and will shortly be wearing a wooden overcoat if he carries on riding like that. If you ever find yourself wondering why everyone hates cyclists and thinks they're dangerous loonies, you have only to watch this video.

 

[marinyork]

Contrary to Marinyork's rather ridiculous assertion, the pickup truck driver wasn't doing anything wrong. Neither the bus driver. Blame there lies solely with the cyclist, who is clearly an idiot and will shortly be wearing a wooden overcoat if he carries on riding like that. If you ever find yourself wondering why everyone hates cyclists and thinks they're dangerous loonies, you have only to watch this video.

And it's very nice to see you too. Unlike the contrarian RT who likes to wind people up and post unthought out and provocative things as he knows he can get away with it as a moderator I've briefly explained what I think. Any particular reason why you think this? Do you actually think about things at all? Any processes in there?

Is it all right to have poor road positioning at junctions? Is it all right to be pulling out in to other virtual lanes? Is it all right to be overtaking and undertaking at junctions simultaneously? Is it all right to be doing this when you can see a problem ahead like the pick up truck?

 

[Rhythm Thief]

... as for the bus driver lanes, space and markings matter. The very short version is the bus driver gets some of the blame because he executed a very poor manoeuvre moving over into the virtual other lane (just) with a change of direction and he didn't even indicate (which some would say he should do and others not). We all know why he was doing this and it's very laudable, but it still doesn't change that it is a bloody stupid thing to be doing both undertaking and overtaking traffic when you have a bad junction and a badly slung pick up truck. A bus is a large and wide vehicle and has a particular care of duty overtaking. Strictly speaking there's not that much wrong with the hipsters movement, if you look carefully he's back in lane before the junction. He might as well have let the bus go though. So we're left with other factors - about 6-8 seconds from the lights going green to the collision that's a very small amount of time to take in such huge distance and so many vehicles.The reason why I'm sympathetic to the bus driver is it is a busy urban setting with many vehicles and in that context it's a very narrow window to take a lot in. The bus driver is not driving with greatly excessive speed either and as been typical of when I've riden in London, allows a good weighty amount of time before pulling out.

The problem with this is that it's utter bollocks. "Virtual other lane"? What are you talking about? "Didn't even indicate"? Why would he? All he was doing was pulling away from traffic lights which had just changed. Do you indicate to go straight on at traffic lights? "Particular care of duty (sic) overtaking"? Well, apart from the fact that I think you mean "duty of care", the fact is that this is absolutely true but irrelevant in this case since the bus driver wasn't actually overtaking anything. Finally, if you're excusing the suicide jockey on the bike on the grounds that "6-8 seconds [is] a very small amount of time to take in such a huge distance and so many vehicles", then you should really cut the bus driver rather more slack than you have on the grounds that some cocksponge on a bike appearing next to his back wheel with perhaps two seconds' notice gives him even less time to react. Besides, it's a feeble excuse anyway: if the cyclist is unable to process the information he's got in the time available, then a) he's riding too fast, and b) he probably shouldn't really be riding around in a busy urban environment in the first place. Perhaps a red and yellow tricycle in the sandpit is more his level of ability.

 

[Rhythm Thief]

And it's very nice to see you too. Unlike the contrarian RT who likes to wind people up and post unthought out and provocative things as he knows he can get away with it as a moderator I've briefly explained what I think. Any particular reason why you think this? Do you actually think about things at all? Any processes in there?

Is it all right to have poor road positioning at junctions? Is it all right to be pulling out in to other virtual lanes? Is it all right to be overtaking and undertaking at junctions simultaneously? Is it all right to be doing this when you can see a problem ahead like the pick up truck?

I'm baffled as to why you think the pickup truck was positioned poorly. He was turning right, he'd positioned his vehicle in the right hand lane with the indicator on. What, incidentally, is the "problem ahead" that the pickup driver should be able to see? The only problem here comes charging in from behind, going for a gap which was too small to begin with and was only ever going to get smaller. I've explained why I think the bus was doing nothing wrong above, but I'd be interested to hear what this "virtual lane" is that you keep mentioning.
As for the bit I've put in bold ... well, no it isn't. And the only person doing that here was the cyclist.

Petty jealousy about my not-very-secret mod status will get you nowhere.

 

[4F]

100% fault with the cyclist, one word muppet.

 

[LosingFocus]

*applauds RT*

 

[BentMikey]

Yes, I'm with RT, but could you both tone it down a bit please? Your posts are both getting a trifle heated, and that would never do.