On One Pompetamine

[marcw]

I'm hoping it's at least 6 months away, otherwise I'm going to be pretty disappointed when my 8 speed Pompetamine Versa Pro arrives in the near future!

mine's 3rd in line apparently. They are waiting on a specific type of brake cable and should have it built by the end of the week. I'd like the lower weight of the Alfine 11 but not sure I'd need the range. If i ever go touring and need to lower the gearing I'll stick a/ the larger sprocket on the back. Unless I'm doing the calcs wrong on Sheldon site, I get;

both triple and double are 9 speeds.

triple 28/38/48*12/25 = 30.2-108 range 357%
alfine 48*18 = 37.9-116.3 range 306.8%
compact double 39/50*11/23 = 45.8-122.7 range 267.9%


Alfine 11 = 409%

The range on the Alfine seems extreme unless you are fully loaded touring, through mud, with the kids in a trailer, up the Tourmalet and still want to have a high enough gear to pick up some speed on the descents.

 

[gaz]

The range on the Alfine seems extreme unless you are fully loaded touring, through mud, with the kids in a trailer, up the Tourmalet and still want to have a high enough gear to pick up some speed on the descents.

Exactly!

 

[Saundie]

mine's 3rd in line apparently. They are waiting on a specific type of brake cable and should have it built by the end of the week.

I was under the impression that there is no drop shifter for the 11 speed Alfine yet - I'm assuming that you're getting a flat barred version?

I received an email from On One this morning, apparently my Versa Pro will be built on Wednesday next week. Relieved that they're finally getting started on it; I ordered it on the 21st, and hadn't heard anything from them since.

 

[MacB]

I was speaking to OnOne earlier and I think the delays have been around the cable outers for the mechanical disc brakes. Normal cable outers don't work well as they compress too much so you need some form of compressionless outer. This generally means that the outer will have longitudinal, rather than spiral, reinforcing. The same as gear cable outer has but more robust to cope with the greater forces employed with braking.

But the stuff is more expensive and they've been trying to get a viable source that allows them to keep within the targetted price point. It may have taken a bit more time but I'd rather they did this than just whack on cheaper standard outers and leave it to the customers to work out why the brakes aren't so good and how to fix it.

 

[Saundie]

I received an email from On One last week, apparently they aim to build my Pompetamine on Wednesday. I am going to need to get some mudguards for it; any suggestions?

 

[Piemaster]

Honjo Koken hammered metal. (review link).
Unfortunately I can't find anywhere in UK that seems to stock them (On-One did sell them a couple of years ago)

 

[threebikesmcginty]

Spa cycles have got Stronglight ones on offer at the moment - I might give the type S a go.
Never had mudguards before, how exiciting!

Piemaster - do you like the look of those Honjo ones? I can't work out if I like them or not!!

 

[Howard]

I'm hoping it's at least 6 months away, otherwise I'm going to be pretty disappointed when my 8 speed Pompetamine Versa Pro arrives in the near future!

These exist now, and are fitted to the Genesis Day 1 Alfine 11.

 

[Piemaster]

Spa cycles have got Stronglight ones on offer at the moment - I might give the type S a go.
Never had mudguards before, how exiciting!

Piemaster - do you like the look of those Honjo ones? I can't work out if I like them or not!!

Yup . Just can't find anywhere that sells them. There are different finish patterns too.
Someone had them on their bike on one of the East Coast CC rides which was first time I'd seen them.
I am a bit of a tart when it comes to the bike though.

edit: Oooh, oooh. I just found these

 

[marcw]

These exist now, and are fitted to the Genesis Day 1 Alfine 11.

you sure, Versa make no mention of a 11 speed brifter and Genesis make no mention of a 11 speed day one.

I can see the Alfine 11 being liked by mountain bikers and tourers. The first lot generally use trigger shifters and the second lot seem to quite like bar end shifters.

Hopefully a second 'road' version of the Alfine 11 comes out with less range so that the jumps between gears are lower. If they increase the options and get the price a little lower you'd think they could clean up.

 

[threebikesmcginty]

edit: Oooh, oooh. I just found these

Those carbon fibre ones are cheap!

 

[Howard]

you sure, Versa make no mention of a 11 speed brifter and Genesis make no mention of a 11 speed day one.

Ah, no I'm not, my bad. Appears it's the 8 speed. Quite how I got it into my head it was the 11 I'm not sure - probably the shiny finish on the hub. Funny I didn't notice even though I've seen these bikes in the flesh. Oh well, that explains how they can get it in under the £1000 price tag.

I can see the Alfine 11 being liked by mountain bikers and tourers. The first lot generally use trigger shifters and the second lot seem to quite like bar end shifters.

Hopefully a second 'road' version of the Alfine 11 comes out with less range so that the jumps between gears are lower. If they increase the options and get the price a little lower you'd think they could clean up.

Still too inefficient for sportive use I think, but something I'd be willing to try.

 

[MacB]

Still too inefficient for sportive use I think, but something I'd be willing to try.

For real? the efficiency levels of the Alfine 8, SRAM9, Alfine 11 and Rohloff(14) are quite hotly disputed but you don't have to go far from a clean, well adjusted, derailler setup to find things compare quite favourably to the hub gear. If yu're talking a 3 speed then you'll often have a superior efficiency level to a derailler.

I wonder if there are any real world comparisons, rather than laboratory ones. Evidence of similar ability riders completing the same sportive/race on hub and derailler gears. I would be curious to see what the time differences amount to, I accept that they'd be enough to make hubs a non-starter at pro, and top amateur, levels. But at weekend warrior stakes I do wonder? Plus, think of the bragging rights towards those you beat

 

[Howard]

For real? the efficiency levels of the Alfine 8, SRAM9, Alfine 11 and Rohloff(14) are quite hotly disputed but you don't have to go far from a clean, well adjusted, derailler setup to find things compare quite favourably to the hub gear. If yu're talking a 3 speed then you'll often have a superior efficiency level to a derailler.

I wonder if there are any real world comparisons, rather than laboratory ones. Evidence of similar ability riders completing the same sportive/race on hub and derailler gears. I would be curious to see what the time differences amount to, I accept that they'd be enough to make hubs a non-starter at pro, and top amateur, levels. But at weekend warrior stakes I do wonder? Plus, think of the bragging rights towards those you beat

I was referring specifically to the Alfines. The eight is a long way away from freehub + cassette most likely due to the grease it's lubricated with. The 11 runs on oil, so I'm guessing it's better, but I can't imagine it's amazing given its budget price. Will certainly be interesting to see.

I agree about the SA 3 speeds, that makes total sense, but then that's also comparing apples with oranges. No idea about Rohloffs - all I know is that they say the complete set-up weighs about the same as a derailleur based group - but if they do run as efficiently I wonder why we don't we see them on more sportive bikes? Perhaps it is just a cost thing - or I'm just looking at the wrong bikes.

 

[MacB]

I was referring specifically to the Alfines. The eight is a long way away from freehub + cassette most likely due to the grease it's lubricated with. The 11 runs on oil, so I'm guessing it's better, but I can't imagine it's amazing given its budget price. Will certainly be interesting to see.

I agree about the SA 3 speeds, that makes total sense, but then that's also comparing apples with oranges. No idea about Rohloffs - all I know is that they say the complete set-up weighs about the same as a derailleur based group - but if they do run as efficiently I wonder why we don't we see them on more sportive bikes? Perhaps it is just a cost thing - or I'm just looking at the wrong bikes.

Fair enough, I've not used the alfine 8, and don't have any realworld comparisons, hence why I raised the question. I have an SA 3 speed, SRAM 9 speed and triple derailler, Tiagra level. There's a difference across the bikes but bike weight, tyre choice and presence of mudguards must be a fair amount as well. If we're talking Sportive type distances, up to about 60 miles. Then my limited self experimentation would tell me that my 9 speed hub gear would be about 2mph slower than my triple derailler, 16 v 18mph. So about 25 minutes difference over a 60 mile route. But I can't think of any way of calculating what proportion of that can be attributed to various differences between the bikes. The hub gear is 12lbs heavier, has full mudguards and larger, puncture resistant, tyres.

As for why they're not on more sportive style bikes, there'll be a variety of reasons, weight, cost and chain tension being biggies.