Potholes - watch out in York (or anywhere else)

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Linford

Guest
Watch out for potholes takes on a new meaning - (shamelesly stolen from another forum)

If your LA is too skint to repair the roads, it is just tough on you if you hit one.

What do we pay so much in VED and fuel duty for ?

Isn't it about time they brought back 'Road Tax' to ring fence the standards of them ?

[QUOTEWILKINSON v CITY OF YORK COUNCIL (2011)

A highways authority which had deviated from the national code of practice for the maintenance of highways because of budgetary considerations could not rely on a defence under the Highways Act 1980 s.58 to a claim for damages caused by the authority's failure to maintain the highway

The appellant cyclist (W) appealed against the dismissal of her claim for damages against the respondent highways authority (Y).

W had been cycling along Whitby Drive but had fallen off her bicycle after her front wheel hit a pothole. She suffered a fractured chin and other injuries.

Under Y's highway maintenance scheme, Whitby Drive was in a category of highways inspected once a year. However, under the national code of practice for the maintenance of highways, it potentially fell within a category where the recommended inspection frequency was three months. Y stated that it had adopted longer inspection periods because of budgetary constraints.

The judge at first instance found that Y's maintenance scheme was insufficient, and Y could not rely upon a defence under the Highways Act 1980 s.58. On appeal, a circuit judge concluded that insufficient account had been taken of the highway authority's financial considerations, and the s.58 defence succeeded.

W submitted that the s.58 defence was an objective test, and Y's reliance on budgetary considerations did not meet that test. Y argued that W had to show that the pothole had arisen before the date that inspection was last due.

HELD: (1) The judge at first instance had been entitled to conclude that Whitby Drive was the sort of road for which annual inspection was inadequate, having regard to the guidance in the national code and the absence of any reason, other than financial, for departing from the national code (see para.32 of judgment). (2) The circuit judge's approach to the s.58 defence was wrong.

Section 58 provided a defence where the authority had done what was "reasonably required to secure that the part of the highway to which the action related was not dangerous for traffic".

That required an objective judgment based on risk.

Parliament had included manpower resources elsewhere in the Act as a matter to be taken into consideration where it was thought appropriate, but such considerations did not feature in s.58.

The various matters to which the court was required to have regard in s.58(2) were all objective matters going to the condition of the highway and what the authority could reasonably have been expected to know about it.

Section 58 was designed simply to afford a defence to a claim for damages brought against a highway authority which was able to demonstrate that it had done all that was reasonably necessary to make the road safe for users, not an authority which decided that it was preferable to allocate its resources in other directions because other needs were more pressing (paras 34-35). (3)

A claimant had to show that the danger was due to a failure to maintain in the sense explained by Lord Denning M.R. in Haydon v Kent CC [1978] Q.B. 343 but not more than that, Haydon considered. Y's argument amounted to saying that s.58 made it incumbent upon a claimant in every case to prove that there was not merely a breach of the duty to maintain, but a negligent breach of the duty to maintain.

That proposition had already been rejected by the court in previous cases, Griffiths v Liverpool Corp [1967] 1 Q.B. 374, Goodes v East Sussex CC [2000] 1 W.L.R. 1356 and Gorringe v Calderdale MBC [2004] UKHL 15, [2004] 1 W.L.R. 1057 applied.

Appeal allowed
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400bhp

Guru
It says appeal allowed?
 

sidevalve

Über Member
As is so regularly pointed out in this very forum VED [or whatever you want to call it] is not for the roads nor is fuel duty, If they were and became a "road user tax" then everybody including cyclists would have to pay.
 
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Linford

Linford

Guest
As is so regularly pointed out in this very forum VED [or whatever you want to call it] is not for the roads nor is fuel duty, If they were and became a "road user tax" then everybody including cyclists would have to pay.

What is so wrong with that if the quality standards of the surface are enshrined in law in exchange for a small but linked charge ?

It is easy to argue that because cyclists are not required to make any contribution through VED or fuel duty, that one should just suck it up with no real claim on any demands to keep it all in good order.

Now that they have said this, it is about time they re linked the taxes extracted in return for a tangeable service delivered. Those who use them can then demand that they are kept up together.

I'd have no problem paying £10 or £20 a year as a cyclist if it guaranteed a quality road surface.

How much are buckled wheels to sort at the end of the day ?

Conversion to VED is a good way of squeezing people without actually being obliged to use that money to benefit the users who it was taken from.
 
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Linford

Linford

Guest
It says appeal allowed?

So they accepted her claim on appeal and that is that - council must retain liability, and not use the excuse that they had some big index linked pension for one of their workers to pay instead ?
 

Davidc

Guru
Location
Somerset UK
What is so wrong with that if the quality standards of the surface are enshrined in law in exchange for a small but linked charge ?

It is easy to argue that because cyclists are not required to make any contribution through VED or fuel duty, that one should just suck it up with no real claim on any demands to keep it all in good order.

Now that they have said this, it is about time they re linked the taxes extracted in return for a tangeable service delivered. Those who use them can then demand that they are kept up together.

I'd have no problem paying £10 or £20 a year as a cyclist if it guaranteed a quality road surface.

How much are buckled wheels to sort at the end of the day ?

Conversion to VED is a good way of squeezing people without actually being obliged to use that money to benefit the users who it was taken from.

If you hypothecate VED and fuel duty and only use those and no other source of funds to pay for roads, signalling, pollution mitigation and so on then don't expect the roads to stay as good as they are now.

I'd be in favour of tolls on most roads to relieve the burden on general taxation and move it onto users, based on vehicle weight to ensure those causing most wear pay most.
 

400bhp

Guru
So they accepted her claim on appeal and that is that - council must retain liability, and not use the excuse that they had some big index linked pension for one of their workers to pay instead ?

I'm confused. You said:

If your LA is too skint to repair the roads, it is just tough on you if you hit one.

Well, not according to this case it isn't.

Am I missing something?
 
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Linford

Linford

Guest
If you hypothecate VED and fuel duty and only use those and no other source of funds to pay for roads, signalling, pollution mitigation and so on then don't expect the roads to stay as good as they are now.

I'd be in favour of tolls on most roads to relieve the burden on general taxation and move it onto users, based on vehicle weight to ensure those causing most wear pay most.

When you say 'pollution', What do you mean by that ?

The problem with the wear and tear proposal is that VED for a 44 tonne lorry and buses would have to rise to £80k per year if Car users were to continue paying their present subs.

As it is, those in the middle carry those on either side, and if the arguments of emission based VED go out of the window as motorcycles are paying a lot more than many cars now and cause a lot less localised pollution as they don't need to sit in traffic jams like a Prius.

I did a mileage check the other week on my m/bike . I pay nearly £80 per year to tax it, and it was averaging 48mpg on a set of twisty country roads at a pace which a Prius would srtruggle to do about 30mpg
 
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Linford

Linford

Guest
I'm confused. You said:



Well, not according to this case it isn't.

Am I missing something?

It begs the question that the councils should even have a system of fighting off claims if they fail to do their job.
 

green1

Über Member
As it is, those in the middle carry those on either side, and if the arguments of emission based VED go outof the window as motorcycles are paying a lot more than many cars now and cause a lot less localised pollution as they don't need to sitin traffic jams like a Prius.
I had an argument with a hybrid driver I have the misfortune of knowing. Apparently my nasty 4~5000 mile a year sports car should be banned while his lovely green 25~30000 mile a year hybrid is saving the world. :whistle:
 
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Linford

Linford

Guest
I had an argument with a hybrid driver I have the misfortune of knowing. Apparently my nasty 4~5000 mile a year sports car should be banned while his lovely green 25~30000 mile a year hybrid is saving the world. :whistle:

You aren;t suggesting that Green gesture politics actually do more to mitigate than actually consuming less by lifestyle choices?..heaven forbid ^_^
 

Davidc

Guru
Location
Somerset UK
I had an argument with a hybrid driver I have the misfortune of knowing. Apparently my nasty 4~5000 mile a year sports car should be banned while his lovely green 25~30000 mile a year hybrid is saving the world. :whistle:
Just point out that start-stop technology is much 'greener'and uses less fuel.
 

400bhp

Guru
It begs the question that the councils should even have a system of fighting off claims if they fail to do their job.

Why shouldn't they?

If they didn't then guess what would happen....

The cyclist won, end of. The judgement would suggest that council's cannot use the "we can't afford it" strapline to wiggle out of genuine claims.
 
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Linford

Linford

Guest
Just point out that start-stop technology is much 'greener'and uses less fuel.

It takes a big stretch of the imagination to see how any technology can compensate for the differences between a car doing 25mpg @ 4k PA, and a car doing 45mpg @30k PA.

What is the urban cycle on a Prius in London where the engine starts after half a mile of battery use ?
 
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