Red light jumping antics

[Origamist]

I remember one guy who I would occasionally see on my commute from West London, would shout out "police, stop" and then look down. Most cyclists looked around in a panic, some stopped and looked discombobulated, some put their heads down and sped up...

 

[hackbike 666]

Bloke last night at Bank was so desperate to get past a bus and jump the red that he even mounted the pavement.

 

[Dan B]

OK, just to clarify ONE MORE TIME. When you're talking 'jumping' as being going through a red light on the end of a line of traffic - that old "i'll just nip through here and no one will mind" - I accept. No contest.

However, what most motorists complain about is Cyclists going through red lights is when the traffic has already stopped and the cyclist attmepts the junction anyway.

I was trying to make this distiction. Even though I no longer remember why I did. I'm sorry, OK?

Yes, it's an important distinction between two equally illegal and probably equally dangerous maneouvres.

If you'd like to add "equally illegal but probably less dangerous" to the heady mix: entering an ASL other than in the case of a cycle using the feeder lane; rolling forward over the line; going through on amber when you could have stopped safely (amber in law means "stop", not "go if you're quick").

The chief reason that motorists complain about it (and I make exception here for the occasional thoughtful motorist, who probably also rides a bike anyway) is not that it's illegal or dangerous, but that they can't do it themselves and they think this is unfair

 

[jimboalee]

Aye, some roundabouts can be a bit nerve wracking at first. But once you've worked out a strategy for each roundabout it soon gets easier.

I tend to find the faster I take a roundabout (within reason) the easier it is to negotiate. I'm sure it is because you keep up with the flow better. Of course, that also means you need to have the speed in the first place!

This is a BAD mistake.

There is no such thing as a pre-worked strategy for taking a vehicle ( any vehicle ) on the road.
You have to treat EVERY yard of the way as if ANYTHING can happen.

ANY peanut could do anything.

 

[magnatom]

This is a BAD mistake.

There is no such thing as a pre-worked strategy for taking a vehicle ( any vehicle ) on the road.
You have to treat EVERY yard of the way as if ANYTHING can happen.

ANY peanut could do anything.

Ah but the strategy is not a written in stone , must be ridden in this way, type strategy (i.e. not a protocol). It is a method of approach and an understanding of where the main conflicts etc arise.

 

[Origamist]

This is a BAD mistake.

There is no such thing as a pre-worked strategy for taking a vehicle ( any vehicle ) on the road.
You have to treat EVERY yard of the way as if ANYTHING can happen.

ANY peanut could do anything.

Agreed.

I have a strategy with regard to my commute of using A-roads, however, the coping tactics I use on these roads varies greatly depending on the dynamics of the road at the time. I have a preferred course of action but you need to be able to adapt to the prevailing traffic conditions.

Can I be the first to quote von Moltke in Commuting:

No plan of operations extends with certainty beyond the first encounter with the enemy's main strength

 

[HaloJ]

May I just enquire about the grey area of jumping a red light as a cyclist? Are we talking coming to a stop at your red light but once other lights have changed and before your set turns green, setting off? Or are we talking slicing between the cars, pedestrians and flotsam at full tilt and blasting through moments after the lights have gone red?

The reason I ask is that I do the former especially at one particular junction on my journey home. The junction lighting goes like this. My road red, crossing road green. My road red, crossing road red, pedestrian lights green. Once the ped lights go red and as long as there is no one left crossing I set off so that I may turn right rather than be a sitting duck to the on coming myopics trying to turn right through me.

So whilst I accept that jumping a light post change is wrong I do feel that setting off pre change is acceptable if done safely.

Abs

 

[Origamist]

That would be "Red Light Creep" in dweeby cycling fora parlance. Opinions differ with regard to its acceptability...

 

[jimboalee]

That's called "Getting the holeshot".

 

[StuartG]

My 'amber gambling' is vehicle dependent. In a car I stop if it can be done comfortably. That also means I never go through a red.

When riding my motobike or cycle things are different. If I would be the first vehicle to stop I do not decide until I am sure of the position behind me. In London & despite mirrors one can never be sure without doublechecking. If I see a vehicle at close quarters then I proceed through amber (and possibly red if its a young chap in an Astra). The risks from behind IMHO exceed those from the junction and paradoxically the cyclists' reputation for RLJing means that to stop is the unexpected and dangerous manouver - sadly.

A real issue of the conflict between legality and safety.

The other time I RLJ is the controlled pedestrian crossing when there are no pedestrians and no one is put at risk (arguably reducing mine). I live in hope that if a plod saw me then they would use due discretion. One might rely on it if the plod rode. But so many have never that maybe they can only see broken law and not survival riding.

Do we have any plods here to comment?

 

[Grendel]

May I just enquire about the grey area of jumping a red light as a cyclist? Are we talking coming to a stop at your red light but once other lights have changed and before your set turns green, setting off? Or are we talking slicing between the cars, pedestrians and flotsam at full tilt and blasting through moments after the lights have gone red?

The reason I ask is that I do the former especially at one particular junction on my journey home. The junction lighting goes like this. My road red, crossing road green. My road red, crossing road red, pedestrian lights green. Once the ped lights go red and as long as there is no one left crossing I set off so that I may turn right rather than be a sitting duck to the on coming myopics trying to turn right through me.

So whilst I accept that jumping a light post change is wrong I do feel that setting off pre change is acceptable if done safely.

Abs

I disagree entirely. If you wish to cross with the lights , get off and walk across, then remount.

 

[Dan B]

How is that any safer? If you don't have the bike control skills to proceed across a junction at walking pace without dismounting, maybe you shouldn't be on a bike full stop.

 

[Grendel]

How is that any safer? If you don't have the bike control skills to proceed across a junction at walking pace without dismounting, maybe you shouldn't be on a bike full stop.

Who mentioned safety? Who said I can't pedal slowly?

The poster I quoted says he believes it is acceptable to go through a red traffic light if the pedestrian lights going in the same direction are green.

I say that if you want to go on the road, obey the road signals.
If you want to avoid them, become a pedestrian.

 

[HaloJ]

Who mentioned safety? Who said I can't pedal slowly?

The poster I quoted says he believes it is acceptable to go through a red traffic light if the pedestrian lights going in the same direction are green.

I say that if you want to go on the road, obey the road signals.
If you want to avoid them, become a pedestrian.

Ah, no, you misunderstood (or I typed it poorly as I wasn't concentrating).

The poster, she, believes in getting a headstart between the pedestrian light going red and my light going green, which at this particular set of lights is about 10 seconds. Although pedestrians still cross on red as we all know all too well.

Abs (short for Abigail)

 

[Grendel]

Apologies Abigail!