Racing roadkill
Guru
I think there’s a clue, in that it was Strava that had the speed at what it was.
Seriously strong cycling buddies
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Racing roadkill
Guru
As was said up thread. I have ridden with some big units, who can ride pretty fast, on the flat. But they don’t go up hills very well, and they tend to have issues with fast downhill corners, and don’t stop so well. So if you put ‘em on a lumpy course, with lots of twisty downhill bits, they really won’t be that quick overall. It’s another reason why ‘average speeds’ are a largely pointless metric. Weighted average power to weight gives a much truer measure, to gauge your performance by.
Racing roadkill
Guru
And probably an e-bike, That hill is a complete sum bitch. I know domestic pros who can’t get more than about 15 mph up there, with them at max. That takes some doing as well.There's a mental hill/climb called Copse Hill in Wimbledon. Usually cyclists cause a bit a tail back on this horrendous hill. Many would find it quicker to dismount and walk. Around March last year, I struggled to catch a cyclist in my car doing 30mph ish which is very odd. I had to speed up to catch him to see what was going on. He must have cycled all the way up it at around 20/25mph ish as I do not recall dropping below 28 mph. I was in such awe I stayed behind for the last 1/2 of the hill, baffled at how this guy chap was tearing up the hill, without any fellow car drivers getting impatient. I have never seen anything like it before or since! The rider was a ripped bodybuilder (not a heavy weight Ronnie Coleman but more like a middle weight), massive shredded legs on show, muscles bulging out of the lycra.
https://www.evanscycles.com/trek-do...Product_Trek_Domane+LT &utm_content=Broadcast
Good luck picking that out as an e-bike, at a distance.
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Stompier
Senior Member
Nothing particularly wrong with Strava's speed calculations - it's not a difficult equation to calculate.
vickster
Legendary Member
delimited e-bike + anabolic steroidsThere's a mental hill/climb called Copse Hill in Wimbledon. Usually cyclists cause a bit a tail back on this horrendous hill. Many would find it quicker to dismount and walk. Around March last year, I struggled to catch a cyclist in my car doing 30mph ish which is very odd
Big, fit rider can push along a flat very well. Unfortunately any long gradient will crucify the big riders speed. Gravity see.
A fit middle or light weight might lose a little on the flats but make greater gains on uphills
I tend to be able to stay with our club on the flat sections but we always go over some climb on the way home, big riders are always dropped. We never get back the lost time..
Guess body size for me
A fit middle or light weight might lose a little on the flats but make greater gains on uphills
I tend to be able to stay with our club on the flat sections but we always go over some climb on the way home, big riders are always dropped. We never get back the lost time..
Guess body size for me
I used to work with a bloke who was about 5' 7" or 8" most definatly overweight, he took up cycling and before long he was breaking tandem RTTC records with a top rider, he never slimmed down, I think he had a terrific lung capacity, he didn't like hills though, he is still cycling and still well overweight for his size.
Stompier
Senior Member
Big, fit rider can push along a flat very well. Unfortunately any long gradient will crucify the big riders speed. Gravity see.
A fit middle or light weight might lose a little on the flats but make greater gains on uphills
I tend to be able to stay with our club on the flat sections but we always go over some climb on the way home, big riders are always dropped. We never get back the lost time..
Guess body size for me
Weight doesn't necessarily define a rider's ability to climb - or to maintain speed on the flat for that matter. A rider's sustainable power output will define his (or her) speed on the flat, together with other considerations like aero/frontal profile and wheel/tyre choice (if you want to get technical). However, when the road goes up, the main consideration is watts/kg, together with however long you can sustain that w/kg output.
On short climbs I agree, but anything a few minutes long, yes weight is crucial, or the lack of it.
Jist look at the pro Peleton, sprinters and rollers, get dropped within a few hundred metres of the start of climb.
There are a few exceptions, Sagan is probably the most famous.
Edvald Boasson Hagen is another but not in the same league as Sagan.
Even Sagan gets dropped
Stompier
Senior Member
Like I said - uphill it's all to do with your sustainable w/kg
I often cycle with a friend of mine who is just naturally big but very strong. Im not particularly lightweight but im not large either. On the flats we pretty much match each other but down hill sections he just flies past me. On the hills though he really struggles and soon gets dropped by me. Its all about power to weight ratios i think.
Larger riders have to produce a greater amount of power in proportion to lighter riders to match the equivalent W/Kg
Eg 100kg rider traveling on the flat at 3W/kg 300W
Going up a climb say at 4.5W/kg 450W
150W difference
Now run the same figures for a 70kg rider. Its 105W to achieve the same W/Kg.
Big riders suffer more with a steeper gradient.
Personally Im able to match riders lighter upto around 4%. after that its lost cause for long climbs
Stompier
Senior Member
Well obviously. That's how it works.
Not sure what your point is here. w/kg will obviously vary from rider to rider, depending on size, weight and FTP.
Again, only if they can't match the w/kg of whoever it is they are riding with. It's quite possible that they could actually climb better than a lighter rider, if the lighter rider has a lower w/kg.
That is why big riders aren't able to sustain a long climb matching a lighter rider.
I can match a super light rider up a short climb, but I have to throw lots of Watts to achieve the same uphill performance. Going much deeper to achieve the same performance.
I use Zwift a great deal and can see who are the light riders by their watts/kg compared to mine in a race.
I know my strengths and weaknesses, I choose races according to my strengths. I do however like a good climb but know if its longer than 5 mins I have to go very deep to hold the wheels of lighter riders
Proportionally greater amount of effort over a lighter rider to match the same W/kg
Just look at the Pros, There is about 10-12 kg between a climber and sprinter. You never see sprinters up near the front of a big climb.
Its the perfect example, has these riders are at their physical peak, so its down to physics.
Steeper gradients have a greater impact on a heavier rider
Similarly lightweight riders struggles to match a bigger more powerful rider on the flat.
Rarely do you see a lightweight winning the Belgium classics
There are some exceptions both ways though.
Obviously an unfit lightweight could be beaten by a fit heavyweight rider up an hill, but thats is not comparing apples to apples.
I can match a super light rider up a short climb, but I have to throw lots of Watts to achieve the same uphill performance. Going much deeper to achieve the same performance.
I use Zwift a great deal and can see who are the light riders by their watts/kg compared to mine in a race.
I know my strengths and weaknesses, I choose races according to my strengths. I do however like a good climb but know if its longer than 5 mins I have to go very deep to hold the wheels of lighter riders
Proportionally greater amount of effort over a lighter rider to match the same W/kg
Just look at the Pros, There is about 10-12 kg between a climber and sprinter. You never see sprinters up near the front of a big climb.
Its the perfect example, has these riders are at their physical peak, so its down to physics.
Steeper gradients have a greater impact on a heavier rider
Similarly lightweight riders struggles to match a bigger more powerful rider on the flat.
Rarely do you see a lightweight winning the Belgium classics
There are some exceptions both ways though.
Obviously an unfit lightweight could be beaten by a fit heavyweight rider up an hill, but thats is not comparing apples to apples.
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Stompier
Senior Member
Not sure I understand your point. There is absolutely no reason why a 'big' rider could not ride a climb with a lighter rider, especially if his w/kg matched or exceeded the lighter rider's. There is nothing stopping a large rider having a higher w/kg than a lighter rider.
I don't think anyone is claiming that sprinters can climb with the climbers.
This is the bit which you seem to be struggling with, and it seems as though you don't understand w/kg. Rider weight, in itself, is irrelevant in climbing terms. What is critical is w/kg, as I've said earlier. There's no particular reason why a heavy rider would struggle on climbs if his w/kg was competitive and sustainable compared to those he was riding with.
