Smackhead Express - Raleigh Routier

[wafter]

A quick / final(?) update as I can't be arsed and there doesn't seem to be a lot of interest..

Cracked on with the Routier fairly early this morning. First job was the re-check the frame alignment using some fine fishing line for a more precise / reliable value, suggesting that the seatpost tube was misaligned with the dropouts by about 2mm - with a reading from line to tube of 31mm on the DS and 35mm on the NDS.

I set about the frame with a long bit of steel tube, with a bit of rag attached to one end to protect the frame and a block of wood / another rag at the seatpost tube to lever against. After a sustained period of swearing and knocking over of things, I got to a value of 33mm each side. Unfotunately I'd failed to account for the fact that the rear wheel doesn't really like 120mm spacing (I need an additional 2mm washer to give clearance for the likely-non-original Shimano cassette at the RD hanger) and measuring the clearances again confirmed that the frame wanted around 34mm each side of the tube with the wheel fitted; which it was duly widened out to.

After more buggering about with axle alignment and wheel dish, with the leading edge of the wheel central in the chainstays I ended up with maybe 1.5mm wheel offset towards the DS at the seatstays / rim, rather than the 5-6mm I'd had previously.

With the frame inverted the rear wheel now also looks pretty well aligned with the down tube; rather than either offset or angled relative to the tube as it was previously.


Next the front wheel was stripped, cleaned and rebuilt with original spokes, hub and nipples with the "new" ally rim. Trued on the bike as best as possible, tyre fitted.. brakes re-centred, fitted with new cheapo, ebay-sourced "Jagwire" rubber blocks and set up.

I also fitted the "new" Selle Royal saddle and punted the seatpost height up a bit.


Went out to get some eggs (there were no eggs ) and shake the bike down.. had to play with the rear axle as the NDS evidently wasn't tight enough; allowing the wheel to skew and rub. The front wheel also has some eccentricity to it, although this looks due to tyre fit rather than a rim issue.

For those bothered the steel rims that came off weighed around 790g each while the ally replacements were around 460g - so a saving of 330g per wheel or (if my assumptions are correct) the equivalent of around 1300g saved on bike mass from an acceleration / inertia perspective. Since the new rims are geometrically similar to the old ones but their material is around 1/3rd as stiff they should also be more compliant.

The bike does seem maybe a bit more sprightly and nicer-riding, however this could be psychosomatic and ride quality isn't really a fair comparison on account of the new saddle.

Brakes are noticeably better than the fibre pads with chrome rims (and no doubt still bedding in); being acceptable if not stellar. They do feel a lot nicer running on straight rims while the front no longer squeals


Tbh I was looking forward to today as a cathartic and satisfying process, and while progress has been made there are still lots of little things that aren't right - although I've absolutely had enough today so they'll have to wait..

 

[Gunk]

A quick / final(?) update as I can't be arsed and there doesn't seem to be a lot of interest..

9 pages in, I think it is fair to say that there has been a fair amount of interest.

 

[wafter]

9 pages in, I think it is fair to say that there has been a fair amount of interest.

Certainly at the beginning; however it seems to have tailed off recently. Maybe it's the content - granted an enormous wall of text isn't very appetising, however I've had that much to do anyway stopping to take photos has become increasingly bothersome..


A hopefully-slightly-more-interesting update!

The only pic I took yesterday; being of the frame alignment tool - lashed up from fishing line, paperclips and the band that sometimes constrains a new innertube within its box. The idea was that it'd be less hassle to remove and refit, re-usable and viable for a range of different bikes.. there was smugness abound until I fitted it with the wheel in place then later casually gave the wheel a spin to check runout

After the somewhat ragged and unfulfilling end to yesterday's proceedings I attacked the bike again this morning - re-dishing the front wheel as I'd made a cack job of it last time, tweaking the brakes a bit more and pushing the saddle height up a fair bit more after measuring it.


Nice new brake blocks; which work well and appear to be a steal at £4.99 for two pairs from (IIRC) Hopkins cycles

The lashed up valve hole grommet is doing its job well; although who's to say how long it'll last..

I also sorted the eccentric tyre issue by depressurising it, giving it all a squeeze / tug in the right direction and re-inflating.

The magnet for the trip computer was relocated, as with it removed to tweak the spokes I noticed that the wheel had an obvious heavy spot (away from the valve, fap knows why) so I positioned it opposite to this and the wheel now looks pretty well balanced


Following this refreshingly brief spell of pissing about I got off down the road in search of eggs. Having scored two boxes I extended the short ride a bit more than usual since it was such a fantastic morning and privilege to be out in it tbh.

Instead of following the usual forbidden path I took a longer route around the periphery of some fields that brought me out at a track that's absolutely-not-a-right-of-way, separating me from the main road back into the village..

A few photos along the way:

A short stretch of fantastic, uncomplicated gravel..

The new saddle - less uncomfortable than it was when fitted to the Fuji, but then I've only done shorter journeys. Irritatingly, if predictably its single bolt allows the back to sag at maximum layback - not sure what to do about this yet...

The front brakes now work really nicely - clearance is well setup and lever operation feels positive and clean. Unsurprisingly not on a par with a nice set of hydro discs, but perfectly adiquate stopping ability if you yank hard enough (unlike the old fibre pads and chrome rims) and I'd say surprisingly good considering they're entry level and mostly nearly as old as I am..

I was getting some vibration from the mudguard on the caliper, but this appears to have been sorted as a result of the caliper setup.

The back brake's not so hot - as is often the case the lever pull's a bit more mushy while it's reluctant to reset once the lever is released. I think a new set of cables might not be a bad idea.

Also, not sure if it's intentional but the non-adjustable calipers give a lot of toe-in.

Given all the issues associated with the knobbly 32c tyres I'd been lamenting my decision not to play it safe and spend a bit more on some 28c slicks, however today's tame off-road route allowed the cheap, ancient Routier to prove its worth on terrain that modern marketing would insist you need a gravel bike for


The bike saw some fairly lumpy terrain today and I'm now more confident in the rims / wheel build as they seem to remain unaffected.

A much more favourable experience today than yesterday; although there are still things to be done.

I'm not overly happy with the saddle situation, while the rear brake's a bit squiffy in operation and there's a vibration from somewhere..

In addition the panier rack likes to migrate backwards when in use as the two clamping bolts used to secure it evidently aren't too clever.
I was going to replace them with socket cap alternatives but the thread's really, really odd (3/16"x28tpi IIRC) so it looks like I'm stuck with these. Wondering if they're bottoming out in their holes so might try some more washers.

Speaking of which, the holders for the threaded adjustors for the brakes could also do with some washers.. I have a glut of M5 items which should be near-as-dammit.

That concludes today's scintillating update 😊

 

[Reynard]

Have to admit, I do read this - always *something* to be learned by seeing how other people go about stuff, but just cos I don't comment doesn't mean I'm not paying attention...

I'd probably replace that seatpost with a modern integrated clamp jobbie that you can adjust with an allen key. SJS Cycles sell them in a variety of diameters IIRC. Keep meaning to get one for my Max, along with a set of alloy bars.

 

[Jameshow]

Nice inspiration to to get my touring bike built. Perhaps bring it to Devon!

 

[wafter]

Have to admit, I do read this - always *something* to be learned by seeing how other people go about stuff, but just cos I don't comment doesn't mean I'm not paying attention...

I'd probably replace that seatpost with a modern integrated clamp jobbie that you can adjust with an allen key. SJS Cycles sell them in a variety of diameters IIRC. Keep meaning to get one for my Max, along with a set of alloy bars.

Thanks - not that I'm an attention whore but it seems a bit pointless if nobody's apparently reading the thread. Appreciate your confirmation that you are

I did consider replacing the seatpost, but of course this is supposed to be a budget build so I'm reluctant to throw any more money at it than I have to..

Nice inspiration to to get my touring bike built. Perhaps bring it to Devon!

Cheers - I trust there will be a thread when you get started..?



up at silly O'clock this morning I did a few miles on the Fuji and swung by the LBS on the way back. Confidently proclaiming that I required an uncoated stainless brake cable inner, I was rewarded by the reassurance that these are the shop owner's preferred choice, for just the reasons I'd had in mind

Back at home I set about the Routier once more. Once I'd got over the need to sacrifice the lovely crimped-on brass cable ends (that now reside somewhere in the garden having been ejected at speed from the side cutters), both sets of brake cables were removed and attended to.

Only one of the four cable ends had a ferrule fitted, the other three having suffered to varying degrees as a result (and maybe because I'd once turned the bike upside down to work on it without remembering that the cables exit from the top of the levers ).

The rear cable was worst; bent, outer covering split and sitting skewed in the bush. Every time the lever was pulled it would spring upwards as the open coils of the bent section were compressed..

The damaged ends were lopped off with a cutting disc in the ever-impressive rotary tool, then all ends trued with the flat face of a grinding wheel. It appears that the cables are unlined

While all this was going on, the existing front cable and new rear cable were cooking away nicely in the wax pan. Both cables removed had some sticky oil present (as per @Gunk's experiences!) which was removed from the one I was keeping with some paraffin. All of the immediate parts were also cleaned with paraffin and a brush - cable outer ODs, cable clamps and adjustors..

I also cleaned the cable retainers on the top tube and gave that area a bit of a wax..

Once all was as it should be the new / existing cable assemblies were refitted with new ferrules where necessary. This became quite messy as a fair bit of wax was scraped off the cable as it was passed through various bits - probably best to fit them first next time (and keep them out of the pan) in order to get the most wax into the cable outer..

The adjustors were fitted with various washers; necessary to take up some slop in the rear one which is too long where it passes through the caliper - I suspect it's non-original..

Unsurprisingly considering the calipers are German all fittings are metric - which made life a bit easier..


I'd intended to "tin" the ends of the cables with solder; so that they could be withdrawn easily at a later date without having to remove a crimped-on finisher. This were precisely zero times; the solder failing to take to the front I think because it's galvanised, and the rear presumably because it'd previously been covered in wax..

I'd removed as little cable outers as possible to get back to a good base; I think they were perhaps a shade shorter than ideal to start with and they look a bit unbalanced on the bike (despite being shortened by a similar amount).. but it's not the end of the world and it saved me having to replace them!

All back together and the brakes feel much nicer - the already decent front feeling cleaner and more snappy with a lighter pull; the rear (as usual) not as nice but again much better than it was and certainly acceptable - returing positively to its stop when released; unlike previously.


I also flipped the clamps on the saddle in the hope that it might make it "bottom out" to a more acceptable position. It didn't, however it does stay where I put it now. Problem is that its favoured orientation is a bit high at the back, which feels a bit too intimate for my liking..

A good chunk of the morning well-spent IMO; and another shifty and hitherto-untouched area of the bike acceptably sorted with a tangible improvement in ride experience as a result

 

[All uphill]

I enjoy this, too, and read every word.

That's a lovely bike and I consider reading your threads and those of other people who rejoice in low-cost cycling as preparation for my next project, whatever it is.

Thank you for taking the time to share your experiences.

 

[wafter]

I enjoy this, too, and read every word.

That's a lovely bike and I consider reading your threads and those of other people who rejoice in low-cost cycling as preparation for my next project, whatever it is.

Thank you for taking the time to share your experiences.

Thanks - appreciate you saying so and hope you'll post similar when your next project arrives


A few more points following yesteday's post..

It seems my attempts to apply solder to the ends of the cables failed for two reasons - stainless apparently won't take solder at all, while galvanised cables apparently will - however I think I ruined everything by over-cooking them with a propane torch (I don't have a soldering iron)..

I also noticed that the front cable adjustor is apparently missing a locking nut, which obviously wants addressing at some point but I'm not in a hurry to pull it all to bits again.


Finally I did a bit more research on the brake calipers. The front is apparently an *edit* Weinmann 720, the back a Weinmann 730A. I'm not sure of the difference or if the latter is original / has been retro-fitted for some reason..

I'm also not sure if the caliper on the rear is legit or a copy - it seems that after Weinmann went to the wall in the early '90s various far eastern manufacturers continued selling copies of their calipers using the same naming convention. Neither caliper appears to have the Weinmann brand marked on them, but it seems that this might have been something that disappeared as the products were gradually cheapened over the years..

 

[Oldhippy]

Excellent and proves again you don't need to spends fortunes and learning new stuff is good. Great thread.

 

[wafter]

Excellent and proves again you don't need to spends fortunes and learning new stuff is good. Great thread.

Thanks - it's certainly been a valuable, if sometimes frustrating learning experience



I've just wheeled the bike over the road to the car in preparation for returning it to work tomorrow; and couldn't resist a quick blast round the village in the fading light..

Other than the back tyre still rubbing a shade when rolling and more when under power it feels pretty nice; and certainly a lot closer to a decent bike than a clunky deathtrap, as it certainly was when I first got it and until recently to an extent on account of the wheels / brakes.

It actually feels pretty sprightly now and noticeably more responsive when smashing it up a hill out of the saddle; although from the numbers (let's say it's lost 1.5% effective mass from total in the wheels, from an acceleration standpoint) I'm not sure as I'd actually be able to notice this.. so it's potentially all psychological.


I do think the new saddle's made it look no end better (not nec. a good thing!) and I really love the way it looks now - IMO a lot classier than the rest of the entry-level gaspipe Raleigh offerings of the same vintage. For the moment it's potentially increased theivability is offset by the fact I'll not be locking it up in the street / anywhere shifty for the forseeable; although it will be kept in a mate's garden.

They live in a more crimey part of town but it will be under a cover, the gardens are fairly enclosed and they have a big shouty dog.. so fingers' crossed it'll still be in my possession by the time I get to move back to the city; if this ever happens..

 

[GTZaskar]

Really enjoyed reading about your project.

I’ve come to own one of these bikes as my Father’s friend passed this on to him. It hasn’t been used since 1989.

We’ve put on new wheels and tyres and managed to get it working. It needs a lot of work but rides very harsh. Does your bike ride comfortably on bad roads?

You wouldn’t know the seat post dimensions?

I’m hoping a to replace the original post and saddle to damp it down a little.

 

[wafter]

Really enjoyed reading about your project.

I’ve come to own one of these bikes as my Father’s friend passed this on to him. It hasn’t been used since 1989.

We’ve put on new wheels and tyres and managed to get it working. It needs a lot of work but rides very harsh. Does your bike ride comfortably on bad roads?

You wouldn’t know the seat post dimensions?

I’m hoping a to replace the original post and saddle to damp it down a little.

Thanks and nice work with yours

End of the day it's an entry-level gaspipe frame so it's never going to give a super-smooth ride, however the saddle plays a large part in this. If yours is like mine it's not got rails and the clamp attaches very rigidly to the plastic underside of the seat, which gives very little compliance.

Replacing my saddle helped a lot in this regard (plus I couldn't get as much layback as required) so I think you're on the right track. The seatpost is the standard old-school stepped affair that you should be able to get a clamp / saddle for; no need to replace the whole post. Not sure on the size but I think it might be something a bit odd; which is another reason to hang onto the original.

I trust you'll be starting a thread on yours at some point..?

 

[wafter]

Sadly with circumstances as they are the bike has become a bit of a study in the effects of living outside

As it stands the Routier shares a bike-tarp with two others outside at the office. I've been keeping a close eye on it, and while it's fared fairly well on the whole, I've noticed the odd spot of corrosion - most notably on the chainset but also on the chain and seatpost, which already had a light rash on it.

In an effort to arrest the brown pox I've cleaned up the chainset with some fine wire wool and treated it with a DIY wax paste of 50/50 paraffin wax and oil by mass. This has also been applied to the seatpost too. Hopefully this will prevent, or at least slow the corrosion.. I guess time will tell.

In other news I think I hate the gears, as I spent most of my time on the small chainring / probably middle three sprockets on the back, so tbh given the silly (for a town bike) 50/40 chainset I'd probably be better off with a single 38 or 40 on the front..

Finally I'm paying for my decision to chuck the whole cassette into the wax pan when rebuilding the rear wheel... on the one hand it's done a great job of preventing corrosion as intended, on the other I think the wax has found its way into the freewheel - making its action somewhat lazy and resulting in a slack chain during coasting. Not the end of the world, but probably something that will warrant the freewheel stripping to sort out...

 

[Gunk]

Buy some ACF50 and treat all the chrome parts

 

[wafter]

Buy some ACF50 and treat all the chrome parts

Thanks - I did look at that but baulked at the cost somewhat. I'll see how the DIY stuff goes and if I still end up with corrosion I might put my hand in my pocket for some proper stuff as I suspect it could have other applications - treating the inside of frames etc. It would be good to have some sort of corrosion protection that's not oil of grease.