Soensport or Soens Brothers Name Transfer

[Bill Soens]

Sorry can't put a face to the name. Forget what I had for breakfast now ! I did all my two year National Service in Catterick and raced a bit around there. I recall riding at a grass track meet in Richmond, North Yorks and there were two brothers from Middlesbrough who worked me over on the last lap of the 5 miles championships. One held me down whilst the other went off the front ! Had to kick back, go around and jyst failed to make the gold ! Whether the above chap is one of the brothers I cannot say.

 

[Bill Soens]

Found this in my Dad's old scrap book

View attachment 56079

Some good old names listed. Do we have any relatives on the forum?

- my dad Vic Ward, his fastest pre war ride. He was called up after this. Aged 20. Probably done on 86 fixed.
- Eddie Soens the subject of this thread.
- Alan Barker from the Warrington and a friend of my dads. Many years later (1968) Alan offered me a lift home after a 25 on the O2 course. I'd ridden out the previous day and stayed at the YHA. But I turned him down and rode home again!

- it was Alan's dad, Harry Barker that started the Warrington and my dad went onto start the Prescot RC after the war. Now called Prescot Eagle after merging with the Liverpool Eagle.


Cheers Keith

hello. Interesting finishing sheet. I note the date which is interesting more so since my late father, Eddie Soens, would have been posted to India/Burma very soon after this and didn't return home until the end of 1945.

What could be more interesting is that I have a photograph that "could£ have been taken at that time or even at the end of that race. Certainly two of the riders are featured in the photo:- Eddie Soens in the centre and the taller man on his left (our right) is Jackie Sullivan, who was third in your race card.

Regards. Bill Soens.

 

[Sharky]

hello. Interesting finishing sheet. I note the date which is interesting more so since my late father, Eddie Soens, would have been posted to India/Burma very soon after this and didn't return home until the end of 1945.

What could be more interesting is that I have a photograph that "could£ have been taken at that time or even at the end of that race. Certainly two of the riders are featured in the photo:- Eddie Soens in the centre and the taller man on his left (our right) is Jackie Sullivan, who was third in your race card.

Regards. Bill Soens.

Hi, yes my dad was called up soon after this and went into the RAF, also posted to India!
Cheers Keith

 

[biggs682]

just got back from picking up another Soens bike , this time its badged as a Jim Soens unsure of its previous life will start a new thread when i have some better pics and details . Cant wait to hear comments from @Bill Soens

 

[Bill Soens]

No reason to assume that this is not built by Jim Soens. It is a fairly standard and basic frame of the 1960's with plenty of space for mudguards as is obvious. In its original form it would have been used by a club rider for club runs and possibly for weekend racing by taking off the mudguards and changing the wheels - a very common practice then - we all did it although most competitors had frames with the guard eyes removed from the front/read ends and the clearances were tighter. the shape is fairly reminiscent to that offered by Holdsworth at the time. Whether Jim Soens built it or badged a Holdsworth is of no importance because the frame is not less than fifty years old and all credit to the builder and to those who looked after it for two generations. Obviously the saddle and handlebars are incorrect for this bike and it could be converted into an excellent touring machine.

 

[biggs682]

H

No reason to assume that this is not built by Jim Soens. It is a fairly standard and basic frame of the 1960's with plenty of space for mudguards as is obvious. In its original form it would have been used by a club rider for club runs and possibly for weekend racing by taking off the mudguards and changing the wheels - a very common practice then - we all did it although most competitors had frames with the guard eyes removed from the front/read ends and the clearances were tighter. the shape is fairly reminiscent to that offered by Holdsworth at the time. Whether Jim Soens built it or badged a Holdsworth is of no importance because the frame is not less than fifty years old and all credit to the builder and to those who looked after it for two generations. Obviously the saddle and handlebars are incorrect for this bike and it could be converted into an excellent touring machine.

Had a quick look and look's like a 6 digit frame number, looks like first two are letters and last 4 are numerical. Thanks @Bill Soens

 

[biggs682]

frame number is 114466 so does that mean 1966 as build year ??

 

[Sharky]

Hard to see the name in this photo, but it looks like a Soens:-

And there is an interesting story behind this picture.

I was on a club run (in about 2010) with my current club (Gravesend CC), only a couple of years ago and chatting to one of my club mates about old times about when we all started cycling. I told that my first club was on Merseyside I'd joined in 1966. He said that when he was at University in Aberdeen, he had shared a Lab Room with a cyclist that had come from Merseyside and did I know him. I almost fell of my bike with surprise. I did know him him.

The cyclist was "Phil" and he had been a great inspiration to me a young 16 yr old when I first started going on club runs and racing. I shared many a ride with him, including a 2-up when he almost destroyed me. My parents relocated to Kent in 1969 and I haven't seen him for over 40 years.

The photo of the Soens and Phil, was taken by my Gravesend clubmate at the Lab Room in Aberdeen University in 1972. A huge coincidence, considering the number of years and miles.

Some of the older CC'ers may recognise the chap in the photo. He was a very good rider.

Cheers Keith

 

[biggs682]

Here are some long awaited pictures of my recent Jim Soens purchase .

Frame number looks to 114466 , 3 speed Sturmey Archer AW hub looks to be date stamped 3 63 . Crankset is a Williams just need to work out the coding on it .

The more i look the more i am sure paintwork is original

A maiden 1.5 mile ride round the block once I adjusted the brakes and I can say it rides nice all 3 gear's seemed to select ok. If there was a complaint it would be the saddle

 

[Sharky]

A C34?
I was riding a steel C34 on the bike on the left reminds me of it.

Cheers Keith

 

[biggs682]

finally had a spare half an hour yesterday and dropped a 700c fr wheel into the fr forks to see if the brakes had enough drop to enable me to use 700 wheels I can confirm the fronts do have so just need to check the rear dropout width and brake drop and then the fun starts , if poss I would like to get a singlespeed 700 wheel in there and ride in that format but will see

 

[Bill Soens]

Hard to see the name in this photo, but it looks like a Soens:-

View attachment 74060

And there is an interesting story behind this picture.

I was on a club run (in about 2010) with my current club (Gravesend CC), only a couple of years ago and chatting to one of my club mates about old times about when we all started cycling. I told that my first club was on Merseyside I'd joined in 1966. He said that when he was at University in Aberdeen, he had shared a Lab Room with a cyclist that had come from Merseyside and did I know him. I almost fell of my bike with surprise. I did know him him.

The cyclist was "Phil" and he had been a great inspiration to me a young 16 yr old when I first started going on club runs and racing. I shared many a ride with him, including a 2-up when he almost destroyed me. My parents relocated to Kent in 1969 and I haven't seen him for over 40 years.

The photo of the Soens and Phil, was taken by my Gravesend clubmate at the Lab Room in Aberdeen University in 1972. A huge coincidence, considering the number of years and miles.

Some of the older CC'ers may recognise the chap in the photo. He was a very good rider.

Cheers Keith

This is an interesting photo but I cannot place a name on the cyclist - sorry. However, the bike is genuine and one that I would have built about 1959, looking that the transfers (decals). It would have been badged Eddie Soens, of course. The head tube transfer is a copy of the Liverpool Unity Roads Club badge/medal, simply altering the wording. the club complained that I had copied their design, which was perfectly true but sine they hadn't registered it as a trade mark there was nothing they could do. The club folded shortly after, after a member ran off with the club funds ! Nice chap ! Best wishes.

Bill Soens.

 

[Bill Soens]

frame number is 114466 so does that mean 1966 as build year ??

No Sorry. Doesn't mean anything to me. Bill

 

[biggs682]

finally had a spare half an hour yesterday and dropped a 700c fr wheel into the fr forks to see if the brakes had enough drop to enable me to use 700 wheels I can confirm the fronts do have so just need to check the rear dropout width and brake drop and then the fun starts , if poss I would like to get a singlespeed 700 wheel in there and ride in that format but will see

well a bit more tinkering this morning has found forks stamped number does not match frame number so non original forks , rear drop outs are 126mm oln and the brakes drop has enough adjustment to allow me to run 700c's

which is good news so just got to decide single or gears

 

[Rob Elliott]

This is a really interesting set of photographs and I can confirm that this is a frame that I built roughly 1960-65. The dearth of brazed on fittings was a fashion at that time when riders would come back from Belgium with stories of how steel frames would crack due to extra brazings - never happened to me but the fashion came and went quickly. This really is a touring frame in that the mudguard eyes are still on the front and rear drop-outs. Also the gap on the front forks is slightly wider to take guards. Racing machines had the eyes removed and were tighter in the gaps. Weight was much the same and was the geometry. You need to alter the saddle position and turn the clip the other way, putting you further behind the bottom bracket. This will be more comfortable. Lower the bars and it will then steer better and then roll them up very slightly so that the bottoms are not parallel with the floor. All this will improve the handling and comfort.

The seat pillar looks to be the wrong size. It should be a 27.2 mm pillar. By crushing the frame in this way, the seat tube would need to be reamed out properly.

Best wishes.

Bill Soens.

Bill,

Many apologies for not responding to this sooner - I have not visited the forum for a while and hence missed this useful note.

I am obviously really pleased my frame is one of yours! What you say about it being a touring frame is interesting - it had never occurred to me before that the gaps would be wider to accommodate mudguards, although I have often wondered why it had eyes. Was it the practice to remove the eyes, or were racing frames generally made without them? I take your point about the saddle position and bar angle - I have never ridden it quite like this, but just popped them back on for the photos having started to loosen everything for dismantling. I must admit though that I have always had to push the seat forward, but should probably get a shorter stem - the frame has always been a shade too big for me, but once I saw it in Twiddle's I wasn't going to let that stop me having it. And thanks for confirming the seat pillar size. I should be able to fix the deformation.

Returning to the original subject of the thread, there is an issue with transfers on which I would welcome your insight. How many Soens logos were there? I have only seen those sold by Hilary Lloyd plus the ones on my frame (copies of which I still haven't managed to source, so the bike is staying as it is for now). I was wondering if there was any pattern to the transfers. For example, if someone bought a frame from you was there a "touring frame" logo, a "race frame" log and a "track frame" logo, or is this just daft wishful thinking on my part?

Finally, as far as I know, the transfers on my frame are the only Soens ones I have seen with the flag and olympic rings. Would this have been a "special" from around the time of the 1960 or 1964 Olympic Games, or some other event, or is that nonsense too?

Many thanks for your contributions on the site - it has been really interesting so far.

Very best wishes,

Rob Elliott