Came across this forum while looking to see if there's any news on the Grenadier's release date...and you know when you just have to say something?...
I just cannot believe all this about the Grenadier. It seemed a great idea, but I just cannot comprehend how it's going to be a success. In fact, I can't believe that it will actually get to production. For possibly the first time in my life (I'm 62 and a half) I can't see something that everyone else is apparently seeing! First of all, it's already dated - in both its design and its necessity. More than that, it isn't in any way 'British'. More than that, it will cost too much for old tech. More than that, the market for this vehicle isn't large enough for Ineos to make more than break-even. Much more than all that - have you seen the sheer number of competitors whose vehicles drift into the market for the Grenadier? It seems that every week, a new electric pick-up truck is announced in the US. Yes, electric, because the Grenadier is using diesel...diesel??? The days of diesel died a few years back before the Grenadier was even thought about! Oh, yes, Ineos is talking about an EV or a fuel cell, but can you imagine how much that is going to add to the final showroom cost? And on top of everything, Rivian are going to smash any sales the Grenadier could have got in the US (the world's largest car market).
This is all blowing my mind (because it's making me assess whether I have lost the plot, seriously). How on earth can this vehicle even make it to production? It seems to have everything against it - from the cost to the drivetrain. If this had been a larger Suzuki Jimny (the size of the old Defender 90) I would not only be singing its praises, but shifting money from my accounts to buy one. But it isn't! It's aimed at the wrong market, it looks old fashioned, it's made in France with a BMW diesel engine, it's too expensive, it isn't electric, and it already has way too many competitors for the overall market that it will be slotted into.*
* and I want to clarify that. The market for the Grenadier as a capable 4x4 in the rough stuff is VERY small. It's restricted to electricity companies, the RNLI, rescue teams, and some well-orf people who like to go fourbyfouring in something costing over twice what my first house cost me. The wider market, which is 4x4s which are essential to get to Tescos, include far too many capable rivals, like the Defender, the Jeep Wrangler, and the Ford Bronco (in the US - god help Land Rover and Ineos if Ford decide to sell the Bronco in Europe!). But more importantly, this market is about to get EVs, like the aforementioned Rivian, and the Wrangler Megneto, as well as Ford electric pick ups, and a myriad of other EV pick ups from various makers.
What am I not seeing? Why does there appear to be so many enthusiastic supporters of this Grenadier? How can you even think it will make it to production, let alone sell, and let alone sell in numbers large enough for Ineos to make a profit? If all you enthusiasts are right, then I'm very wrong. I can't be a bit wrong, it would have to be very. But I'm sure I'm right. EVEN IF it does get made, for the life of me I cannot see a market large enough for it to stay in production when everything about it is 'wrong' (engine, design, market, rivals, cost). Please tell me why I'm wrong - I genuinely would like to hear what you have to say.
Oh, and hello everyone - very new to cycling again after a break of 50 years!
I just cannot believe all this about the Grenadier. It seemed a great idea, but I just cannot comprehend how it's going to be a success. In fact, I can't believe that it will actually get to production. For possibly the first time in my life (I'm 62 and a half) I can't see something that everyone else is apparently seeing! First of all, it's already dated - in both its design and its necessity. More than that, it isn't in any way 'British'. More than that, it will cost too much for old tech. More than that, the market for this vehicle isn't large enough for Ineos to make more than break-even. Much more than all that - have you seen the sheer number of competitors whose vehicles drift into the market for the Grenadier? It seems that every week, a new electric pick-up truck is announced in the US. Yes, electric, because the Grenadier is using diesel...diesel??? The days of diesel died a few years back before the Grenadier was even thought about! Oh, yes, Ineos is talking about an EV or a fuel cell, but can you imagine how much that is going to add to the final showroom cost? And on top of everything, Rivian are going to smash any sales the Grenadier could have got in the US (the world's largest car market).
This is all blowing my mind (because it's making me assess whether I have lost the plot, seriously). How on earth can this vehicle even make it to production? It seems to have everything against it - from the cost to the drivetrain. If this had been a larger Suzuki Jimny (the size of the old Defender 90) I would not only be singing its praises, but shifting money from my accounts to buy one. But it isn't! It's aimed at the wrong market, it looks old fashioned, it's made in France with a BMW diesel engine, it's too expensive, it isn't electric, and it already has way too many competitors for the overall market that it will be slotted into.*
* and I want to clarify that. The market for the Grenadier as a capable 4x4 in the rough stuff is VERY small. It's restricted to electricity companies, the RNLI, rescue teams, and some well-orf people who like to go fourbyfouring in something costing over twice what my first house cost me. The wider market, which is 4x4s which are essential to get to Tescos, include far too many capable rivals, like the Defender, the Jeep Wrangler, and the Ford Bronco (in the US - god help Land Rover and Ineos if Ford decide to sell the Bronco in Europe!). But more importantly, this market is about to get EVs, like the aforementioned Rivian, and the Wrangler Megneto, as well as Ford electric pick ups, and a myriad of other EV pick ups from various makers.
What am I not seeing? Why does there appear to be so many enthusiastic supporters of this Grenadier? How can you even think it will make it to production, let alone sell, and let alone sell in numbers large enough for Ineos to make a profit? If all you enthusiasts are right, then I'm very wrong. I can't be a bit wrong, it would have to be very. But I'm sure I'm right. EVEN IF it does get made, for the life of me I cannot see a market large enough for it to stay in production when everything about it is 'wrong' (engine, design, market, rivals, cost). Please tell me why I'm wrong - I genuinely would like to hear what you have to say.
Oh, and hello everyone - very new to cycling again after a break of 50 years!
. The Grenedier reminds me of them. Defender is popular amongst customisers , it’s quite a niche market but currently growing and the value of defenders is going up . Maybe the Grenedier will go the same way? Or is it the rich billionaire play toy ? I dunno
