What upgrade?

[thatname]

Aside from wheels which has been mentioned i would say a decent carbon seat post can make a hell of a difference to your ride. Not in performance so much (perhaps a bit of weight loss) but comfort.
Other beneficial upgrades of course are replacing components to 105 when needed over time and a decent set of cables and sleeves every year. Bottom brackets always go at some point so its worth upgrading these too as they will last considerably longer in my experience. Nothing worse than having a grinding BB during your ride.

 

[winjim]

I think we've all been touched by the "yellow saddle et all" at some point! It seems you need a physics degree and to list full justification (showing your calculations) if you want to buy anything!

I think you need to think about what sort of riding you are doing and why you want to "upgrade", and I think @Yellow Saddle is just pointing that out. I rather enjoy his sardonic style. The OP has given no indication as to what they are trying to achieve with an upgrade, what sort of riding they do, or why they feel their current equipment is holding them back, so it's really an impossible question to answer.

Also define "upgrade". 11 speed Super Record is just about the "best" groupset I can think of, but I wouldn't put it on a commuter, or a tourer, or an Audax bike, or a crit racer that was going to be crashed a lot, or a bike for club runs that I didn't have time to strip down and maintain after every ride. In fact I wouldn't put it on any bike because I don't ride to a level where it would make any difference to me. I am putting 11speed Chorus on one of my bikes, but that's mainly because it's shiny and I want it, which can also be a justifiable reason .

See my wheelbuilding thread for my thoughts on wheel upgrades .




Is "touched by the yellow saddle" a euphemism?

 

[Justinslow]

Below is a reply to a thread I started in the "REVIEW" section regarding a wheelset by Mr Yellow saddle.

"Stop weighing stuff. This is not a prem baby in an incubator. It is a bike. Go ride and show us photos of the great places you visited."

My, how we all laughed at that.
If you have nothing to say regarding the thread then say nothing.

 

[Cyclist33]

Below is a reply to a thread I started in the "REVIEW" section regarding a wheelset by Mr Yellow saddle.

"Stop weighing stuff. This is not a prem baby in an incubator. It is a bike. Go ride and show us photos of the great places you visited."

My, how we all laughed at that.
If you have nothing to say regarding the thread then say nothing.

Why did you laugh at it?

When you say "If you have nothing to say" you actually mean "If you don't agree with me"..!

 

[Justinslow]

Why did you laugh at it?

When you say "If you have nothing to say" you actually mean "If you don't agree with me"..!

I didn't laugh, some did though (from the likes)
It's not about agreeing with me or not, my thread was a "REVIEW" of a wheelset with quoted weights - facts, just in case somebody might find it useful in the future when maybe considering buying some!
It's just another smarmy comment and not the first or probably the last as we can see by this thread.
(Maybe I should have took a few pics of the wheels with a nice scenic background and mentioned how shiny they were instead)

 

[Yellow Saddle]

I didn't laugh, some did though (from the likes)

It's not about agreeing with me or not, my thread was a "REVIEW" of a wheelset with quoted weights - facts, just in case somebody might find it useful in the future when maybe considering buying some!

It's just another smarmy comment and not the first or probably the last as we can see by this thread.

(Maybe I should have took a few pics of the wheels with a nice scenic background and mentioned how shiny they were instead)

I think you contradicted yourself there. "We" certainly is inclusive of "I", but that's neither here nor there. I'm just glad I could provide some entertainment at least.

I did have something to say but I think it went over your head. I tried to make my point gently and softened the message by saying your wheels look nice. But the point was that your review had no substance and was simply a reprint of a wheel brochure stating some facts, including the useless fact of what it weighted. It was a brag about a obviously consumptive new purchase and a self-justification for why you did it. I am sorry that I had to spell it out.

For those who now wonder what thread is under discussion, here it is:

http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/superstar-elite-30-ultra-wheelset.178881/

The “special one” reference was a nudge-nudge-wink-wink reference to a previous discussion where someone claimed to have over-ruled science and who’s experiences totally contradicted reality. We get that a lot here.

Your review also tacitly perpetuated the old, old myth that wheel weight is somehow very important. Have we not debated that point very extensively right here, less than a month ago?

If you overlooked the debate, here it is:

http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/road-racing-aero-wheels.173743/

But I am sure you peeked in at the time.

As for the OP of this thread, my take on these “upgrades” can be found in the above thread, precisely here:

http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/road-racing-aero-wheels.173743/page-2

Even though it predates your question, you’ll notice it predicts the outcome thereof.

Your questions regarding upgrades is a particularly good example of type of repetitive upgrade thread and it’s lapdogs who constantly chip in with the same old myth about wheels. Your desire to “ugrade” is senselessly consumptive and totally vague and devoid of any objective. Whilst that is of course perfectly within your rights to do so, I lament the pseudo-scientific reasoning always given for these purchases and the way it denies readers the truth. There are only so many things you can change on your bike, why bother asking others to list them? It is an exercise in tyre-kicking and idle chat disguised as intellectual discussion about components. It is not a genuine question even though you think so.

Go ride, show us pictures of your latest finds in the countryside. Podium photos will also carry some cred.

 

[Justinslow]

I think you contradicted yourself there. "We" certainly is inclusive of "I", but that's neither here nor there. I'm just glad I could provide some entertainment at least.

I did have something to say but I think it went over your head. I tried to make my point gently and softened the message by saying your wheels look nice. But the point was that your review had no substance and was simply a reprint of a wheel brochure stating some facts, including the useless fact of what it weighted. It was a brag about a obviously consumptive new purchase and a self-justification for why you did it. I am sorry that I had to spell it out.

For those who now wonder what thread is under discussion, here it is:

http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/superstar-elite-30-ultra-wheelset.178881/

The “special one” reference was a nudge-nudge-wink-wink reference to a previous discussion where someone claimed to have over-ruled science and who’s experiences totally contradicted reality. We get that a lot here.

Your review also tacitly perpetuated the old, old myth that wheel weight is somehow very important. Have we not debated that point very extensively right here, less than a month ago?

If you overlooked the debate, here it is:

http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/road-racing-aero-wheels.173743/

But I am sure you peeked in at the time.

As for the OP of this thread, my take on these “upgrades” can be found in the above thread, precisely here:

http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/road-racing-aero-wheels.173743/page-2

Even though it predates your question, you’ll notice it predicts the outcome thereof.

Your questions regarding upgrades is a particularly good example of type of repetitive upgrade thread and it’s lapdogs who constantly chip in with the same old myth about wheels. Your desire to “ugrade” is senselessly consumptive and totally vague and devoid of any objective. Whilst that is of course perfectly within your rights to do so, I lament the pseudo-scientific reasoning always given for these purchases and the way it denies readers the truth. There are only so many things you can change on your bike, why bother asking others to list them? It is an exercise in tyre-kicking and idle chat disguised as intellectual discussion about components. It is not a genuine question even though you think so.

Go ride, show us pictures of your latest finds in the countryside. Podium photos will also carry some cred.

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha, a lot to chew through there, I rest my case.

 

[Justinslow]

Oh and if you are going to correct my use of the English language, then sort out all your typo's and spelling mistakes!!

 

[Citius]

Oh and if you are going to correct my use of the English language, then sort out all your typo's and spelling mistakes!!

Typos doesn't need an apostrophe

 

[Justinslow]

Typos doesn't need an apostrophe

A what?

 

[Citius]

A what?

Sorry, I should have said 'appostroffee'...

 

[Justinslow]

Sorry, I should have said 'appostroffee'...

Oh, one of them, it was an upgrade.

 

[Kestevan]

I'm assuming here that Yellow Saddle, Citius and the like are all riding round on steel single speed bikes with wooden wheels and rod brakes...... no? why not?

Taking their arguments to the logical conclusion any technical "improvement" since the introduction of the chain driven "safety cycle" would not have been required and is merely pandering to consumerism.

Admittedly this is a case of reductio ad absurdum, but it does serve to illustrate the point that like most products advances in cycling are driven by small, incremental technical changes. Taken in isolation each change may not be necessary or have a measurable impact on performance, but taken over time they build up to an all-round better product.

It's also the fact that for a large number of people, the main driving force behind an "upgrade" is an aesthetic one. The fact it's "lighter, shinier, redder, or whatever" is the whole point, and assuming they can afford the outlay then good luck to them.

Oh, and finaly, without people spending money on upgrades/new bikes how long do you think the cycling industry will survive?

 

[Citius]

I'm assuming here that Yellow Saddle, Citius and the like are all riding round on steel single speed bikes with wooden wheels and rod brakes...... no? why not?

Do you drive a car? If so, presumably you drive a 'supercar', like a Ferrari, or Lamborghini, or some other such exotica.....no? why not?

 

[Yellow Saddle]

cut cut cut ....Admittedly this is a case of reductio ad absurdum, but it does serve to illustrate the point that like most products advances in cycling are driven by small, incremental technical changes.

Your claim that you've effectively used the reductio ad absurdum technique to disprove a statement is wrong. This is not how you use reduction ad absurdum.

Your second fallacy is the assumption that any one of us has disputed incremental technical changes. I don't see evidence of that anywhere. Further, aesthetics were and are acknowledged in the case in the link as well as elsewhere where I've argued the point. You can't use my ammo against me. I'm unsure what the Latin for that is.

Why not rather debate the absurdity of this question: "Is there a set route to upgrade?" I'll propose an answer: the one that makes the industry the most money, which is of course, frame first, then gruppo, then wheels, then Chris King hubs in the wheels.

So, what is your point again? Oh yes, we should spend money to keep an industry in the money.