What's with the fuel prices! And cheap whisky, apparently ...

[Chislenko]

I've not got it in my garden ! Have you seen the parking by Green Lane - they have about 4 chargers but I've not seen anyone using them. Or anyone even parking there but I mainly ride past on Sundays.

I know exactly where you mean, I have not seen anyone park there either on any day of the week.

I was told by the chaps that built it that it was to be a "Park and Ride" which I presumed when they started putting yellow lines around a lot of the estate it would be for workers at the factories / units etc.

I notice the aforementioned Great Bear in response have built a staff car park where the abandoned Peugeot was for many years.

I presume the other workers have bought a bike 😊

 

[Andy in Germany]

To be fair Andy it's not just lifestyle choices it is circumstances as well.

If we cut out the 1700 mile to get there and lived there instead we still couldn't have an EV as there is no way to charge it save for a potentially dangerous extremely long lead from our first floor window, across the communal landings and then down the communal stairs then across the communal gardens!!!

It is just not practical.

Understood, but living there would also be a choice. I''m not saying it's an immoral choice, but it's still a choice.

For example, I'd really like to live in the Black Forest, which is about 5km from here, but it is impractical with a bike because of the hilly nature of the place. I could just look for an apartment there and then say "I need a car" or I can decide that I don't want a car so I'm limited to living in the flatter Rhine Valley so I can commute to work by bike. That's a choice.

I'm not saying it's a better choice or a worse choice, just a choice, but we need to own the decisions we make and the consequences for us and for others.

 

[PeteXXX]

MrsPete found a novel way of paying more, ie over £2ppl, by accidentally filling up with posh petrol.
'Normal' E10 is perfectly good for her Kia..

 

[cougie uk]

I know exactly where you mean, I have not seen anyone park there either on any day of the week.

I was told by the chaps that built it that it was to be a "Park and Ride" which I presumed when they started putting yellow lines around a lot of the estate it would be for workers at the factories / units etc.

I notice the aforementioned Great Bear in response have built a staff car park where the abandoned Peugeot was for many years.

I presume the other workers have bought a bike 😊

Has to be said that industrial estate must have the best bike links in the country. I can't believe we used to just ride down the Welsh Road - I'd not do that for a suitcase of cash now !

 

[Chislenko]

Understood, but living there would also be a choice. I''m not saying it's an immoral choice, but it's still a choice.

Aye but Andy it was a choice made when the only electric car was a Sinclair C5 🙂

 

[MrGrumpy]

Being a nosey so and so and only fair to research charge points. There are a few round about my home , half are out of order . Just checked at work as well and plenty round about but again quite a few out of order ! Not exactly filled with confidence!! App I used was Zap Map . However I’m sure you could probably get charged up . £1.60 connection fee and 15p per Kw ? Dunno if that’s good or bad ? Others were 30p per Kw minimum charge cost of a quid , no connection charge from what I could see on those ones.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

Understood, but living there would also be a choice. I''m not saying it's an immoral choice, but it's still a choice.

For example, I'd really like to live in the Black Forest, which is about 5km from here, but it is impractical with a bike because of the hilly nature of the place. I could just look for an apartment there and then say "I need a car" or I can decide that I don't want a car so I'm limited to living in the flatter Rhine Valley so I can commute to work by bike. That's a choice.

I'm not saying it's a better choice or a worse choice, just a choice, but we need to own the decisions we make and the consequences for us and for others.

That sounds like a good reason to buy an e-bike. Or is it steep icy hills that would be the problem?

 

[chris-suffolk]

That's not what I said.

There's a very nice Ferrari parked round here that Google tells me costs over 200k.
I guess he's not that bothered about his petrol bill somehow.

No - you said that "There's plenty of EVs that are cheaper than petrol cars."

I just asked you to come with some, any, ONE, example of a car that's as cheap or cheaper in EV guise vs petrol. It's all very well comparing a 200k Ferrari against EV cars, you know as well as I do that that's just fudging the issue. By the way the Lotus Evija, an EV super car, is a mere $2.8 million, but that's not helpful either.

So, I'll ask again, just name ONE car (same spec and model) where the EV verison is cheaper than the ICE one. Just ONE, how hard can that be?

 

[gzoom]

So I do resent the chastening "no facts" parts of your post when I did specifically state that in our situation an EV was not an option for US!

Maybe I was too harsh with the 'facts' bit but the reality if local village in Portugal doesn't have EV chargers is all the more reason for local residents to push the public infrastructure to do more, in Portugal EV + solar would be no-brainer year round. Even here in not so sunny England, this month my electricity bill for the house+charging the car is going to be nothing more than standing charge.

In France there are literally chargers in every village, and they all work.

As for getting to Faro for examples, its not hard at all in any EV, and 3hrs of stops over 24hrs of driving seems pretty reasonable, unless your really believe you can drive non stop for 1000 miles.

 

[cougie uk]

No - you said that "There's plenty of EVs that are cheaper than petrol cars."

I just asked you to come with some, any, ONE, example of a car that's as cheap or cheaper in EV guise vs petrol. It's all very well comparing a 200k Ferrari against EV cars, you know as well as I do that that's just fudging the issue. By the way the Lotus Evija, an EV super car, is a mere $2.8 million, but that's not helpful either.

So, I'll ask again, just name ONE car (same spec and model) where the EV verison is cheaper than the ICE one. Just ONE, how hard can that be?

Calm down Chris.

I didn't say there are plenty of EVs that are cheaper than their petrol equivalents.

Because there aren't. Everyone knows that.

There are plenty of EVs that are cheaper than petrol cars though. Which is what I said.

 

[Chislenko]

Maybe I was too harsh with the 'facts' bit but the reality if local village in Portugal doesn't have EV chargers is all the more reason for local residents to push the public infrastructure to do more, in Portugal EV + solar would be no-brainer year round. Even here in not so sunny England, this month my electricity bill for the house+charging the car is going to be nothing more than standing charge.

View attachment 650751

In France there are literally chargers in every village, and they all work.

View attachment 650752

As for getting to Faro for examples, its not hard at all in any EV, and 3hrs of stops over 24hrs of driving seems pretty reasonable, unless your really believe you can drive non stop for 1000 miles.

View attachment 650753

If I go the France route (which I used to and yes once did it in one hit!!) door to door is 1700 mile each way.

Nowadays we go down to Plymouth - Santander which knocks the mileage down to circa 1050 mile.

After 23 hours on the boat I do the remaining 725 in one hit with maybe a coffee stop. My Euro 6 diesel has a tank capacity of circa 900 miles so don't need to stop for fuel.

Generally, it is the range that stops me being interested in EV at present, if and when one of the affordable EV's can do 500 mile on a charge then that would be the time I would look at them.

I hope that development over the next few years will get us to that point, just like ICE cars, my first Vauxhall Viva (58 bhp) did circa 30 mpg, my current diesel (180 bhp) does circa 58 mpg.

So for me it is all about how soon they can produce an EV that suits my needs.

But I think we should also remember that many people who live in Britain (and other countries) are shackled by where they live, apartment blocks, high rise, terraced streets where they can't get outside their own house so for me an EV is still something for the people who are perhaps a bit more fortunate with their living circumstances / financial status.

However, history repeats itself and I feel sure the early owners of ICE cars were the "better off"

 

[gzoom]

So, I'll ask again, just name ONE car (same spec and model) where the EV verison is cheaper than the ICE one. Just ONE, how hard can that be?

Combustion cars that have been 'turned' into EV rarely make good EVs, but compare 'similar' combustion cars with EVs, especially in the performance/higher end of the market and EVs make much more sense than combustion cars. The latest M3 Touring costs pretty much the same as a Taycan estate. The difference is one drinks Superunleaded at 25mpg, the other you can refuel from solar PV on the house for free. This is before you add in the M-car maintenance costs versus any EV which costs very little to keep on the road.

When I bought our EV, I priced up an equivalent combustion version, the purchase cost was near identical.

The difference now though is the combustion car would currently cost £300+ to refuel very 1000 miles, where as I've not had to pay for any fuel in the EV for the last month. EV costs are still the main barrier, but for the 'performance' sector am not sure why anyone would buy a combustion car over an EV?

 

[gzoom]

Nowadays we go down to Plymouth - Santander which knocks the mileage down to circa 1050 mile.

After 23 hours on the boat I do the remaining 725 in one hit with maybe a coffee stop. My Euro 6 diesel has a tank capacity of circa 900 miles so don't need to stop for fuel.

We are probably going do the Plymouth to Santander route next year......but driving 725 miles non stop, that what 7hrs+ of driving even if you averaged 100mph, no thank you. I love driving, but that isn't the kind of trip I want to do with no stops .

This is our road trip coming up in our EV in 2 weeks, I suspect you will want to do that drive in one hit, none stop, no sleep either . But for us we are breaking it up over 3 weeks to enjoy the destination. Cannot wait, might even take the bike on the back .

 

[cougie uk]

If I go the France route (which I used to and yes once did it in one hit!!) door to door is 1700 mile each way.

Nowadays we go down to Plymouth - Santander which knocks the mileage down to circa 1050 mile.

After 23 hours on the boat I do the remaining 725 in one hit with maybe a coffee stop. My Euro 6 diesel has a tank capacity of circa 900 miles so don't need to stop for fuel.

Generally, it is the range that stops me being interested in EV at present, if and when one of the affordable EV's can do 500 mile on a charge then that would be the time I would look at them.

I hope that development over the next few years will get us to that point, just like ICE cars, my first Vauxhall Viva (58 bhp) did circa 30 mpg, my current diesel (180 bhp) does circa 58 mpg.

So for me it is all about how soon they can produce an EV that suits my needs.

But I think we should also remember that many people who live in Britain (and other countries) are shackled by where they live, apartment blocks, high rise, terraced streets where they can't get outside their own house so for me an EV is still something for the people who are perhaps a bit more fortunate with their living circumstances / financial status.

However, history repeats itself and I feel sure the early owners of ICE cars were the "better off"

The thing is - cars have to be parked somewhere. It can't be that hard to equip a Car park with some slow chargers - it's just an electric socket and then some kind of contactless payment thing for the electric used.
Once people twig that they can make cash off of people charging then they'll be built - either where people overnight park or at work places.

There's a super charger hub to be built a few miles from me that's having about a dozen chargers and a cafe and showroom etc.

 

[Chislenko]

We are probably going do the Plymouth to Santander route next year......but driving 725 miles non stop, that what 7hrs+ of driving even if you averaged 100mph, no thank you. I love driving, but that isn't the kind of trip I want to do with no stops .

This is our road trip coming up in our EV in 2 weeks, I suspect you will want to do that drive in one hit, none stop, no sleep either . But for us we are breaking it up over 3 weeks to enjoy the destination. Cannot wait, might even take the bike on the back .

View attachment 650761

Enjoy your trip.

The 725 is not bad, automatic car, set the cruise at 120kph, the motorway down the west of Spain is empty, bit of congestion at Seville and that's it.