White van driver teaches me a lesson

[jezhiggins]

It was a stupid ill conceived overtake.
You shoud not have hit the van, it is asking for the situation to esculate.
The driver should not have then agressively used his vehicle as a weapon to "teach you a lesson".

It's not always easy to think rationally about these things though, is it?

A few weeks ago I was cycling to school with my 8 year old son. We were passed by a van, while we were passing between parked cars on both sides of the road and approaching a junction. He'd actually been waiting behind us, but seeing the end of the road seemed to spur him into action. I did slap the van. Hard. It wasn't a rational decision, it was a "what the hell are you doing you murderous idiot" decision. There wasn't enough room width ways, there wasn't enough room ahead of us, if any traffic turned into the road there was nowhere for it go, it was just a wrong decision in every way.

He slammed on the brakes and asked me what "my problem was" and to tell me I had "loads of room". I may not have made a huge amount of sense, but tried to suggest that if I could hit his van then perhaps he was a shade too close, what with the narrowness of the road, the junction, the bikes. "Now you're just being silly", he replied. He did, at that point, seem geniunely bewildered. I tried very hard to not swear or to directly insult him, but I was absolutely furious, and the conversation became rather heated. When he asked me "what are you going to do about it?", I realised that I had to stop or I was going to thump him, a lot, and I don't really want to think about how that might have gone.

In retrospect I suspect my slapping the van made him think he had actually run into me and gave him a fright. Maybe when he's telling his mates at work about the stupid cyclist who ranted at him over nothing, he'll remember that frightened feeling too.

 

[Wolf04]

It's not always easy to think rationally about these things though, is it?

A few weeks ago I was cycling to school with my 8 year old son. We were passed by a van, while we were passing between parked cars on both sides of the road and approaching a junction. He'd actually been waiting behind us, but seeing the end of the road seemed to spur him into action. I did slap the van. Hard. It wasn't a rational decision, it was a "what the hell are you doing you murderous idiot" decision. There wasn't enough room width ways, there wasn't enough room ahead of us, if any traffic turned into the road there was nowhere for it go, it was just a wrong decision in every way.

He slammed on the brakes and asked me what "my problem was" and to tell me I had "loads of room". I may not have made a huge amount of sense, but tried to suggest that if I could hit his van then perhaps he was a shade too close, what with the narrowness of the road, the junction, the bikes. "Now you're just being silly", he replied. He did, at that point, seem geniunely bewildered. I tried very hard to not swear or to directly insult him, but I was absolutely furious, and the conversation became rather heated. When he asked me "what are you going to do about it?", I realised that I had to stop or I was going to thump him, a lot, and I don't really want to think about how that might have gone.

In retrospect I suspect my slapping the van made him think he had actually run into me and gave him a fright. Maybe when he's telling his mates at work about the stupid cyclist who ranted at him over nothing, he'll remember that frightened feeling too.

No argument on any of this and sorry you had to experience the above. I'm assuming Magnatom is open to critisism, though I wasn't saying that slapping a van is wrong in the circumstances both his and indeed yours just that IMHO it will invariably ilicit a response from the driver as you have demonstrated.

 

[Origamist]

Part of the problem is that a lot of cyclists in Glasgow do gutter cycle. There is little cycle training here. So when car drivers see me taking my more assertive road position they get grumpy and think I am doing something wrong.

Magnatom, lots of people "gutter cycle" because it was part of the cycle training they received in the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s etc!

 

[magnatom]

Magnatom, lots of people "gutter cycle" because it was part of the cycle training they received in the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s etc!

Ok I will rephrase that.

There is little correct and up to date cycle training up here!

 

[Nigeyy]

I think you probably have many, many more cars around than me. It's at this point I have to boast that my personal record on one 23.5 mile commute was seeing only 20 cars being driven! (mind you it was pretty early in the morning). I also tend to cycle quiet routes -something that may not be an option for you.

Gutter cycling is not the sole domain of Glasgow -it happens a lot here as well. Usually however, the roads are about 20-50% wider on average -though some drivers here drive 50-100% worse (driving in Boston is can be an experience)

Never ceases to amaze me how any motor vehicle driver gets so het up when they get held up for all of 10 seconds though, and then of course usually have to stop at the next traffic light. Very sad.

Actually, I probably do a similar number of miles to you (I cycle about 50 miles a week all year round).

Part of the problem is that a lot of cyclists in Glasgow do gutter cycle. There is little cycle training here. So when car drivers see me taking my more assertive road position they get grumpy and think I am doing something wrong.

However, I will continue to take my more assertive positions, because it provides me with escape routes, should I need them. In fact, in this video I always had a way out, or could brake in time. Had I cycled like some do here, in the gutter and swinging out at the pinch point, I think my options would have been significantly reduced!

 

[hackbike 6]

I just get a little dismayed sometimes that people focus on where I should have been on the road.

Christ...what do I get then?

I was heavily criticised for riding in secondary by the better cyclists/cyclecraft crowd on here but I still ride the way I am happy with and it can also be varied if need be.Of course my years of experience seems to be overlooked.It might as well have been 32 minutes cycling.

I dont particulary like the aggressive driving I experience at times.Im in Hong Kong now and the driving is so different out here.

Also agree with the last posters post how a motorists will do a dangerous overtake to get 50 yards up the road to stop at the next traffic lights.

The driving in Britain is like so many other things in Britain.Crap.

 

[jamesgibby]

but tried to suggest that if I could hit his van then perhaps he was a shade too close, what with the narrowness of the road, the junction, the bikes. "Now you're just being silly", he replied. He did, at that point, seem geniunely bewildered.

After a similar incident with a car driver (I knocked on his window as he went past, It was the closest pass I have had in 5 years of commuting 75 miles a week about 2 inches from the end of my handle bars), I have decided if it happens again to ask if he would sign a witness statement that he passed so close I could touch his vehicle, as I would need one to be able to report him for careless driving.
At the time I just told him to get a copy of the highway code and educate himself on the legal way to overtake a bike

 

[Cab]

I also have to say that Magnatom seems to have certainly more close calls than me....

Seems to have a similar number to me. But I have found that wearing the helmet camera reduces this drastically. I think that the word is out on helmet cameras here in Cambs.

 

[Cab]

After a similar incident with a car driver (I knocked on his window as he went past, It was the closest pass I have had in 5 years of commuting 75 miles a week about 2 inches from the end of my handle bars), I have decided if it happens again to ask if he would sign a witness statement that he passed so close I could touch his vehicle, as I would need one to be able to report him for careless driving

Ingenious. The Moton won't sign, of course, but still, ingenious.

 

[magnatom]

Mmm. A few suggesting I report it, but I'm not getting a strong report vibe.

I think I will leave it this time. Contacting the company (had it been associated with one, would have been a no-brainer, but contacting the police I fear would just bring frustration and waste my time.

Sad but true.

 

[bryce]

Seems to have a similar number to me. But I have found that wearing the helmet camera reduces this drastically. I think that the word is out on helmet cameras here in Cambs.

Even though I cycle straight through central London twice a day, videoing my commute would be relatively boring and non-controversial. I just don't seem to get into any scrapes (only one serious crash that I couldn't do anything about).

I'm certainly not passive or slow (average 28-30kmh). Key to it, I think, is that I'm relatively calm - more likely to smile ruefully at someone rather than hit them (the first time only..) And as my old man said once 'always expect the idiot'. If someone deliberately tries to endanger me then my mindset changes immediately - but this is rare. What is the point of getting worked up over a near-miss when it is just that? To teach them a lesson or wind yourself up or both?

I have been 'left-hooked' (does that mean a hit or near-miss?) a few times (i.e. near misses) - but all of them have been when I've deliberately sped up before a turning to keep the left-turning cars behind me (to teach them a lesson) and they've not got the message.

Am I just lucky or too neurotic or should we all try to get along with eachother a bit better? i.e. cars, bikes, peds. Apologies if this sounds a bit utopian but it seems to work for me (touch wood).

 

[hackbike 6]

Am I just lucky or too neurotic or should we all try to get along with eachother a bit better? i.e. cars, bikes, peds. Apologies if this sounds a bit utopian but it seems to work for me (touch wood).

Agreed.

 

[jely]

don't apologise - it's true. i travel through central london all the time and i have had no "incidents". i'm not aggressive but i'm also not scared of getting in the thick of things. i always smile at people and wave thanks when someone lets me pass... and vice versa. sure i've yelled at some peds when they've started crossing the street but that's for their safety and so they remember to look next time... the only real incident i have had is when i was going too fast down london wall and subsequently ran into the back of a taxi.... (the light turned green and i thought he was moving, but apparently he wasn't!) ... and even then, i got off my bike and walked around to the driver to apologise - he was going to just ignore it... have to admit, was pretty funny seeing the 4 suits in the back sh't themselves though.

 

[magnatom]

Look back through all of my previous posts bryce (if you have the time or inclination!) and you will see that I have consistently advocated mutual respect on the roads. I challenge anyone on here to find any post or comment that I have made that suggests otherwise!

We all cycle in different environments, different traffic conditions, different cities. We all have different thresholds for what we class as dangerous driving. Some cycle near the curb, which will result in less conflict, but if a serious incident does occur will seriously reduce escape routes.

My videos show examples of what happens on the road. I'm not suggesting that each and every incident was terrible or life changing. In fact, if I didn't have the videos I am sure I would forget each one within a week or so (with the exception of one or two).

However, I post for a number of reasons that I have gone into detail about in the past (and possibly in a blog in the future ). Not necessarily because I just want to rant and rave about them.

 

[hackbike 6]

don't apologise - it's true. i travel through central london all the time and i have had no "incidents". i'm not aggressive but i'm also not scared of getting in the thick of things. i always smile at people and wave thanks when someone lets me pass... and vice versa. sure i've yelled at some peds when they've started crossing the street but that's for their safety and so they remember to look next time... the only real incidents i have had is two ped collisions in 1991/2006

You are me?