White van driver teaches me a lesson

[Origamist]

I agree, most would not know about it. However, probably a lot practice it and just don't know the terms.

From what I see on the roads, that is not the case at all and I cycle between 10-12000 miles a year, FWIW.

 

[dodgy]

Was that aimed at me Mikey? I reckon I've been pretty fair and my parting comment was that on balance, the WVM was in the wrong.

Dave.

 

[magnatom]

The guy was up your chuffer though, you can be in the right and still put yourself in danger, is it worth it?

Yes but what I am saying is that in the past, holding my position has dealt with this situation safely. On this occasion it did not, because he held no regard for my safety at all and wanted to teach me a lesson.

In fact the safest way for me to have dealt with this would probably have been to take a stronger position at and after the pinch point. I feel safer with him behind me (I know I am very unlikely to come off if not hit) than overtaking me close and braking as he did. It would be very, very unlikely that he would intentionally hit me from behind.

 

[Riding in Circles]

From what I see on the roads, that is not the case at all and I cycle between 10-12000 miles a year, FWIW.

I do that mileage as well, about 50 miles a week commuting, I average another 50 a week doing test rides and another 150 in leisure riding, most cyclists I see live in the gutter or on cycle paths, I prefer the road but will use a cycle lane if it suits my purpose.

 

[magnatom]

From what I see on the roads, that is not the case at all and I cycle between 10-12000 miles a year, FWIW.

Maybe I shouldn't have used the word 'lot', but a 'percentage' (I don't know the number of course) will practice primary/secondary riding without knowing the names.

 

[LLB]

I've got an idea Magnatom.

Get a study organised where they hand out helmet cams to volunteer cyclists, with the data collection done on a secure setup, then any incidents can be flagged by the cyclist on each day of upload, and the issues of inconsiderate/dangerous driving around cyclists in commuting situations can be assessed on a national level.

 

[Riding in Circles]

Yes but what I am saying is that in the past, holding my position has dealt with this situation safely. On this occasion it did not, because he held no regard for my safety at all and wanted to teach me a lesson.

In fact the safest way for me to have dealt with this would probably have been to take a stronger position at and after the pinch point. I feel safer with him behind me (I know I am very unlikely to come off if not hit) than overtaking me close and braking as he did. It would be very, very unlikely that he would intentionally hit me from behind.

He was already to close though, I would have let him go then reported him to the police, a couple of years ago I would have forced him to stop and pummeled him and his passenger but I have calmed down a bit these days, I have only physically assaulted one motorist in the last two years, which I am quite proud of, this also gives you a clue to how I used to be. I realised that a lot of the time I was putting myself in danger even though I was in the right and at some point I was going to end up as a grill ornament.

 

[yello]

I find this really difficult. I mean, I know that Magnatom and BentMickey are right in the cold letter of the law kind of a way. It is the WVs responsibility to deal with the cyclist, however they might be riding, in a safe manner. So perhaps I am too timid but I really don't like to intimidate someone, rightly or wrongly, especially when they are in charge of several tons of steel!

My personal take, and it is not a criticism but merely what I think I might have done given that I suspect WVM was getting a tad ratty having to sit behind me, is that I would have looked to have let him go, as I initially said, around the road sweeper sort of area. But a fair point is made by magnatom about that (vis-a-vis the sweeper being too close to the pinch point), and I might have stayed out.

I know you're weren't asking for comment on your riding Magnatom but you are asking whether to report WVM or not. So it is kind of difficult to answer that without at least taking into account whether he might have had any reason for doing what he did, not that it justifies his action in any way. It is however what I suspect the police would do hence me saying I didn't think it'd be worth your time reporting it.

 

[magnatom]

I've got an idea Magnatom.

Get a study organised where they hand out helmet cams to volunteer cyclists, with the data collection done on a secure setup, then any incidents can be flagged by the cyclist on each day of upload, and the issues of inconsiderate/dangerous driving around cyclists in commuting situations can be assessed on a national level.

Actually, I think that is a wonderful idea. However, it would have to be balanced, with motorists also taking part in the study.

In fact you would probably want to have some cyclists with and without camera and at the end of the ride ask them how many incidents they had. The cyclists without cameras would have secretly been supplied with one (without their knowledge). Then the footage could be compared and you could find out how the act of filming changed the perception of the number of incidents, compared to the real number.

If somebody had the time, money and inclination there are plenty of very interesting studies that could be done. For example, you could also use eyetrackers to see where the cyclists/drivers were looking, I have thought about a functional brain study looking at the visibility of cyclists under different light conditions and clothing (i.e. thresholds of perception and unconscious perception etc).

Can you tell I am a scientist?

 

[Riding in Circles]

Can you tell I am a scientist?

So when you called the van driver a twat, that was a scientific term?

 

[yello]

Language is a science!

 

[magnatom]

Yello, I have no problems at all with what you are saying. You always come across as reasoned .

You have to remember though, that in the cold light of day it is easy to make reasoned decisions. At the time I noticed he was too close and considering an overtake. I decided, rightly or wrongly, to stay out which was a split second decision. I certainly did not want to annoy him, as I have said, in the past, staying out has worked well and without incident.

It was as I approached the pinch point, and the fact that he remained close, that I started to worry. Up until that point I felt like it was under control. At this point I was probably too late to take any action other than carrying on.

I can understand how, looking at the footage from the comfort of a desk, that some could suggest that I pull over and let him past, however, at the time that did not seem like a reasonable option, and until I got close to the pinch point, it did not seem necessary. I was not to know that he would react that way.

If I was to pull over, every time someone threatened to overtake here, it would be every third day (at a guess). That is probably how often I safely negotiate situations like that. So I really don't think I did anything wrong (ignoring the letter of the law!) or that should have particularly upset him. It is his impatience, his willingness to risk my life and his aggression that is at fault here.

Not getting at anyone, just explaining myself.

 

[magnatom]

So when you called the van driver a twat, that was a scientific term?

Aren't you impressed that the swearing was kept to an absolute minimum!

 

[Riding in Circles]

Aren't you impressed that the swearing was kept to an absolute minimum!

Well you were on camera after all.

 

[magnatom]

Well you were on camera after all.

That's not stopped me in the past!