BentMikey and a Subaru Driver

[Differentpov]

How forgiving do you think the cyclist should be when, after using a horn to warn another road user of their presence (as the Highway Code suggests it must only be used for), the other party immediately stops, gets out of their vehicle, and swears aggressively at the cyclist?

Do you think he should react calmly, saying something along the lines of "That was really close - you nearly hit me mate"? Or do you think he should get off his bike and give the driver a punch in the face for his troubles?

Different POV, you are welcome to have a different point of view indeed, but it doesn't necessarily mean you are going to be right in every point (just like I am certain that not every viewpoint expressed on this forums is utterly correct either). ALL road users should treat each other with respect. No exceptions. Regardless of that, welcome, stay a while. Pull up a chair and have a cuppa.

Cheers my friend, my first friendly post! I agree we should respect each other more when it comes to roads usage, but it just gets my back right up when neighbourhood warriors purposely provoke the film other road users, then film them! I mean there are bigger priorities in life, get a grip! Unfortunately i live in a rural area and cyclists and horse riders cause more trouble than they are worth, they both think they own the road ( in my opinion), and HATE any form of motorised transport! I have been held up for 3 miles by 3 cyclists riding next to each other (3 abreast), and when i over took them at a place i saw fit and safe, they all gave the self-gratification artist sign, why does this happen, 2 abreast is illegal, but you all do it!

 

[cheadle hulme]

All the cyclists i see round my way ride two abreast, hold up traffic, jump red lights, ride on the pavement when something silly like a red traffic light dares to hold up their progress and generally disregard the rules, then complain when they get bollocked by other road users, cyclists need to be registered and have number plates, then they would stop the vigilante tactics and conform like everyone else!

Macclesfield Wheelers club run?

 

[PBancroft]

Cheers my friend, my first friendly post! I agree we should respect each other more when it comes to roads usage, but it just gets my back right up when neighbourhood warriors purposely provoke the film other road users, then film them! I mean there are bigger priorities in life, get a grip! Unfortunately i live in a rural area and cyclists and horse riders cause more trouble than they are worth, they both think they own the road ( in my opinion), and HATE any form of motorised transport! I have been held up for 3 miles by 3 cyclists riding next to each other (3 abreast), and when i over took them at a place i saw fit and safe, they all gave the self-gratification artist sign, why does this happen, 2 abreast is illegal, but you all do it!

Trust me when I say this - most cyclists do not hate motorised transport. Personally, I use it frequently.

I'll repeat that, because its worth saying twice. Cyclists do not hate cars.

Also, cycling two abreast is not illegal. It isn't. People might think it is, or think that it should be - but it isn't, and there are reasons why that is the case. You'll find things on that page which some cyclists do which are illegal, but not all of us do them - please do not paint us all with the same brush.

Part of the reason some people have started putting video cameras on their bikes is that in any road accident involving a cyclist, the cyclist will come off worse compared to the driver. We don't have metal shielding around us. Unfortunately the police are unable to take action in most cases, because its simply down to one road user's word against another. With recorded evidence they are able to get a prosecution, and get a dangerous road user off the road.

This is not targeted at cars because cyclists hate them. You will find just as many strong viewpoints from regular cyclists towards other cyclists who act in a dangerous manner on the road.

EDIT: It swings both ways of course - if the video actually shows the cyclist is in the wrong, its there for all to see! That's happened a fair bit on this very forum. I'll see if I can dig one of them out for you.

 

[GrasB]

Differentpov, 2 abreast isn't illegal, however it is not recommended in areas where you'll restrict the flow of traffic.

On your note of JRLing, I've had people on bikes try to push me off my bike for suggesting they adhere to red lights. I also now avoid the most convinent last 1.3miles to work to avoid the regular JRLing of car drivers, though the local council can be handed a fair amount of stick for that as they've managed to obsure 2 of the 3 traffic lights at that junction from a reasonable distance away with, ironically, road safety signs.

 

[Differentpov]

I've never run a red light in my life, nor do I ride on pavements. Yet around my way I see cars run the red lights quite frequently, car drivers who use the mobile phone whilst driving, car drivers who park on double yellow lines, or park blocking exits, or speeding.

Registration fixed none of those problems. It would be an expensive solution and wouldn't work anyway - better training for all road users is required, not one subset.

Parking badly and blocking access is one of my pet hates, and a car running a red light is infinately more dangerous than a cyclist doing the same thing. I personally think using a mobile is no more dangerous than changing radio stations or changing a cd, and we all do that everyday! Speeding i hate in built up populated areas, but is ok on a dry motorway when traffic conditions allow. I guess we all have bad apples in the bunch, but drivers generally do not pursue things over zealously in the same way "victimised" cyclists do, why is that?

 

[Fab Foodie]

All the cyclists i see round my way ride two abreast, hold up traffic, jump red lights, ride on the pavement when something silly like a red traffic light dares to hold up their progress and generally disregard the rules, then complain when they get bollocked by other road users, cyclists need to be registered and have number plates, then they would stop the vigilante tactics and conform like everyone else!

Riding 2 abreast is LEGAL, riding MORE than 2 abreast is not.
Holding-up traffic is an acceptable road usage technique by a cyclist as a common defensive riding technique (See HMSO Cycle-craft). Funny how traffic jams are caused by cars...
Riding through red lights is illegal and stupid and condoned by most members of this cycling forums.
Pavement cycling is unfortunately a grey area, some are legal as shared paths others are not, however having been told many times to get off the road and ride on the pavement by car drivesr I'd assumed drivers would be happy with pavement riding cyclists IMO there should be no cycle-paths or any need to be seperated from traffic, what is required is a better standard of care by motorised transport. Try Holland, Scandanavia, in fact most of Europe for better standards of shared road usage.
Unlike drivers of motorised vehicles, cyclists, pedestrians, horses have an automatic right to use the public highway that car drivers do not. That is why we have to have a licence to use the road with a car that can be revoked.
Don't even start on the road-tax argument because you are likely to be wrong there also.

 

[J4CKO]

Riding two abreast with a trail of angry motorist behind, legal or whatever is just plain ignorant if there isnt a safety reason for doing so, but actually being held up by cyclists doing this is very rare in my experience, most dont want a two mile queue of irate drivers behind, those that do really need to stop as it doenst do the image of cycling any good.

 

[PBancroft]

Parking badly and blocking access is one of my pet hates, and a car running a red light is infinately more dangerous than a cyclist doing the same thing. I personally think using a mobile is no more dangerous than changing radio stations or changing a cd, and we all do that everyday! Speeding i hate in built up populated areas, but is ok on a dry motorway when traffic conditions allow. I guess we all have bad apples in the bunch, but drivers generally do not pursue things over zealously in the same way "victimised" cyclists do, why is that?

I think you may be mistaken on that last point. In the video in the OP, it wasn't the cyclist who pursued the matter, but the driver. The video simply recorded his behaviour. But you do also need to bear in mind that what might be a minor prang in a car - damaged bodywork, a nuisance of an insurance claim - could well cause the death of a more vulnerable road user. EDIT: That could be why they are more likely to react.

Using a non-handsfree mobile is substantially more dangerous than changing a radio station - you are in less control of the vehicle if you need to react suddenly, because one of your hands is full. You're not in full control of the vehicle to negotiate hazards or the road itself either. There are a couple of studies which have demonstrated this, again, I'll see if I can dig some out for you. EDIT: Here's one. EDIT2: And this is one of the likely outcomes of not paying attention on the road, be it changing the radio station or whatever. You might think that you are capable of using the phone and driving, but we are ALL fallible.

You mention speeding on a motorway being OK - but a fair number of people do it in populated areas, even near schools.

It isn't the type of road user which is at fault - that's a false means of identifying the bad apples. Its no more correct than saying people with large foreheads are more likely to be criminals.

It's the individual which counts. You know as well as I that there are some terrible drivers out there. I'd put money on you knowing some bad drivers personally. That doesn't make all car drivers inherently bad - only those individuals. The same is true of cyclists.

 

[GrasB]

Problem is with cyclists is that if you make a small mistake like clipping a curb & cannoning into one you can do serious damage to that person at 10mph. Like 5 weeks in hospital & spending 3 or 4 years of physio just to be able to do 20 pull-ups in a row without dislocating your shoulder.

Also we are treated worse than moped & motorbike users, I've followed a motorbike at doing 20 in a 20 limit about 5m behind & had someone let the motorbike through on their right of way & almost drive straight into me despite the fact we were doing about the same speed!

 

[Fab Foodie]

Parking badly and blocking access is one of my pet hates, and a car running a red light is infinately more dangerous than a cyclist doing the same thing. I personally think using a mobile is no more dangerous than changing radio stations or changing a cd, and we all do that everyday! Speeding i hate in built up populated areas, but is ok on a dry motorway when traffic conditions allow. I guess we all have bad apples in the bunch, but drivers generally do not pursue things over zealously in the same way "victimised" cyclists do, why is that?

Because we are more likely to be killed by your actions than you are by ours... think about it.

I'm sure most here would be really happy to take you out on a regular commuting run so you can feel the excitement, the regular adrenalin rush of a near-death experience on your way to work or back home to your loved ones.

 

[ComedyPilot]

Jesus, what sort of life have you led, section 5 signed sealed and delivered, this sort of thing is an everyday occurance, as for the section 59, grow up, he reversed to avoid an obstacle infront of him, HE DID NOT GET ANYWHWERE NEAR ENOUGH TO THE CYCLIST TO EVEN WORRY HIM! And why has the cyclist not been lambasted for LYING! At no point in that video does anyone get anywhere near 50 mph, let alone 100 mph, this stinks of a one man crusade against performance car drivers, i dont even reckon "witnesses" stopped to offer help, the OP needs to get over himself and find a non road related hobby!

Section 5 Public Order Act - look it up or ask a copper.

I have already stated about the S59 job.

What 'obstacle' was there? I didn't see one, and he didn't alter his steering in any way when he drove off (drive around obstacle?) So why did he reverse? If he says he didn't realise the cyclist was behind him, then it's Due Care and Attention, because he was only swearing at him 15 seconds previously, and if he did know he was there why put it in reverse?

I'll have a guess (due to his previous display of contempt) that he (again) wanted to intimidate and bully someone.

With a display of that sort of driving, if I were a Subaru driver, I would want to distance myself from that sort of cretin.

 

[ScottSub 10]

This is a very bizarre place!

I love cycling (just cycled Devon to Wales aka 'Devon to Heaven' ) and as I said commuted for many many years in London. I still communte where I live now when jobs permit but avoid mingling with traffic as much as possible as I have two young kids now... I also ditched the motorbike for exactly the same reasons...

However I have little sympathy to the approach or attitudes shown here. The whole camera and publish thing is quite bonkers. Also the approaches to purposefully slowing down traffic or riding two abreast as it is 'your right' is idiotic. Most other road users (including less militant cyclists like me) will think (be it wrongly or due to being 'uneducated') that you are being arsey and selfish.

Your best weapon is common sense, accepting the 'limitations of intellect of other road users and being ULTRA defensive - not getting all arsey and taping someone on their phone. Who the hell do you think you are? It will end in tears...

Scott D
(Ex Air Zound owner and user!)

 

[PBancroft]

This is a very bizarre place!

Show me one Internet forum which isn't...

 

[ScottSub 10]

The M&S forum is REALLY odd (or was that S&M)

 

[PBancroft]

The M&S forum is REALLY odd (or was that S&M)

Heheh... as I said in a PM to differentPOV:-

One aspect of [...] meeting with like-minded people is that you're never encouraged to really study the facts and challenge your own beliefs.

(nicked from Derren Brown).

Grab a chair and a cuppa, stay a while. We're friendly really.