Bus Lane Boris

[simon l& and a half]

there's another sort of consideration. What works? Forget what we want, forget what is fair, what's best for for the most? The answer is pretty simple. We are the most. We are more and more numerous, we cost very little to accommodate, and the cost to the planet of our pedalling is next to nothing. By comparison motorcycles are few, declining in number, and the cost to the planet is stratospheric - the fuel consumption of a 500cc bike is eyewateringly high, and their hospital bills are mega. So, although motorcyclists are fellow free spirits, although you can respect their endeavour, if not their dress sense, they're not sufficiently important or worthwhile. Sorry, but there you have it.

The same sort of consideration can work against cyclists. I've been part of a TfL committee that considered cycling along towpaths. My point was that some towpaths were at capacity and were more suited to walkers than cyclists. Embarrassing, because I designed a cycle ramp to one of the towpaths in question, but we have to realise that there are times and places where we are surplus to requirements.

 

[historyman]

idiot

Love your manners simon. But the bus prices, did they increase faster than inflation under Ken's sway, or less fast? the average time it takes to get from Archway to Marble Arch by bus, did it increase or decrease? the congestion charge, did Ken lie about that, or does a one-legged duck swim in circles?

 

[simon l& and a half]

Love your manners simon. But the bus prices, did they increase faster than inflation under Ken's sway, or less fast? the average time it takes to get from Archway to Marble Arch by bus, did it increase or decrease? the congestion charge, did Ken lie about that, or does a one-legged duck swim in circles?

idiot with previous

 

[spindrift]

Love your manners simon. But the bus prices, did they increase faster than inflation under Ken's sway, or less fast? the average time it takes to get from Archway to Marble Arch by bus, did it increase or decrease? the congestion charge, did Ken lie about that, or does a one-legged duck swim in circles?

You can look this all up you know, instead of pursuing a dishonest campaign here.

 

[spindrift]

Dear Editor,
We are most concerned to read of your support for allowing motorbikes in
bus lanes (Open Bus Lanes - 22 May 2008) based on evidence that
Transport for London has described as 'not sufficiently reliable to
inform a decision on such an important issue.'
If the Standard is to be consistent in its support for reduced road
danger for cyclists and pedestrians then it should examine the TfL
reports on motorbikes in bus lanes more critically before advocating
such a move by the Mayor. The executive summary of the original report
says repeatedly that key data is not statistically significant. TfL
described the report methodology as 'flawed.'Following the final
report a TfL official wrote "'there is no evidence to indicate that
motorcyclists would see any significant safety benefits from being
allowed to enter bus lanes but that there were potential dis-benefits
for both cyclists and pedestrians.'For the Mayor to make a policy decision on the basis of flawed
methodology and insufficient evidence would be premature and open to
legal challenge should anyone be injured as a result.
Best regards,
Tony Armstrong

 

[LLB]

Any motorcylists care to comment? I'm not fully up on this subject and would like to watch the debate.

It depends on who you want to believe. Spindrifts source on this ?

Bus Lanes
The government’s advice on bus lanes recommends against allowing motorcycles to use bus lanes, although Local Authorities can permit them if they choose. For several years now, motorcycle groups have called for motorcyclists to be allowed to use bus lanes, along with pedal cyclists and taxis, and several Local Authorities have allowed them to do so. Pedal cycle organisations are opposed to motorcyclists being allowed into the bus lanes.

Trials are underway and interim data has not identified any safety problems created by motorcyclists being allowed to use bus lanes. RoSPA has not supported the proposal for motorcyclists to be allowed to use bus lanes. However, this policy will be reviewed once the results of the various trials have been published.

http://www.rospa.com/roadsafety/advice/motorcycling/policy.htm

 

[Origamist]

Interim Report from 2004: ​

Powered Two Wheelers in Bus Lanes: Progress
on experiments
Project Development​

(Network Performance Division)

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloads/Ptw-bus-lane-project-2004-results.pdf

More info from TFL:

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/projectsandschemes/roadsandpublicspaces/2295.aspx

 

[CopperBrompton]

It was notable that Ken only had a problem with the study's methodology and sample sizes after it came back with the 'wrong' result, not when that methodology and sample size was proposed and approved.

I'm an agnostic on the issue of motorcycles in bus lanes, but I do dislike politicians who commission a study with an agreed design and scope and then decide to ignore the results.

Ben

 

[Origamist]

The trial appeared to be flawed from the get go:

P2Ws in bus lanes Appendix III, p8.

In order to understand the lack of quality data provided it is necessary to refer to statements from the experiences of the original draft report authors who make reference to the frailties in each data set. These comments are listed below.


Vehicle Count Data
"Given the limited data available, a statistical analysis is not possible, and even general trends are of doubtful reliability."

CCTV Camera data – Static cameras
"The static CCTV data obtained from TfL cover sections of bus lane not open to motorcycles"

CCTV Camera data – Bus mounted cameras
"The cameras also record motorcycles using other lanes but the reliability of those counts is uncertain."
"The bus-mounted data were not recorded along the same sections as the static camera data, making correlation difficult."

Cycle Count Data
There are no major issues with the data collected except for the A23 counts which was only available for 16 days within the month.

Speed data and journey time analysis
"TfL Marquis journey time data were available for this study, from which bus speeds were calculated.……. More comprehensive data require full traffic speed counts, which list, for each survey point, the vehicle speed, type, and lane. Unfortunately the data available do not correlate directly with the Marquis data, since they record point speed rather than average speed and, for the most part, predate the Marquis data by several years."

And, tellingly:

Given these data limitations, this report concludes it is not feasible to carry out a robust casualty rate analysis using the available flow data.


http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloads/Appendix_III_Use-and-attitudinal-surveys.pdf

 

[Aperitif]

A reply to my 'letter' - everyone get the same?

Our ref: SM034190/1

REF: Allowing Motorbikes in Bus Lanes

Dear Aperitif,

Thank you for your e-mail to Mayor Johnson, which has been passed to me by City Hall. We will look into all of the points you have raised and get back to you as soon as possible.

Under our customer services policy, we will do our best to respond within 10 working days. In most cases this is not a problem. However, should we take any longer than 15 days; we will write to you on day 15 with an update and also provide you with the likely timescale for a full response.

In accordance with the company procedures we will only use the information you supply us to respond to your correspondence.

If you have marked your correspondence as confidential, your contact details will not be passed on. Please be aware this may limit our ability to respond to your enquiry, suggestions or complaint.

If you are unhappy with the way we have dealt with your enquiry, you may wish to contact London TravelWatch. This is an independent watchdog body, set up by parliament to represent the interests of passengers. They can be contacted at the following address:

London TravelWatch
6 Middle Street
London
EC1A 7JA

Thank you once again for contacting Surface Transport at TfL.

Yours faithfully,

 

[LLB]

http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1145

You don't honestly expect an unbiased view from a pressure group do you

 

[spindrift]

TFL is not a pressure group, read the link.

 

[spindrift]

Please don't let that idiot disrupt yet another thread by asking questions that demonstrate nothing so much as his inability to read links.

 

[spindrift]

Can you imagine getting a new job, and three weeks later saying to your boss:

SEE YA, I'M OFF FOR A JOLLY ON A YACHT!!!

Johnson's fleecing Londoners to line his own pockets, swan off on his hols and leave his press team to announce his disastrous policy decisions whilst he's safely out of the country.

Didn't he realise when the election was?

Let's hope he's not caught up in a terrorist atrocity as he suns himself whilst leering at the waitresses

 

[LLB]

TFL is not a pressure group, read the link.

No, but the LCC is

Where is that £20 for the Macmillan Cancer care which you promised you lying dishonest gutter dweller ?