Camping or ho(s)stels? - the money case.

[willem]

It is often suggested that if you are new to cycle touring, it may be good to go on a ho(s)tel tour first, to avoid the initial investment in camping gear. Instead, I want to argue that even serious quality camping gear can be earned back in one summer holiday. Let me show some tentative sums. A ho(s)tel holiday of three weeks for two people would cost perhaps 50 pounds a day for the ho(s)tel, plus perhaps 15 pounds per day for eating out rather than cooking your own meals. A camping holiday would be some 15 pounds per day for the campsite, plus the cost of camping gear, of course. So the difference is about 1000 pounds for these three weeks. How much would camping gear cost - how much do you need to earn back?
You want seriously compact and lightweight quality gear that will keep you comfortable and safe during Spring and Autumn holidays in, for example, France, and summer holidays at higher altitides in, for example, Switzerland. And you want the gear to last at least something like a decade, rather than disintegrate after two seasons. Two Exped Synmat Basic mattresses, two Alpkit Pipedream 400 sleeping bags, a Trangia 25 UL stove with pots, and an MSR Hubba Hubba HP tent can be had for about 800 pounds. And all this only weighs less than 6 kg, or less than 3 kg per person. These are only examples, and you can spend more on lighter stuff or a more spacious tent, or stuff that is better suited to 4 season camping. However, these examples present really high quality gear that is perfectly suitable for almost all serious cycle touring in Europe.
So you can earn back the initial investment in about one year. If you don't like the cycling bit you can use the camping gear to go car camping next year. If you don't like the camping bit, you can sell the camping gear second had, and still get a few hundred pounds for it.
Finally, this is only the money argument. The fun argument is even stronger: camping is a joy to do.
Willem

 

[Spinney]

If you are talking hostels rather than hotels, then it is more like £20 per day each (or a bit less, depends on the hostel). And you can buy and cook all your own food rather than having to eat out. So that becomes £40 per day, as opposed to your estimated £15 for camping. So the difference for a 3 week holiday is just over £500 (and if, as is more likely, you only go away for 2 weeks, that is only £350.

There is also the issue of weight. If you are new to cycle touring, you are likely to be unused to cycling longish rides day after day. To do this for the first time while also lugging around tent, sleeping bag and stove is, to me, a sure-fire way of making sure you don't enjoy it and never want to do it again.

From a personal point of view, if I am tired at the end of the day, I much prefer a real bed (I sleep much better in a real bed), and being able to go to the loo in the night without having to trek across a field.

Having heard about a friend's first cycle/camping trip in France, a major issue was how to get kit dry as it rained most of the time. Most hostels have drying rooms - campsites do not. After a couple of days of being wet, the fun of the whole thing was wearing rather thin.

There's a lot more to it than the cost of the kit...camping may well be a joy to do in nice weather, but many people wouldn't agree that it is also a joy in horrible weather.

 

[willem]

I was afraid people would argue about the detailed numbers rather than the structure of the argument. Anyway, I am not sure where you can find a hostel for two for an average of 40 pounds. I am sure you sometimes can, but often enough not. And sometimes it will be rather more more than 50 pounds, and sometimes (often) there will only be a hotel and you will have to eat out. Personally, I sleep very well on a good camping mattress (such as the Exped one). I spend too many nights in business hotels already. For me it is all about the proximity to nature. That is why I ride my bike, and that is why I camp. My argument is that the investment is earned back very quickly. How quickly precisely depends on the size of the investment (there are also cheaper tents and sleeping bags), and, as you argue, the cost of the alternative. I think my argument is in the right ballpark, and that was enough for me. Beyond that, it is all about what you like.
Willem

 

[Cush]

This is another topic I will be keeping an eye on. I like YHA hostels but they have changed over the years and seem to have got away from what they were intended fo, some where to rest up with no fuss or bother but with a certain standard of behaviour expected. The independants have to an extent filled the void left by YHA closing down but the standards here vary so much both in the behaviour of those who use them and what is offered that it is some times a gamble useing them. Camping seems a lot more flexible but the cost of the kit and the weight to be carried may be the deciding factors. I will be interested to hear what others have to say.
PS I am posting a lot today because I am having to wait in for the Gas man and that is no joke

 

[willem]

As I said, I think camping is a lot cheaper. If you don't believe you can earn back the investment in one year, you certainly can in two years. And if you choose the gear carefully, the weight is hardly material. In my example it was less than 3 kg per person. For a solo trip it is inevitably heavier, but even then: there are a few tents around the 1 kg mark (Terra Nova Laser, Vaude Power Lizard), and even a palatial 1 person tent like the Helsport Ringstind 2 Light comes in at only 1.85 kg. A lighter mattress (summer only) would be the 410 gram Thermarest Neoair, and PHD Design in the UK make ultralight sleeping bags. You could thus have a solo kit (tent, sleeping stuff, stove) for less than 2.5 kg. It would cost about 700 pounds altogether (Power Lizard, Neoair, PHD Minimus and a stove). This example is with about the most expensive solo gear - cheaper is also possible, of course.
Willem

 

[TwoInTow]

Speaking as one of the beginners Willem is referring to, I would agree that for us the money really worked out. We just had 9 nights of cycle touring as a family. We stayed in a hotel one night on the spur of the moment because strong winds meant we were not going to reach the campsight we were aiming for until early evening and the kids were knackered. It was a Travelodge, but spur-of-the-moment booking meant no special deals so it was 112 for the rooms (for 4 of us), plus we spent about another 35-50 on dinner and breakfast the next day since we couldn't cook. We also were forced to use a hotel in Birmingham because we needed to stay in the city to enable us to visit Cadbury World, and obviously there were no campsights. This was another 102 for a light dinner and breakfast and a room. So it was about 250 for two nights, versus about 84 for the remaining 7 nights.

We only need to do one more tour and we will have broken even on some quite expensive kit. Of course, if you hate camping anyway, there's no point, but it did work for us. (Mind you, the night in the hotel was such a treat - I don't regret the money, although we could not tour if we had to use it every night!) Plus, as Willem suggests, we will use it in the next week or two for some car camping, so extended use!

Also, where do you find lots of cheap hostels when touring? There are so few YHAs...

 

[willem]

Yes I was so glad you enjoyed it. When our children were younger we also had a great time. Your example also shows that one forced night in a hotel because, for example, your tent has failed / started to leak can be enough to obliterate the cost advantage of buying a cheap tent. Quality pays for itself.
Willem

 

[rualexander]

Willem,
I definitely agree with you in principal that camping can easily save you the money required to buy some decent kit over a couple of years, although I'm not sure which hostels you stay in but £40 or £50 a night for two people is very expensive, £28-£36 would be more realistic.

TwoIntow,
Aside from the now depleted YHA network, there is a large network of Independent hostels.

 

[sgw]

You may well recoup the cost of camping gear in a year or perhaps two by using campsites over hostels. You will definatly recoup the cost in far less time if you avoid campsites altogether. I find that the traditional farmers field with a standpipe and and a toilet in a hut for a couple of quid a night are few and far between. Far more common are holiday park type sites with regimented rows of ebay tents full of loud people, dogs and kids. Charges of £8 or £9 for backpackers and cyclists to camp in such places are a total ripoff. Another modern developement of camping which has driven me into the wilds is the tendancy for campsites to be dominated by groups (gangs?) on a pissup.

As for the excessive cost of top quality lightweight gear, this can be halved for only a minimal increase in weight. For example the excellent, (but fragile looking) 410 gram Thermarest Neoair costs approx £80. An Alpkit Airo with the same R-value and weighing only 582gm in its bag is only £40. The extra 170gm or so is more than compensated for by the halving in cost.

Go wild, pitch late, strike early and leave nothing but a flattened patch of grass.

 

[bikepacker]

Worst nights sleep I have ever had have been in Youth and Backpackers Hostals. I made up my mind 8 years ago to avoid both and camp. Since then I have spent an average of 60 nights a year in my tent. My camping gear has paid for it's self many times over in that time. It would have cost much more to have spent that many nights in hostals.

Should you wish to see my equipment list it is at http://www.bikepacker.co.uk/List.htm

 

[psmiffy]

Willem – I thoroughly agree with your sentiment – I could not possibly have afforded to visit the range of places that I have when cycle touring without camping – my camping equipment has paid for itself many times over!

However, camping to many people is pure anathema (they don’t like it) and I do not blame them if they have followed the weight weenie advice doled out by many – Keeping well fed, warm and comfortable can be tricky on good days – in cold weather or extended wet weather if you are not properly equipped to be able to deal with things as they happen, could be hell for some people – of course there is a weight penalty – but it has never handicapped me when touring and on the contrary has ensured that I have never had a “bad” tour.

When camping some people seem to positively revel in hardship, others endure it - me I like to enjoy my camping whatever the conditions.

 

[psmiffy]

Worst nights sleep I have ever had have been in Youth and Backpackers Hostals. I made up my mind 8 years ago to avoid both and camp. Since then I have spent an average of 60 nights a year in my tent. My camping gear has paid for it's self many times over in that time. It would have cost much more to have spent that many nights in hostals.

Should you wish to see my equipment list it is at http://www.bikepacker.co.uk/List.htm

Totally agree - Over the last 15 years I have averaged 40 nights a year in my tent - In 1999 I was touring in New Zealand and when I got to Haast it was raining so hard that the campsite refused to let me camp - I had to go to the backpackers - terrible, I slept OK but I made a vow never to enter another one

 

[mcr]

I've tried out cycle-camping for the first time this summer and found you don't need to spend a fortune: for lightweight summer-only solo touring I got myself - Argos Pro Action Lite tent (OK, it is orange, but it's pretty nifty) & lightweight sleeping bag (cost ~£40); Karrimor self-inflating mat from Millets (the one extravagance at £50); basic Trangia stove set as aim to eat in pubs (£25 from Amazon). Total weight: 4.5kg.

I agree that finding cheap, conducive campsites is a struggle, especially in high season, and too many of the smaller ones are CCC members only (I rather balk at joining for a couple of nights' usage before I know I'll like the experience).

 

[snorri]

I spend too many nights in business hotels already. For me it is all about the proximity to nature.

It's just a case of horses for courses. I can't remember the last time I spent a night in a business hotel, and feel a lot closer to nature in my own home than on quite a few campsites I have used.
I enjoy a mix of camping, hostel and hotel when cycle touring.

 

[jack the lad]

I took a tent and camping gear for a ride last year on a touring holiday with Jackie the Lass. The weather was sheyt, and she had a crash too, which upset her a bit, so we stayed in B&Bs all week! I'm sure we had a better holiday for being able to dry off and warm up. Nature is not always something you want to be in too close proximity to!

I'm going this year on my own. Even though I'm a bit more robust than Mrs JtL campingwise, on the basis of that experience I've got a very lightweight tent from Wilko's (only £10 and yes, I know it's very light because it's flimsy) because if the weather is that rubbish again I wouldn't want to sleep in any tent so there's no point spending loads. Rather than carry the tent around all week for nothing again, at £10 it can be donated to a charity shop I pass and I'll cycle lighter!

The rest of my camping gear is from Wilko's and Poundland too. Spent less than £30 so far and I'm just about done!