Cycling death

[Tynan]

I was aware of trucks and buses today and other cyclists

saw a female cyclist start from the curb at a major crossroads, in the left hand turn lane, with a jumbo transit alongside her that had to wait to let her go, she may have clocked him and him her but I don't think so, she looked like she was in a world of her own

And so other cyclists blithely going up the inside of buses and trucks, through gaps so narrow that they had to have their left foot on the pavement

Mind you, I noticed more than usually what a beady eye most of the buses and trucks have out for cyclists, shocking gridlock in several places this morning

 

[cupoftea]

I think it's time to throw the RLJ debate in (boom)

So if we are obeying traffic signal blindly i.e. cycle lanes we may end up dead.

Someone said that they position themselves in front of a lorry at lights. I assume you cross the mandatory stop line.

So you have in fact just RLJ’ed

This comes around to the trials were they removed all street marking, maybe this would help?

In summary, the roads are dangerous for inexperienced cyclists, street planners are not interested in your safety, just fulfilling quotes and keeping cyclist out of the way.

 

[vernon]

Tynan – if I rode with the ideaology that cyclists have THE god given right on the road I wouldn’t be here now !

Arch you musnt have much of a pleasureable life if your are ‘consistantly going to niggle at you for it.’

Either way Arch – we’re all cyclists, we know the deal.

Having risked death and serious injury (none being my fault) & been hit by cars many over a 17yr + time period I know my feelings towards car drivers.

Remind me not to ride with you

250,000 miles of motorcycling over 25 years and around 10,000 miles of cycling over the past three years and I've yet to experience the Armageddon that you seem to experience regularly.

Is contributary negligence part of your vocabulary?

 

[spindrift]

I routinely have to take avoiding action when drivers behave idiotically, it's not rare.

 

[Pete]

In summary, the roads are dangerous for inexperienced cyclists....

Not entirely true. No road is completely safe for anyone, accidents happen, experienced cyclists die, can't guarantee anything. It is always possible to take a line which is as safe as it can be, at the cost of some inconvenience to the cyclist. A lorry or bus at the head of the queue is not safe to overtake either on the left or the right. Best to hang behind: better to lose a few seconds on your journey, better to breathe in diesel fumes for a few seconds longer, than to end up dead. Indeed, if you don't feel comfortable about undertaking or overtaking any vehicle, anywhere in a queue, then don't overtake. Remain behind the last vehicle in primary position (so that a following vehicle can't sideline you) but be prepared to move over to secondary if you can't keep up with the traffic when it does start moving. This is reasonably safe, because the driver behind you, unless a total a***hole, is sure to have seen you. Hardly exciting cycling though. I'm afraid excitement and safety are often mutually exclusive.

 

[Tynan]

surely everyone is sick to death of the rlj argument?

but I think those saying rolling a few feet over a stop line for a good reason is the same thing as going through a red light and junction are the same things are being either mischievous or plain stupid, perhaps both

they're not the same thing at all

 

[Cab]

surely everyone is sick to death of the rlj argument?

but I think those saying rolling a few feet over a stop line for a good reason is the same thing as going through a red light and junction are the same things are being either mischievous or plain stupid, perhaps both

they're not the same thing at all

No one has said that they're the same thing, other than that they're both illegal and (in all but the most unusual situations) inappropriate.

 

[Cab]

I routinely have to take avoiding action when drivers behave idiotically, it's not rare.

Not quite a daily event, but pretty common.

 

[Tynan]

No one has said that they're the same thing, other than that they're both illegal and (in all but the most unusual situations) inappropriate.

OP certainly implied it, 'most unusual'?

only when a large vehicle is at the head of the line of traffic, when a car is in the ASL or when there's no ASL and a car is at the head of the traffic and there's no other suitable place to start from

to equate in any way choosing to start from a virtual ASL for obvious and accepted reasons of safety with deliberately ignoring traffic lights is stupid and mostly a deliberate attempt to confuse the the issue

I doubt many people are punished for going a few feet over stop lines, ignoring red lights, yeah and with obvious good reason

there's no advantage or motivation for going a few feet over a stop line other than improved safety

there's plenty for those that chose to ignore red lights

different things entirely

 

[tdr1nka]

Round my way it is a wonder more cyclists don't get squished, I'm not talking about serious sober cyclists but the local casual cycling brewheads commuting unlit to and from the offy and 'yoof' on their BMX's & MTB's.
I have almost had head on collisions with unlit kids riding the wrong the wrong way up the Old Kent Road!

Any death on the road, cage driver, cyclist or ped is lamentable and the repocussions last long after the road is swept and the emergency services leave the scene.

I've written in other posts that I have noticed in South London 20mph zones, some cage drivers will overtake me using the whole oncoming lane, pulling back in with little room to manouver. I dread the day when someone's rash decision is a head on crash in front of me.

T x

 

[Tynan]

them kids really are invulnerable I think, they never seem to get hurt

I do a stretch of 20 at the home end of my journey, generally well observed as it's a decent hill so I'm either well over 20 on the way home or creeping up it on the way out, so I'm happy to hold a tight line

the odd charlie has to tear round me though, me in primary or no

 

[Cab]

OP certainly implied it, 'most unusual'?

only when a large vehicle is at the head of the line of traffic, when a car is in the ASL or when there's no ASL and a car is at the head of the traffic and there's no other suitable place to start from

...and you've ended up getting to the front without realising that the legal space you were heading for is illegally or foolishly occupied by someone else and dismounting is, for whatever reason, unrealistic.

to equate in any way choosing to start from a virtual ASL for obvious and accepted reasons of safety with deliberately ignoring traffic lights is stupid and mostly a deliberate attempt to confuse the the issue

To spuriously represent the arguments usually put forward against breaking the law by starting out in front of the white line in such a way is just petty.

I doubt many people are punished for going a few feet over stop lines, ignoring red lights, yeah and with obvious good reason

there's no advantage or motivation for going a few feet over a stop line other than improved safety

Rubbish. I see cyclists ignore white lines and wait out in front of ASLS that are clear of motorists every day, they don't gain any safety advantage in doing so, they seek merely to get out in front of other cyclists or to shave seconds from their journey.

there's plenty for those that chose to ignore red lights

different things entirely

Different, but not entirely so. You're seeing virtue where I see none; what I observe in people waiting out in front of the white line is selfish, illegal behaviour, yet for some reason you're reading in to that behaviour that these people are somehow ensuring their own safety. I'd say thats true for less than 1 in 100 instances that I see.

 

[Cab]

I've written in other posts that I have noticed in South London 20mph zones, some cage drivers will overtake me using the whole oncoming lane, pulling back in with little room to manouver. I dread the day when someone's rash decision is a head on crash in front of me.

I was stuck behind a 4x4 for something like half a mile yesterday. He was doing a shade over 20 ish, which would normally be plenty fast enough for me and more, but with the tail wind I would have been tempted to go faster. Still, a decent pace so I couldn't complain.

A white van was stuck behind me all the way along the road.

4x4 signals left, turns off, I accelerated but not enough for white van, white van guns his engine to overtake, manages to pull up level with my back wheel for about 30 yards before turning right off the road (might have indicated, might not have done, I have no idea). Wanted past me, I'd have let him past too but he simply didn't have a chance.

The desire to get past the cycle in front is a serious problem with many motorists; a bike out in front of them is like a red rag to a bull.

 

[magnatom]

Oh oh! Cab and Tynan are a bad combination! This could be a loooong thread......

 

[Cab]

Oh oh! Cab and Tynan are a bad combination! This could be a loooong thread......

Oh, go put some poor sap on you-tube, brain boy