Drivers and mini roundabouts

[ColinJ]

I have just had a flashback to cycling along the Rossendale valley from Bacup towards Rawtenstall and coming to a mini-roundabout but not noticing it until I was almost hit by a car emerging from a side road to my right!

 

[BoldonLad]

I have just had a flashback to cycling along the Rossendale valley from Bacup towards Rawtenstall and coming to a mini-roundabout but not noticing it until I was almost hit by a car emerging from a side road to my right!

What! a cyclist not noticing something, you must be mistaken, that cannot possibly be true

 

[Deleted member 1258]

This little beauty used to be on my commute, Its good that it was never busy. I dislike mini roundabouts, even in the car. As others have said, most drivers don't know how to use them.

https://goo.gl/maps/Vef9J6w95RK2

 

[BoldonLad]

This little beauty used to be on my commute, Its good that it was never busy. I dislike mini roundabouts, even in the car. As others have said, most drivers don't know how to use them.


View attachment 385218

https://goo.gl/maps/Vef9J6w95RK2

Looks like a double mini, there is one of those at the edge of Newcastle Upon Tyne, (Gosforth), great for getting the blood pressure up!

 

[Deleted member 1258]

Looks like a double mini, there is one of those at the edge of Newcastle Upon Tyne, (Gosforth), great for getting the blood pressure up!

You've got it, luckely that one was never busy, I'd hate to have to use one like that which was busy

 

[Profpointy]

That still doesn't work though, 4 cars are all stopped at their appropriate line, they wait as many seconds as they want but when they check there will still be a car there.

Yes it does as bolton lad explains. The key is that each waits a random amount of time.before trying again. Ethernet works the same (milliseconds, rather than seconds). It's termed CDMA - collision detection multiple access. Mmm, might be a snag there

 

[lazybloke]

What are all-direction give-ways? I agree that they should definitely, where possible, enlarge them into small ordinary roundabouts, a greater proportion of drivers seem to manage to stick to the rules with them. This specific one is much of an improvement on how it used to be when it was just a standard junction, it used to be even more lethal, but I do think it would be safer if they expanded it.

I toured Guernsey by bike some years ago and saw lots of 'filter in turn' junctions. Seemed to work well.

Not sure how many exist on the mainland. The only one I know of is the ''squareabout' in Surrey, which must be 2 decades old but still causes the locals plenty of confusion about who has priority (clue: no-one).

The local police say it was introduced because of a high accident rate and was immediately very successful. I'm not seen stats to back this claim.

It's not perfect - there are too many inconsiderate drivers around.
But on a good day.... it can almost bring a tear to the eye to see several drivers communicating and negotiating: No, you go first. I insist!

 

[ColinJ]

What! a cyclist not noticing something, you must be mistaken, that cannot possibly be true

I can't remember which other forum members I was riding with but one of them spotted the danger before I did and shouted to me to watch out. My mind wasn't on the job. I was thinking about where we were riding to and was on cyclist auto-pilot. I didn't know the road and the roundabout caught me out. My mistake ... Fortunately, for once the car driver was paying more attention than me!

 

[Ming the Merciless]

What! a cyclist not noticing something, you must be mistaken, that cannot possibly be true

I wonder how a motorist would react to a cyclist saying to them SMIDSY

 

[Deleted member 1258]

I wonder how a motorist would react to a cyclist saying to them SMIDSY

Would wonder what you're on about

 

[Deleted member 26715]

Yes it does as bolton lad explains. The key is that each waits a random amount of time.before trying again. Ethernet works the same (milliseconds, rather than seconds). It's termed CDMA - collision detection multiple access. Mmm, might be a snag there

Still not convinced due to the physical aspect of it, CDMA can work as you say because it's millisecond based, let's assume we are in car1, we arrive at a junction, at exactly the same time car2 arrives to our left, car3 opposite & car4 to our right. All give away & are stopped, each decide that they all wait a random amount of time before they check whether they can move, but surely no matter what time they wait, each one will always have a vehicle to the right.

My solution would be that they need to be programmed to have a primary road set for each junction, so in the event of a tie this takes precedent.

 

[BoldonLad]

Precisely

Still not convinced due to the physical aspect of it, CDMA can work as you say because it's millisecond based, let's assume we are in car1, we arrive at a junction, at exactly the same time car2 arrives to our left, car3 opposite & car4 to our right. All give away & are stopped, each decide that they all wait a random amount of time before they check whether they can move, but surely no matter what time they wait, each one will always have a vehicle to the right.

My solution would be that they need to be programmed to have a primary road set for each junction, so in the event of a tie this takes precedent.

I suspect, in the end, this will be solved by the robot vehicles communicating with each other, but, sticking with the CDMA solution, each vehicle may still have a vehicle to its right, but, not a MOVING vehicle, so, the vehicle with the shortest random wait time, would "decide" to move off first.

Not saying that is how it will work, my software experience was in Accounting / Order Processing / Inventory Control, and, it is now ten years out of date.

Simply saying, IMHO, it is not an insoluble problem.

My prediction:

- Driverless vehicles will come
- will they be 100% "safe", No

 

[Colin_P]

4 driverless cars arrive at a mini roundabout at the same time from each direction, each as per the rules must give way to the vehicle from the right, how many hours later will they be sat there?

I think they would eventually crash, just like the Andromeda galaxy will eventually crash into the milky way.


My view on mini roundabouts is that they are top of the list of places where you should NOT try and prove a point. Being dead limits gloating oppo's.


On driverless cars; I'd take the oppotunity to have a lie in on the way to work. Fold the seat down or even get in the back, duvet. Sorted.

 

[Apollonius]

Might be a bit off-topic, but I feel a need to say something. Driving through a nearby residential village this morning strictly keeping to the 30 limit (I stick to speed limits when driving - it is just smug virtue-signalling, of course) and approaching a mini-roundabout at which I was taking a right fork, and signalling right. I was overtaken by a black Audi, who effectively went the wrong way round to pass me. He then sped off at 40-50mph.

My conclusion is that by sticking to the speed limits, I am at fault and causing normal drivers rage and frustration because they are unable to pass me. I believe there is a constabulary that feels the same way about cyclists...

 

[mjr]

My conclusion is that by sticking to the speed limits, I am at fault and causing normal drivers rage and frustration because they are unable to pass me. I believe there is a constabulary that feels the same way about cyclists...

Only one? But Cambridgeshire, Northamptonshire and Lincolnshire are my three guesses for who you meant.