Flat faced dogs - is it right to ban them?

[Time Waster]

I read this week about how the Netherlands had banned the breeding of flat faced dogs like pugs and French bulldogs. The article said they were planning on banning ownership and questioned whether that spills happen in the UK.

These dogs are often very popular and thought if as being lovable characters. Do you think it's right? Or perhaps there's another way?

My view is that these dogs are definitely an unhealthy breed standard which is what the breeders reacted to and bred to. I feel that these breed standards should be radically altered to create a more healthy version if that is possible in a reasonable timescale. I don't think its is but I feel there's other elements of these breeds still worth keeping. I grew up for a few years around my grandparents pugs. They were real characters. If a breed could be altered to be less flat faced and unhealthy but keep the character then perhaps that should be the way.

On an aside I think the various national kennel clubs should be made accountable should they not change breed standards and breeding standards to a healthy breed standard first, looks further down the list of requirements.

What's your view on this Dutch ban? Should the UK follow? Any other views or comments?

 

[Oldhippy]

Breeding for style should be banned across the board. Dog ownership should be vetted before buying, all dogs licensed and fines for mess should be expensive and enforced rigorously.

 

[Regular.Cyclist]

I completely agree with the Dutch proposal and would be more than happy for the UK to follow.

 

[The Crofted Crest]

The Dutch aren't quite that far yet.

They have announced an action plan to debate measures that might at some point in the future result in laws that ban the breeding of animals in order to give them an appearance that is permanently harmful to them, such as flat noses in dogs, folded ears in cats. The first steps in the action plan are to define permanently harmful, draw up a list of affected animals and introduce a ban on exhibiting such animals.

Don't hold your breath.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I don’t think the issue is as 2 dimensional as you make it out to be.

 

[a.twiddler]

The Dutch aren't quite that far yet.

They have announced an action plan to debate measures that might at some point in the future result in laws that ban the breeding of animals in order to give them an appearance that is permanently harmful to them, such as flat noses in dogs, folded ears in cats. The first steps in the action plan are to define permanently harmful, draw up a list of affected animals and introduce a ban on exhibiting such animals.

Don't hold your breath.

This makes more sense. Perhaps the OP should be more critical of his information sources before leaping into print. Ban this, ban that, is all very well, but a proper period of gathering views from all parties affected would precede any action. Would any action cross borders? There's an assumption that you can somehow control all dogs breeding, and that they are all regulated to the nth degree. As a thread starter, It's attention getting all right. but the reality seems to be a bit different. Like a DM headline in fact.

 

[Time Waster]

The Dutch aren't quite that far yet.

They have announced an action plan to debate measures that might at some point in the future result in laws that ban the breeding of animals in order to give them an appearance that is permanently harmful to them, such as flat noses in dogs, folded ears in cats. The first steps in the action plan are to define permanently harmful, draw up a list of affected animals and introduce a ban on exhibiting such animals.

Don't hold your breath.

Aah! The article stated there was a ban on breeding and they were working on laws to ban ownership. Will try to find it, but I don't doubt that you're right. News media often do tricks like pass off plans as in m place or opinions as fact. I think none of us get away without being fooled at times.

Still, as a talking point I think there is need to rein in breed standards and national kennel clubs / show organisations. Crafts should not be televised or at least unhealthy breeds televised until changes have been made imho.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

Not sure how practical it is to ban them - what do you do with the ones currently leading happy lives??

But I would prefer them to have never been bred - most seem to have trouble breathing and can;t run more than a few yards before stopping due to lack of breath

Next door's dog is fine - but when he comes back from a short walk up the road he sounds like he has just run a marathon!!

 

[Regular.Cyclist]

Not sure how practical it is to ban them - what do you do with the ones currently leading happy lives??

The point is that their inbred health issues means they aren’t exactly living happy lives.

The news item I found stated that they were consulting on plans to ban breeding of certain animals and that a ban would come in after a transition period. People who currently own one of the pets would be allowed to keep them until the animal dies.

 

[Time Waster]

Actually it seems 2014 the law on banning the breeding of 20 breeds of brachycephalic dogs was accepted by the Netherlands parliament and that was updated in 2019 also including bent ear cats.

Vet organisation article on Dutch ba of short nosed dogs

 

[Time Waster]

It's about length of snout/ nose vs overall size of head. You should Google pug skulls now vs earlier last century. 100 years has seen a massive change and deformation in the skull.

 

[All uphill]

I dislike the whole concept of breeds.

I understand breeding dogs to do specific jobs, such as sheepdogs, dachshund, but am very uncomfortable with breeding to make a dog into a toy.

 

[Time Waster]

My gran had pugs when i was very young. I only really recall their pig like snorting as they walk. They could not go far without being picked up. They were bred by a top uk breeder but had noses too long. The breeder gave them away under the understanding they were never linked to her or her breeder name. They were rejects because their noses were a bit too long. They still had breathing difficulties! Imagine an unhealthily short nose and they were still rejects because they noses were too long! How crazy is that?!!!!

 

[a.twiddler]

Actually it seems 2014 the law on banning the breeding of 20 breeds of brachycephalic dogs was accepted by the Netherlands parliament and that was updated in 2019 also including bent ear cats.

Vet organisation article on Dutch ba of short nosed dogs

Interesting. Has anyone worked out how to reach all those owners who didn't get their dog or cat from a pedigree breeder but whose pet has amongst the other 57 varieties in their ancestry, these very characteristics, and is currently humping its way through through the local dog and cat population (respectively) in their area? The type of dog or cat owner who doesn't get their pet's nuts cracked and doesn't subscribe to pet insurance and those tediously expensive vaccinations etc? There are likely loads of those about, unless the dog owning population of the Netherlands is vastly more law abiding than ours.

 

[Time Waster]

I dislike the whole concept of breeds.

I understand breeding dogs to do specific jobs, such as sheepdogs, dachshund, but am very uncomfortable with breeding to make a dog into a toy.

Daschunds? Seriously? They've had selective dwarfism deliberately bred in causing serious back issues even leg issues.

PDSA

That's a rather mild description of their breed standard health issues.