Hitting a pedestrian

[GrumpyGregry]

Our cyclist can only control their own actions. They cannot control the actions of others, predictable or unpredictable.

Our cyclist therefore needs to ride accordingly.

 

[KneesUp]

You're cycling along a road. You notice that there is a driver sat in a car some way in front of you. If he opens his door, is that truly unpredictable? I'd say it's quite high up on the list of "What happens next?".

Similarly, you're cycling along a road. There's a pedestrian on the pavement. They begin to turn to face the road. Again is it truly unpredictable that they may step into the road?

No - you've given two very good examples of people behaving in predictable ways.

Try these ones:

You're cycling along a straight road with good visibility. There is a parked car some distance away. It was stationary when first you saw it, and you saw the driver get out. As you get close there is a bus coming the other way, but you don't mind going close to the car because you saw the driver get out a few minutes earlier. As you pass the car the child in the back seat that was too short for you to see opens the door to go and see what's keeping daddy so long.

You're cycling along a road. There is a pedestrian on the pavement walking in a straight line. As you get alongside them they see the bus that loops around to their house coming along the road, so they run across the road directly in front of you without warning to catch it, because they couldn't hear any traffic.

 

[w00hoo_kent]

please, I'm having enough trouble the The Door Zone without you just posting

You're cycling along a road. You notice that there is a driver sat in a car some way in front of you. You have just entered. The Door Zone! di di di dee di di di dee

If he opens his door, is that truly unpredictable? I'd say it's quite high up on the list of "What happens next?".

I'd kind of hope that most decent cyclists would shoulder check and then make room. Just the same as you assess if the car might have someone about to open a door. Or if you can't see around a corner you slow down before going round it (fridge theory, approach every unknown as if someone has dropped a fridge off of their van on the other side).

 

[GrumpyGregry]

You're cycling along a road. There is a pedestrian on the pavement walking in a straight line. As you get alongside them they see the bus that loops around to their house coming along the road, so they run across the road directly in front of you without warning to catch it, because they couldn't hear any traffic.

To be sure of hitting them every time I'd need to practise.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

You're cycling along a straight road with good visibility. There is a parked car some distance away. It was stationary when first you saw it, and you saw the driver get out. As you get close there is a bus coming the other way, but you don't mind going close to the car because you saw the driver get out a few minutes earlier. As you pass the car the child in the back seat that was too short for you to see opens the door to go and see what's keeping daddy so long

Always expect the unexpected. Especially where children and short people may be involved.

Or, alternatively, don't ride in the door zone.

 

[KneesUp]

Always expect the unexpected. Especially where children and short people may be involved.

Or, alternatively, don't ride in the door zone.

So if anyone gets 'doored' it is their fault for not doing that?

 

[GrumpyGregry]

I used to ride in the door zone.
I got doored.
I lived to ride again.
I no longer ride on the door zone.
I have not been doored again.

My approach to playing with matches is rather similar.

 

[KneesUp]

I used to ride in the door zone.
I got doored.
I lived to ride again.
I no longer ride on the door zone.
I have not been doored again.

My approach to playing with matches is rather similar.

Was it your fault when you got 'doored'?

 

[Learnincurve]

oh kay, so when I quote the the highway code it means absolutely nothing, but that one line in the highway code about shared pathways and giving way is sacrosanct then?

Or did no one bother to click the link and see that I have been directly quoting the highway code: https://www.gov.uk/highway-code you can tell it's the highway code from the way it's on a .gov.uk web page and has "the highway code" in big letters on it.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

My answer to your question, and the only pragmatic real world response to the situation, is "Don't ride in the door zone"...

Your response is not a real world answer, it doesn't even address the nub of the question. The real world has hundreds and hundreds of cyclists being injured by car doors every year, as I showed in post #215.

I'm not interested in which members of this forum steadfastly avoid the door zone, rather I am interested in the views of you and others as to whether any cyclist who is involved in such a collision is to blame or not for his own injuries or damage.

... but you didn't see fit to include that in your list of 'acceptable' responses for some reason.

I can't think why not.

I can: your answer tells me nothing about what I'd asked, which remains:

Is the doored cyclist to blame for his own injuries or damage?

GC

GC

 

[GrumpyGregry]

Was it your fault when you got 'doored'?

I was responsible for the choice I made to ride in the door zone.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

We go around in circles....

I suppose he's asking because it's a very common cause of injury to cyclists.

Between 2009-2011, 1,587 cyclists were injured as a result of vehicle doors opening into their path, 224 of them seriously - a further two cyclists were killed.

So, while you might never ride in a door zone, it's a wholly pertinent question that reflects the real world and is a valid comparison with a pedestrian suddenly entering the path of a vehicle.

GC

Given 19,000 cyclists are killed or injured in reported road "accidents" every year according to ROSPA then if the mean dooring per year is 500ish pa I think I take issue with "very common". Be that as it may...

Is that a yes, a no, it depends, or don't know answer to my question?

GC

If you wish to attribute fault or ascribe blame feel free to do so. Not a game I play. But since we are asking questions and demanding answers...

Is the cyclist responsible for the choice they made to ride in the door zone?

 

[KneesUp]

I was responsible for the choice I made to ride in the door zone.

That is true, but equally I am responsible for my choice in coming to work today, but if some nutter bursts in and sprays me with bullets it won't be my fault if there is blood on the floor.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

and thus we move from

Recently a friends son stepped out into the road without looking and was hit by a bike

to

some nutter bursts in and sprays me with bullets

because, obviously, the two are equivalent.

I think I'll pop this thread on the back burner and go for a ride.

 

[KneesUp]

and thus we move from

to


because, obviously, the two are equivalent.

I think I'll pop this thread on the back burner and go for a ride.

I'm not claiming they are equivalent. I am making the point that being responsible for your decisions does not also mean that you are at fault. But you are being deliberately obtuse.

Enjoy your ride. It's just started raining here