Horrible article on Velorution, WTF were they thinking?

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Flying_Monkey

Recyclist
Location
Odawa
I reckon if they don't take it down very soon, they will have the old bill contacting them for incitement to racial hatred...

But what were they thinking? It is just disgusting and really, really stupid...
 

Origamist

Legendary Member
Cab said:
Yes, a strawman used to demonstrate that your implication could not possibly be what you meant. A strawman argument is only a bad thing when you're unaware of using it or, worse, using it to discredit someones views. Here, it was appropriate to discredit the view you were putting across.




Errm, no, there the writer was referring to what others say, the conclusions others (in Holland) have drawn, with the conversations you encounter.

Like it or lump it, thats how people are. Suppose you're in a town with an influx of people from (x). And they look similar to a subset of people who live in your town already. Suppose that you encounter dangerous behaviour from people who look like (x), say, five times in a week; disproportionate to their number. Are you more wary of people who look like they may be (x) when you see them on the road? Is that lazy prejudice?

To say that visibly ethnic people are dangerous on the roads because of their appearance is dreadful, its racist. But to say that people new to an area may have a different cultural perspective on road safety is in no way racist. To then move on to say that if there is an influx of people with that different cultural perspective, and they're of a visible ethnicity, that people will be more wary on the roads around people who look that way... Well, like it or lump it, thats how people will act. The solution? Address the cultural differences that make integrating new immigrant communities difficult.


The above comments by Velorution have a racist dimension to me, not to you. Others can make up their own minds.

I'm not debating this any further with you, as your arguments are not necessarily his, and it's his comments I take exception to. As it stands, your more detailed reading/interpretation is not what is on his website - if he thinks like you he should have qualified his remarks or chosen them more carefully.
 

Origamist

Legendary Member
Flying_Monkey said:
I reckon if they don't take it down very soon, they will have the old bill contacting them for incitement to racial hatred...

But what were they thinking? It is just disgusting and really, really stupid...

I believe someone has already reported it to the Met.
 

Cab

New Member
Location
Cambridge
Origamist said:
if he thinks like you he should have qualified his remarks or chosen them more carefully.

Check back to read my posts to this discussion; thats precisely what I said.
 

Origamist

Legendary Member
Cab said:
Check back to read my posts to this discussion; thats precisely what I said.

So, as the article stands, without your more genteel (and a tad more sophisticated) interpretation, do you find the language employed racially insensitive? I think it is, but you appear not to. I'm now intrigued.

User1314 - I want to know who he means by black skinned immigrants. Do people from Morocco count, what about Turks, or maybe it's only those from Suriname or Aruba, or who knows - he lumps people together with casual disregard for their ethnic difference.
 

buddha

Veteran
I am of South Asian origin (Burmese).
During the latter part of autumn, winter and spring I'd say my skin colour is a medium tan. However during summer it turns much darker.
Does that mean my road sense worsens during the summer months?:?:
And what happens if you have a fake tan?

As I see it, here is somebody who has had an 'incident(s)' on the road. And has made the narrow-minded generalisation that all ethnic minorities behave in a similar way. And has then abused their position in writing this public article/rant. Plonker!
 

Cab

New Member
Location
Cambridge
Origamist said:
So, as the article stands, without your more genteel (and a tad more sophisticated) interpretation, do you find the language employed racially insensitive? I think it is, but you appear not to. I'm now intrigued.

The language? Yes, but I suspect that the intention was not to be racially charged, I think the intention was to come out with a provocative article to get people talking; that was successful, but for all the wrong reasons.
 

dondare

Über Member
Location
London
Origamist said:
So, as the article stands, without your more genteel (and a tad more sophisticated) interpretation, do you find the language employed racially insensitive? I think it is, but you appear not to. I'm now intrigued.

User1314 - I want to know who he means by black skinned immigrants. Do people from Morocco count, what about Turks, or maybe it's only those from Suriname or Aruba, or who knows - he lumps people together with casual disregard for their ethnic difference.


Don't get me started about the Turks...
 

stephenb

Guru
dondare said:
If the Mail picks this up as an "imigrants vs cyclists" issue, then who's side will they be on?

I'm an immigrant & a cyclist so I guess I'm screwed (jewish as well)
 
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