Red light jumping. Ok or not ?

Red light jumping is okay

  • Yes

    Votes: 7 3.7%
  • Sometimes

    Votes: 57 30.2%
  • No

    Votes: 112 59.3%
  • bring back hanging

    Votes: 13 6.9%

  • Total voters
    189
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Angelfishsolo

A Velocipedian
As a vet and a scientist who has worked in both the UK and the USA I can assure you I know what I'm talking about.

No you know what you have been taught. Have you seen the flip side of it? The animals kept in cages 24/7, eyes forced open to have god knows what dripped into them, drug testing carried out out on them,. I have. I have also rescued animals from this life of hell and am proud of it. That is the one law I am happy to break.
 
No you know what you have been taught. Have you seen the flip side of it? The animals kept in cages 24/7, eyes forced open to have god knows what dripped into them, drug testing carried out out on them,. I have. I have also rescued animals from this life of hell and am proud of it. That is the one law I am happy to break.

No I know what laws scientists have to work within and believe me they are strict! The research animals I have encountered (in this country at least) are incredibly well cared for and have a better quality of life than most pets (I'm talking small furry things like mice and rats here). All you lot do is slow down the development of therapies that can be life-saving to humans AND animals. Most anti-viv propaganda is at least 20 years old in my experience, and often from outside the UK. The anti-vivs I've met are incredibly ill-informed, ignorant and narrow minded. Traits that you have displayed in many threads including this one.
 

adds21

Rider of bikes
Location
North Somerset
No you know what you have been taught. Have you seen the flip side of it? The animals kept in cages 24/7, eyes forced open to have god knows what dripped into them, drug testing carried out out on them,. I have. I have also rescued animals from this life of hell and am proud of it. That is the one law I am happy to break.

I know it's out of vogue, but to try and get back on-topic here, you're saying that it's okay to break some laws, despite saying

Red Light jumping is against the law thus it is wrong.

and

I actively campaign for laws to be changed (animal experimentation for example) but do so within the law.

Interesting.
 

Angelfishsolo

A Velocipedian
[QUOTE 1513351"]
<voiceover from Dragon's Den>
An interesting development. Very unusually, a member pops up who is qualified enough to know what they're talking about. With an intelligent response Becs sweeps AFS off his feet. Will he be able to come back from this rebuke?...
</voiceover from Dragon's Den>
[/quote]

I am always sickened when a person who works in a profession where animal care is paramount is OK with animal experimentation and legalised torture.
 

gbb

Legendary Member
Location
Peterborough
Coming in late to this one...
IMO, like all questions of this sort, you can't see it black and white, its a matter of common sense and in some circumstances, even the police would at best agree, at worst, turn a blind eye.

Scenario1 ...you've arrived at some red lights, there's other traffic or peds using the junction, you jump the red lights....you've wrong and deserve anything that comes your way.

Scenario 2...you approach the lights at say 11pm, the roads are empty, there is no other traffic, nothing. Acceptable to pass the red with caution...yes IMO, but with all due care.

Scenario 3...you approach the lights and stop...and wait. Nothing happens. Its reasonable to assume your bike hasn't activated the loop, so if you blindly follow the law, you'll be there until the next car arrives...which may be an hour.

Scenario 4..and this actually happened to me the other day. Arrived at some red lights in a quiet industrial estate....IN A CAR. Waited...waited...waited, for maybe 2 or 3 minutes. I know the phases there, it NEVER takes that long but do notice the've had the road up and resurfaced a lot.
So, even if i'm wrong, its reasonable to assume the lights have failed for some reason. I pulled away, checking carefully first that there's no other traffic...lo and behold, i looked in my rear view from about 200 yards further on, they'd finally changed to green.

Now, some may argue if you arrived at some TLs on a bike and they didnt change, you should dismount and walk around or across. Working on that principle...should i have pushed my car across....of course not, neither would i on a bike.

Its about common sense. They're just 4 scenarios i can be bothered to think of, they all have different reasons and outcomes. Nothings black and white, not even the law.
If a policeman had seen me...i think it'd have been reasonable to expect him to see the common sense in it all.
 

martint235

Dog on a bike
Location
Welling
So why do we as humans need to test drugs for humans on animals? I know several vets against that.

I'm all for testing human drugs on humans but unfortunately there seems to be an even bigger outcry about that.

Testing treatments on animals has led to huge leaps forward in medical science that shouldn't be ignored.

I can't say I'm a huge fan of the human race as a whole and certainly don't believe that we are "better" than animals, we are just another species. What we are doing though is what any other animal does which is using every method we can come up with to ensure the survival of the species. This unfortunately for the animals involved means they bear the brunt of the testing.

Other animals tend to die for my steak. I can live with this.
 
What Martin said!

To be honest, nothing we say will ever change your mind so there is no point continuing this conversation. All i know is that if my son was born with a fatal disease I be very glad a few mice were humanely sacrificed to find something that would reduce his suffering.

Anyway. BACK TO RED LIGHT JUMPING!
 
[QUOTE 1513351"]
<voiceover from Dragon's Den>
An interesting development. Very unusually, a member pops up who is qualified enough to know what they're talking about. With an intelligent response Becs sweeps AFS off his feet. Will he be able to come back from this rebuke?...
</voiceover from Dragon's Den>
[/quote]

Not to be pedantic, but seeing as (AGFS) loves pointing out where others sidestep questions that may cause difficulty......

So, why do you (AGFS) take the stance not to RLJ as it is wrong and against the law, but you are happy to break different laws to further your personal interest in preventing animal testing?

Actually, heres the deal breaker, you'll like this :whistle:

You are on your way to rescue animals illegally from legal licensed premises yet you stop at each and every red light because it is illegal to run through them.:wacko:

By the way I'm not looking to score points there, I'm just trying to squeeze some amusement from the latest RLJ saga, its like George Lucas pops up every so often to remake RLJ threads in a slightly different way to the last time.....
 

Angelfishsolo

A Velocipedian
Not to be pedantic, but seeing as (AGFS) loves pointing out where others sidestep questions that may cause difficulty......

So, why do you (AGFS) take the stance not to RLJ as it is wrong and against the law, but you are happy to break different laws to further your personal interest in preventing animal testing?

Actually, heres the deal breaker, you'll like this :whistle:

You are on your way to rescue animals illegally from legal licensed premises yet you stop at each and every red light because it is illegal to run through them.:wacko:

By the way I'm not looking to score points there, I'm just trying to squeeze some amusement from the latest RLJ saga, its like George Lucas pops up every so often to remake RLJ threads in a slightly different way to the last time.....

:tired:
 
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