Team BKool CycleChat

[<Tommy>]

The same thought has been going through my head.

I've been playing around with cadence and how frequently I ride, but really what I'm trying to do is get as close as I can to the feeling or riding in the real world.

But then again , when it goes well all that goes out of my head and I get carried along by the enjoyment of racing and an improved performance.

So, is that more important to me after all?



So, how do the trainers really compare to you?

As I said above, I'm at the start of thinking about getting a direct drive trainer. I've also though for a long time about giving Zwift a go.

The direct drive option is really me wanting to find out if its more realistic, but I could buy one and then feel, so what? Why did I bother?

If I can try Zwift on Bkool and get an accurate feel for it, then obviously I should do that.

But then as @TurboTommy has said, I suspect I'd come back to thinking that I'd miss the Chain Gang and Handicap rides. And I always think that if Bkool just got its quality issues under control, then its range of rides available should make it the best simulator around......... but that's a long way to go right now.

Honestly del no matter what turbo or sim you use it’s not same as the real world. I know it sounds obvious but sometimes we say things like ‘as close’ or ‘closest’ to the real world. I think it’s bollocks really. Zwift is closer to reality in that the reading are more accurate. And you can get a better turbo that offers higher resistance and different feel. But I’ve got a wattbike atom. And I’ve test ridden a neo. Neither feel like riding in the real world. And why would they honestly. I’d get one as an upgrade if you want any of the features listed above. Or when the BKOOL pro gives up the ghost. But it won’t replicate real world cycling. I love riding bikes. Ecspecially if they’re really humming! When everything is working as it should and well tuned. The slight bounce of the rear wheel. Leaning into corners. Changing position. Attacking, judging, descending. The places it takes us. The weather, good and not so good... All that good stuff and much more. The turbo for me is just a means to an end in comparison really. Having a good quality turbo is nice. Like having good working stuff in general is nice. But....

That reminds me Del. Have you looked at the meet ups thread? We’re hoping to meet up a couple of times in the sunnier months and you, and everyone else is more than welcome

 

[Del C]

Honestly del no matter what turbo or sim you use it’s not same as the real world. I know it sounds obvious but sometimes we say things like ‘as close’ or ‘closest’ to the real world. I think it’s bollocks really. Zwift is closer to reality in that the reading are more accurate. And you can get a better turbo that offers higher resistance and different feel. But I’ve got a wattbike atom. And I’ve test ridden a neo. Neither feel like riding in the real world. And why would they honestly. I’d get one as an upgrade if you want any of the features listed above. Or when the BKOOL pro gives up the ghost. But it won’t replicate real world cycling. I love riding bikes. Ecspecially if they’re really humming! When everything is working as it should and well tuned. The slight bounce of the rear wheel. Leaning into corners. Changing position. Attacking, judging, descending. The places it takes us. The weather, good and not so good... All that good stuff and much more. The turbo for me is just a means to an end in comparison really. Having a good quality turbo is nice. Like having good working stuff in general is nice. But....

That reminds me Del. Have you looked at the meet ups thread? We’re hoping to meet up a couple of times in the sunnier months and you, and everyone else is more than welcome

Good points.

I think the best thing for me is that the turbo keeps me riding through the winter when the weather is against it. The fact I enjoy the CG and Handicap rides is a bonus.

The urge to try a direct drive trainer is just to see how it feels in comparison, but its an expensive thing to do if it doesn't bring anything else to the game!

I have looked at the meet-ups thread. I'd be more than happy to meet up with people on here and ride in the real world if the dates work out.

 

[Brendan Parker]

So I'm thinking tomorrow we should have a last go at a decent TTT Handicap before the clocks go forward for summer time!

Hopefully we can get full teams, so who's up for it? @Add now's your chance!

Team Beige - @berty bassett @Jim Brown @rob01792 @Arkone56 @Goldwolfie and @Merida reacto 4000

Team Red - @LBHIFI @perswe @Rod McG @Add @Del C @bert1971
@LBHIFI in either Red or Green depending on numbers

Team Green - @Daddy Pig @Brusgaard @keithaitch @Aleman @Whorty (Bkool Pro) @BaldyZ1 (@JJRobinson off lambing!)
@Daddy Pig in either Green or Blue depending on numbers?

Team Blue - @AAAC 76C @bridgy @BILL S @peterob

Anyone else who wants to join in?

Geoff

I'm in, already sewed the seed for an early shoot from work

 

[Aleman]

Am I going to be the only Team Green? ... OK Solo TT Mode ... Does that mean I have to ride it three times to get an official funishing time??

 

[peterob]

So I'm thinking tomorrow we should have a last go at a decent TTT Handicap before the clocks go forward for summer time!

Hopefully we can get full teams, so who's up for it? @Add now's your chance!

Team Beige - @berty bassett @Jim Brown @rob01792 @Arkone56 @Goldwolfie and @Merida reacto 4000

Team Red - @LBHIFI @perswe @Rod McG @Add @Del C @bert1971
@LBHIFI in either Red or Green depending on numbers

Team Green - @Daddy Pig @Brusgaard @keithaitch @Aleman @Whorty (Bkool Pro) @BaldyZ1 (@JJRobinson off lambing!)
@Daddy Pig in either Green or Blue depending on numbers?

Team Blue - @AAAC 76C @bridgy @BILL S @peterob

Anyone else who wants to join in?

Geoff

I'll be there Geoff

 

[gbrown]

Am I going to be the only Team Green? ... OK Solo TT Mode ... Does that mean I have to ride it three times to get an official funishing time??

Hopefully not, and with enough time we'll try and swap things around to make full teams, even if we have to drop to three teams only.

Geoff

 

[bobinski]

If riding and racing with this motley crew is all you need then there is no point in upgrading to a direct drive turbo. It won’t offer an experience akin to IRl rides although I do find being able to get out of the saddle and the slight sideways sway of the NEO helps with comfort, sprinting and power up hills.

 

[Brusgaard]

Team Green - @Daddy Pig @Brusgaard @keithaitch [B]@Aleman[/B] @Whorty (Bkool Pro) @BaldyZ1 (@JJRobinson off lambing!)
@Daddy Pig in either Green or Blue depending on numbers?

I'm OUT. Team Green will have to do it on their own this week (not much help from them last week though).

On Tuesdays I do the Danish Bkool League races, and the one tomorrow is the last one of the winter season. In April the spring league begins, but with only one weekly race on Tuesdays, and using the Bkool League system, meaning I can do the stages another day, if I want to!

 

[Whorty]

So I'm thinking tomorrow we should have a last go at a decent TTT Handicap before the clocks go forward for summer time!

Hopefully we can get full teams, so who's up for it? @Add now's your chance!

Team Beige - @berty bassett [B]@Jim Brown[/B] @rob01792 @Arkone56 @Goldwolfie and @Merida reacto 4000

Team Red - @LBHIFI @perswe @Rod McG @Add [B]@Del C[/B] [B]@bert1971[/B]
@LBHIFI in either Red or Green depending on numbers

Team Green - @Daddy Pig [COLOR=#bfbfbf]@Brusgaard[/COLOR] @keithaitch [B]@Aleman[/B] @Whorty (Bkool Pro) @BaldyZ1 (@JJRobinson off lambing!)
@Daddy Pig in either Green or Blue depending on numbers?

Team Blue - @AAAC 76C @bridgy [B]@BILL S[/B] [B]@peterob[/B]

Anyone else who wants to join in?

Geoff

Gone down with Man Flu so not sure yet. Feeling a bit rough today. If I do join I'll be on the Kickr so will join Team Beige. Need to see how the drugs work today

 

[berty bassett]

all i was saying is the neo seems closer to reality in overall data in both zwift and bkool , the pro is very close to the same data in zwift but miles out in bkool - why ? thats what i can't understand - if the algorithms work for neo in bkool then why not the pro in bkool when they are the same in zwift ?
i really enjoy racing with you lot in bkool on the pro, but its not a race on the neo , it reacts totally different so you cant race as such , just put in a personal tt time - nowhere near as much fun in a group doing different
i will continue to race in bkool but only on the pro for races - for me i want to compete and be comparable to others
its as near to racing that this old man gets !

 

[bridgy]

all i was saying is the neo seems closer to reality in overall data in both zwift and bkool , the pro is very close to the same data in zwift but miles out in bkool - why ? thats what i can't understand - if the algorithms work for neo in bkool then why not the pro in bkool when they are the same in zwift ?
i really enjoy racing with you lot in bkool on the pro, but its not a race on the neo , it reacts totally different so you cant race as such , just put in a personal tt time - nowhere near as much fun in a group doing different
i will continue to race in bkool but only on the pro for races - for me i want to compete and be comparable to others
its as near to racing that this old man gets !

I think the answer to this is that the Neo has a built in power meter, so shows accurate watts in Bkool software just like it would in any other, whilst the Pro is using estimated watts and so this requires an algorithm to be tweaked to match realistic power in all circumstances as well as possible.

Bottom line is, Zwift have done a much better job of getting this algorithm right than Bkool have.

 

[theboxers]

I think the answer to this is that the Neo has a built in power meter, so shows accurate watts in Bkool software just like it would in any other, whilst the Pro is using estimated watts and so this requires an algorithm to be tweaked to match realistic power in all circumstances as well as possible.

Bottom line is, Zwift have done a much better job of getting this algorithm right than Bkool have.

That should be, Zwift cared more about a level playing field than Bkool does. Zwift do not sell trainers

 

[berty bassett]

it is a strange one because on the neo it didn't matter what i did on the transition from downhill to uphill - it seemed to think i should be doing 9mph at the beginning of the hill whether i was pedalling or coasting so the speed went down no matter what i did then slowly creep up to match effort where as the pro i think may slowly come down to match effort

 

[theboxers]

it is a strange one because on the neo it didn't matter what i did on the transition from downhill to uphill - it seemed to think i should be doing 9mph at the beginning of the hill whether i was pedalling or coasting so the speed went down no matter what i did then slowly creep up to match effort where as the pro i think may slowly come down to match effort

My pro is giving me an embarrassment of riches compared to my classic. I had slingshots on my classic, which lasted as long as I could push the power, but not a lot else. The classic gave a slightly high reading where power was concerned but only 10-30w, compared to vectors.

The pro just gives me silly power. I am seeing 400+ watts for 200 or less on the vectors. Vectors give a number and the pro doubles it. It is just plain fu'ts.

I am with @bobinski on this. The pro he had, that I now have, is mad . It does not lend itself to enjoyable virtual riding because it is so wrong.

 

[Rod McG]

I agree that the trainer doesn't need to match real world, so long as it gives a workout. In some ways it is actually better: in the real world I am not able to pedal fast enough to get a good workout downhill, but bkool provides this. For me the most important issue is that bkool doesn't change their algorithms, otherwise we cannot compare our efforts to rides done in the past.

So I'm thinking tomorrow we should have a last go at a decent TTT Handicap before the clocks go forward for summer time!

Hopefully we can get full teams, so who's up for it? @Add now's your chance!

Team Beige - @berty bassett [B]@Jim Brown[/B] @rob01792 @Arkone56 @Goldwolfie and @Merida reacto 4000

Team Red - @LBHIFI @perswe @Rod McG @Add [B]@Del C[/B] [B]@bert1971[/B]
@LBHIFI in either Red or Green depending on numbers

Team Green - @Daddy Pig [COLOR=#bfbfbf]@Brusgaard[/COLOR] @keithaitch [B]@Aleman[/B] @Whorty (Bkool Pro) @BaldyZ1 (@JJRobinson off lambing!)
@Daddy Pig in either Green or Blue depending on numbers?

Team Blue - @AAAC 76C @bridgy [B]@BILL S[/B] [B]@peterob[/B]

Anyone else who wants to join in?

Geoff

I'm trying to get LEJOG finished before the clocks change, so please count me out. Blame @Jim Brown, if you wish!!