Was this bus driver bad?

[Cab]

erm, the bike could have come from a legal route, more likely didn't

Really? Who says? More to the point, what of it? Its now appropriate to make as to pull out into the path of a vehicle that might have broken the law? Ridiculous assertion, really.

did keep coming despite the bus indicating and starting to pull out

Thats the choice of the person in the carriageway; do you know whether that cyclist decided to keep going because it did not seem safe to stop? Do you know whether there was a car right on his arse? Do you know whether conditions were slippery and he maybe decided it wasn't safe to stop there? Thats the reality of that kind of decision, and thats why its up to the person on the road to make that call, and not the person pulling out. We have no clear evidence that the cyclist was in the wrong, only a statement that the bus was indicating and starting to pull out. If that, in Nethalus view, is sufficient to mean that the cyclist is in the wrong then she oughtn't be driving a bus.

and did say something to the bus driver

Something along the lines of 'thanks mate'. Gee, a cyclist gets cut up and responds by being seriously over-polite to the motorist. The motorist then gets insulting, having initially tried to take road space from the cyclist and then being called up politely for doing so.

Sorry, I'm not really seeing the bus drivers side of the story here. It isn't like the cyclist definitely came from a bad road position, an illegal road position or definitely could or should have let the bus driver out. It depends on the local conditions at the time and its the cyclists call.

Nethalus made as if to pull out in front of the rider, the rider gave the formal, polite response that many cyclists use in such a situation, the bus driver overreacted in a manner that, in other lines of work, would result in disciplinary action.

 

[tdr1nka]

Hey, this is going a bit potty here,

I've worked in retail and had tea breaks with fellow staff and had chats wile working or should I have been taken out and shot for some treasonous peccadillo I muttered when my biro ran out in front of a customer?

I had a biro run out on me the other day, but with the Godlike control I have over my bike, and my emotions, I took positive action to avoid it and we all lived happily ever after.

So there.

T x

 

[col]

Really? Who says? More to the point, what of it? Its now appropriate to make as to pull out into the path of a vehicle that might have broken the law? Ridiculous assertion, really.



Thats the choice of the person in the carriageway; do you know whether that cyclist decided to keep going because it did not seem safe to stop? Do you know whether there was a car right on his arse? Do you know whether conditions were slippery and he maybe decided it wasn't safe to stop there? Thats the reality of that kind of decision, and thats why its up to the person on the road to make that call, and not the person pulling out. We have no clear evidence that the cyclist was in the wrong, only a statement that the bus was indicating and starting to pull out. If that, in Nethalus view, is sufficient to mean that the cyclist is in the wrong then she oughtn't be driving a bus.



Something along the lines of 'thanks mate'. Gee, a cyclist gets cut up and responds by being seriously over-polite to the motorist. The motorist then gets insulting, having initially tried to take road space from the cyclist and then being called up politely for doing so.

Sorry, I'm not really seeing the bus drivers side of the story here. It isn't like the cyclist definitely came from a bad road position, an illegal road position or definitely could or should have let the bus driver out. It depends on the local conditions at the time and its the cyclists call.

Nethalus made as if to pull out in front of the rider, the rider gave the formal, polite response that many cyclists use in such a situation, the bus driver overreacted in a manner that, in other lines of work, would result in disciplinary action.

Just a small point,but unless the bike was at a point where slowing or stopping isnt an option,I am under the impression that vehicles are required to give way to pcv's?Or am i wrong in that assumption?

 

[nethalus]

Yeah come on guys, leave off Nethalus. It wasn't a very bad thing to do, and quite understandable IMO.

I admit I shouldn't have done it like, and I haven't done it again since. Mind you I know other bus drivers who have done far wose!!

 

[Cab]

Just a small point,but unless the bike was at a point where slowing or stopping isnt an option,I am under the impression that vehicles are required to give way to pcv's?Or am i wrong in that assumption?

If its safe to do so, you're meant to let a bus out. If for whatever reason it isn't safe to do so, or if letting the bus out is in any way going to increase your risk, then you're certainly not required to do so. Or, in other words, its bad form not to let a bus out if you can reasonably do so, but the decision as to whether it is reasonable to do so has to be left to the individual road user.

 

[domd1979]

I'm under the same impression since its in the Highway Code... No doubt someone will point out the absence of the word "must" in a minute... People not letting buses pull out really irritates me - it isn't difficult. Part of cycling or driving is anticipating what other road users are going to do. Anticipating a bus might put its right indicator on and need to pull out into the carriageway isn't rocket science; neither is the act of stopping/slowing down to let it out. Amusingly people who don't let buses out have shot themselves in the foot, because lay-bys for bus stops are increasingly out of fashion, so buses increasingly have to stop in the carriageway.

Just a small point,but unless the bike was at a point where slowing or stopping isnt an option,I am under the impression that vehicles are required to give way to pcv's?Or am i wrong in that assumption?

 

[Cab]

People not letting buses pull out really irritates me - it isn't difficult.

I agree entirely. Usually it isn't hard at all, and you should be anticipating well in advance whether a bus is likely to want out. Its only sensible.

But that doesn't, of course, mean that you'll never end up going past a bus that is stopped, or that a bus driver won't just indicate and pull out rather abruptly when you're committed to going past. There are a couple of layby style bus stops around here where many bus drivers seem happy to pull in to at an angle, meaning that they've got a blind spot as big as the whole road behind them, they seem to rely on the fact that traffic will always stop to let them out. Fine, except when they start to move out into road space you're imminently entering; sometimes however careful you are that kind of pulling out can be a little hairy, especially when they indicate for only a fraction of a second before pulling out.

 

[nethalus]

Thats got nothing whatsoever to do with Users point.

You were identifiable as an employee of a particular company, being paid to do a job, and you abused a member of the public by making a rude gesture. Its exacly the same as a shop worker coming out to the shop door and being rude to someone, or someone in a bank coming onto the counter and yelling abuse at the person in the middle of the queue who is acting impatient.

Why is it okay to be abusive to the public if you're a bus driver and not if, say, you're working in a bank?

While at work I've been verbally abused, threatened and assaulted by passengers, taxi drivers, van drivers, car drivers and pedestrians.
I've had a mini cab driver shout "effing w**ker" at me for no reason other than I moved lanes, with clear indication and in a safe gap, and he didn't like the fact a bus got in front of him. The name of his firm, Road Runners if anyone's interested, was plastered all his cab but I doubted he was overley bothered about his company's reputation when he shouted it out in front of dozens of people.
Had a landscape gardeners van decide he wasn't going to hang back five seconds to let me get into a gap so we could safely pass each other, no he sat there giving me a w**ker sign! Also had a charming gentleman pedestrian, who for no reason I can fathom decided to call me a "fat bus driving sl*g"
Been called an "effing fat b*tch" by some of the charming traveling public so many times now I've lost count. Just shrug my shoulders now and think "What ever mate!!"

 

[col]

I'm under the same impression since its in the Highway Code... No doubt someone will point out the absence of the word "must" in a minute... People not letting buses pull out really irritates me - it isn't difficult. Part of cycling or driving is anticipating what other road users are going to do. Anticipating a bus might put its right indicator on and need to pull out into the carriageway isn't rocket science; neither is the act of stopping/slowing down to let it out. Amusingly people who don't let buses out have shot themselves in the foot, because lay-bys for bus stops are increasingly out of fashion, so buses increasingly have to stop in the carriageway.

Indicating and moving,is a good sign that im moving off,but the amount of times people have kept the same speed and passed me 20 or 30 yards down the road,or shouted and honked,that they may have needed to take their foot of the accelerator for a few seconds.A bus is generally a slow vehicle,but a lot of people seem to think it should be going the limit as soon as it pulls away.If we were to wait for a couple of hundred yards gap,we would never pull off

 

[Cab]

While at work I've been verbally abused, threatened and assaulted by passengers, taxi drivers, van drivers, car drivers and pedestrians.

None of which excuses you being abusive to an entirely different person.

I've had a mini cab driver shout "effing w**ker" at me for no reason other than I moved lanes, with clear indication and in a safe gap, and he didn't like the fact a bus got in front of him. The name of his firm, Road Runners if anyone's interested, was plastered all his cab but I doubted he was overley bothered about his company's reputation when he shouted it out in front of dozens of people.

And that doesn't excuse you being abusive to another road user entirely either.

Had a landscape gardeners van decide he wasn't going to hang back five seconds to let me get into a gap so we could safely pass each other, no he sat there giving me a w**ker sign! Also had a charming gentleman pedestrian, who for no reason I can fathom decided to call me a "fat bus driving sl*g"

Which again doesn't mean that the cyclist you were making rude gestures at was fair game.

Been called an "effing fat b*tch" by some of the charming traveling public so many times now I've lost count. Just shrug my shoulders now and think "What ever mate!!"

So what are you saying, its okay for you as a supposed professional driver to abuse other people on the roads? But you've just said that you know what you did was wrong. Make up your mind.

You know what you did was wrong. You also know that you can't justify it based on the cyclists actions because (according to your first posting) the cyclist wasn't even rude to you, he actually thanked you, I presume intentionally so that you would have to be most unreasonable to actually abuse the cyclist; its a tactic used by many here. You also know that the cyclist may well have been cycling entirely within the law, yet you assumed otherwise. You base your conclusion that the cyclist should definitely have let you out on an incomplete understanding of what the cyclist was doing, as is entirely clear from the fact that you hadn't even seen the cyclist when you started pulling out. You are therefore in no position to judge whether the cyclist could safely have stopped to let you out.

I don't see why we're having this discussion. We all agree that if it is safe to let a bus out then you should, but its also clear that your manoevre and your subsequent behaviour were both inappropriate.

 

[John the Monkey]

....People not letting buses pull out really irritates me - it isn't difficult. Part of cycling or driving is anticipating what other road users are going to do. Anticipating a bus might put its right indicator on and need to pull out into the carriageway isn't rocket science; neither is the act of stopping/slowing down to let it out.

I'd agree, but have to say that I don't do anything in the way of slowing/moving over until I see the indication from the bus. Anticipating a move that doesn't happen can result in problems rejoining the traffic stream you left, and/or slowing the following traffic unnecessarily (at least if the bus is indicating, the following traffic can see why you're taking the action you are).

I do agree with Cab that the final decision belongs to me - I know my bike, I know how quickly I can stop it in a controlled fashion, and I probably know how (im)patient/(in)considerate the driver behind me is going to be if I do slow or stop. FWIW, when I have passed an indicating bus, I apologise to the driver and explain why (if possible) later on. (Passed one in the rain a few weeks ago, and did that).

 

[nethalus]

None of which excuses you being abusive to an entirely different person.



And that doesn't excuse you being abusive to another road user entirely either.



Which again doesn't mean that the cyclist you were making rude gestures at was fair game.



So what are you saying, its okay for you as a supposed professional driver to abuse other people on the roads? But you've just said that you know what you did was wrong. Make up your mind.

You know what you did was wrong. You also know that you can't justify it based on the cyclists actions because (according to your first posting) the cyclist wasn't even rude to you, he actually thanked you, I presume intentionally so that you would have to be most unreasonable to actually abuse the cyclist; its a tactic used by many here. You also know that the cyclist may well have been cycling entirely within the law, yet you assumed otherwise. You base your conclusion that the cyclist should definitely have let you out on an incomplete understanding of what the cyclist was doing, as is entirely clear from the fact that you hadn't even seen the cyclist when you started pulling out. You are therefore in no position to judge whether the cyclist could safely have stopped to let you out.

I don't see why we're having this discussion. We all agree that if it is safe to let a bus out then you should, but its also clear that your manoevre and your subsequent behaviour were both inappropriate.

No what I was saying is that worse things happen all the time to loads of people everyday. If you bothered to read back you will see that twice I have already admitted that I should'nt have stuck twos up at the cyclist.
And the cyclist was being sarcastic when they "thanked" me, after they had shouted Oi, that was what peed me off and led to me sticking twos up at them.

 

[Cab]

No what I was saying is that worse things happen all the time to loads of people everyday. If you bothered to read back you will see that twice I have already admitted that I should'nt have stuck twos up at the cyclist.

Yes, I know, which is why I pointed out that you had already said that you were in the wrong. I simply don't see why giving us a list of your own grievances on the road is in any way appropriate. So you've been insulted too, what on earth has that got to do with the fact that you were abusive to someone who had nothing at all to do with the people who have given you a hard time?

 

[tdr1nka]

WOW, judge and jury Cab!

I think Nanny has been over starching your shorts again!
We at Tdr1nka Towers salute you, and give way everytime to Omnibus driving Public servants, like your good self!

Don't worry about Cab, he must have dropped his sliderule down the stereogram........

T x

 

[BentMikey]

I don't see her trying to justify it. She fessed up it was wrong, and that's all.

Cab, I think you're getting a little out of hand here. I think you should chill before it gets any more embarrassing.