What’s stopping women cycling?

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vickster

Legendary Member
I apologise if I failed to express myself clearly - or, equally, if I expressed myself only too clearly and thereby revealed that I am not as far down the road of freeing myself from my chauvinistic instincts as I would like to be.

What I was musing around is this.
I believe that the present rise of road cycling culture, welcome in many ways, can lead to an image that cycling is a serious sport, only for people wanting to put themselves through serious exertion and probably pain.

I was wondering to what extent this impression is created by men rather than women, and to what extent it is more offputting to women than to men.

I recognise that I am not free enough from my own prejudices to come with a neutral answer to those questions on my own.
I personally doubt MAMILs in the Surrey hills have any influence on women cycling or not (not in Surrey and especially not anywhere else in the country, the original article is based on women's experiences in Leicester)
 

vickster

Legendary Member
most of us most likely saw it but didn't feel the need to mention it,
Precisely. Maybe the someone should have been in inverted commas
 
Gawd blimey guv, now there's a question.

Attractive women in tight fitting Lycra are not parading themselves around. They're entitled to wear it, just the same way I do. Yes, I'm a red blooded male and women can look very nice like that, but I don't perv at them or call them ribald names as they go by.
Why does the attractiveness matter? Why does it matter whether or not you think some women look good in lycra? People can wear the clothes they want. The logical thing to wear when taking part in PE is PE kit. You may not 'perv at them or call them ribald names as they go by' (whoopee - what do you want, a medal?) but you did choose upthread to describe women wearing lycra as them 'parading themselves around the road'. Would it kill you when called out on that to say 'fair play, that wasn't really what I meant and I probably shouldn't have phrased it like that' instead of a bunch of self-serving guff about what a red-blooded man you are?

Apologies if use of the word female was insulting in any way. I've been told off by some non-male members before for using the terms ladies and women, and I'm running out of words to describe them that don't upset someone somewhere. XX chromosome bearers, perhaps?
I know some women who find it pretty objectionable to be referred to as ladies. I'm intrigued by the context in which you perceive yourself to have been told off for using the nouns woman or women.
 
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Globalti

Legendary Member
*Anthropologist hat on* Some people suggest that golf is a prey-chasing game. Is cycling therefore a territory-patrolling, fitness proving game? This thought used to strike me when I used to mountain bike in clubs and I used to watch the fit young men racing around, pulling stunts, showing off, almost sniffing around their territories like a pack of hounds. This was at the start of mountain biking in the mid 80s to early 90s when most riders seemed to be in their teens and twenties and quite a few came from BMX.

Just a thought, like.
 
As to actual reasons why fewer women cycle than men - I reckon there's loads of contributory factors. It is quite important to distinguish between reasons that an individual of any gender does or doesn't choose to ride a bike for sport/leisure/utility etc and the the reasons that groups of people may experience barriers to participation. A few starters, for ten...
  • we socialise girls out of, and boys into, being competitive from a fairly early age
  • we encourage risk-taking behaviours much more in our sons than we do in our daughters
  • boys are rewarded for being brave and strong and tough and girls for being pretty and well-behaved - so of course teenage girls tend to become incredibly self-conscious about sportswear and sweat and messed up hair
  • Women typically have
    • less disposable income
    • less available leisure time
    • and more caring responsibilities than men
 

Slick

Guru
[QUOTE 5123968, member: 10119"]As to actual reasons why fewer women cycle than men - I reckon there's loads of contributory factors. It is quite important to distinguish between reasons that an individual of any gender does or doesn't choose to ride a bike for sport/leisure/utility etc and the the reasons that groups of people may experience barriers to participation. A few starters, for ten...
  • we socialise girls out of, and boys into, being competitive from a fairly early age
  • we encourage risk-taking behaviours much more in our sons than we do in our daughters
  • boys are rewarded for being brave and strong and tough and girls for being pretty and well-behaved - so of course teenage girls tend to become incredibly self-conscious about sportswear and sweat and messed up hair
  • Women typically have
    • less disposable income
    • less available leisure time
    • and more caring responsibilities than men
[/QUOTE]
30 or 40 years ago maybe.
 

Slick

Guru
That thinking is what is part of the problem, unfortunately.
I was at the under 13 girls cyclocross today at Linlithgow and didn't recognise any of the traits as described in the post I was referring.
 

Slick

Guru
Nope - still a thing.
I watch my sister in law with her two - one of each - and I despair.
I only have sons - hope I would have brought daughters up just the same but, due to my own conditioning, who can tell.
Well that is sad. I had a great day watching these girls go toe to toe in tough conditions.
 

Slick

Guru
Nope - still a thing.
I watch my sister in law with her two - one of each - and I despair.
I only have sons - hope I would have brought daughters up just the same but, due to my own conditioning, who can tell.
I also remember 35 years ago or even more being thrown round the room by a very slightly built girl at Judo, and I was quite a large child. Her and her sister went on to become Scottish champions I think competing in commonwealth and Olympics. My only point my admittedly restricted experience tells me different but we all have different experiences.
 
I was at the under 13 girls cyclocross today at Linlithgow and didn't recognise any of the traits as described in the post I was referring.
Remember - distinguish between the individuals and the groups.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/15/well/family/talking-to-boys-the-way-we-talk-to-girls.html
Just as women’s studies classes have long examined the ways that gendered language undermines women and girls, a growing body of research shows that stereotypical messages are similarly damaging to boys.
What’s more, a 2017 study led by Emory University researchers discovered, among other things, that fathers also sing and smile more to their daughters, and they use language that is more “analytical” and that acknowledges their sadness far more than they do with their sons. The words they use with sons are more focused on achievement — such as “win” and “proud.”
After visits to the emergency room for accidental injuries, another study found, parents of both genders talk differently to sons than they do to daughters. They are nearly four times more likely to tell girls than boys to be more careful if undertaking the same activity again. The same study cited earlier research which found that parents of both genders used “directives” when teaching their 2- to 4-year-old sons how to climb down a playground pole but offered extensive “explanations” to daughters.
Why do we limit the emotional vocabulary of boys?

We tell ourselves we are preparing our sons to fight (literally and figuratively), to compete in a world and economy that’s brutish and callous. The sooner we can groom them for this dystopian future, the better off they’ll be. But the Harvard psychologist Susan David insists the opposite is true: “Research shows that people who suppress emotions have lower-level resilience and emotional health.”
And yes, I am perfectly aware that the point of that article is that this gender-differentiated approach to raising children damages boys -
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Globalti

Legendary Member
I remember when I lived in France, taking a woman I fancied for a day bouldering at Fontainebleau. She enjoyed the physical exercise and the new experience but said afterwards that at first she had felt inhibited about stretching out her arms and legs and holding poses that she thought "pas feminines" but soon forgot that and got into the swing of the scrambling route we followed, marked over the boulders.
 
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