Bus Lane Boris

[LLB]

Thinking that we all still live in the houses we grew up in was all it took really.

I think we are on a different wave length with this one. Did I say that ?

 

[LLB]

That's an interesting comment. What's the breakdown of their 'vulnerability'?

How many cyclists misjudge a turn out of Llangollen and headbutt a tree? Or regularly travel over 40mph?

I suggest that motorcycling vulnerability isn't comparable with cyclists, for reasons such as these. It's not simply a case of them being more vulnerable so let's get them out of the way of gridlocked traffic.

You would be the first one to bang on about the stereotyping of cyclists, so why do it to motorcyclists. I would say your post is fairly distasteful in the way you tar bikers in this manner.

There are plenty of cyclists who push it to the limit and beyond on here.
I visited someone from C+ a couple of years ago who had hit a deer at speed on a downhill trail and had spent a few weeks in the neurological unit in Frenchay. Accidents can and do happen to anyone.

 

[LLB]

We are going to be more vulnerable I would have thought.

Speaks for itself really.

Around 6,500 motorcyclists were killed or seriously injured in 2006; 599 killed and 5,901 injured. We are 51 times more likely to be KSI'd than car drivers per kilometre travelled, and twice as likely to be KSI'd as pedal cyclists.

http://www.realclassic.co.uk/newsfiles/news08010300.html

 

[MERV]

Why fang you.

 

[Tynan]

I scootered for a fair few years and used to post on biker forums

Main cause of a wreck on a motor bike is loosing it on a left hand turn, second is loosing it on a right hand turn, I think another vehicle doesn't appear until fourth accident

I'm willing to give this a go but I'm doubtful, most motorbikes are well ridden but there's lot of crazee scooters out there

is this in effect as of now?

good post about the Bristol thing spindrift, thanks

 

[LLB]

I scootered for a fair few years and used to post on biker forums

Main cause of a wreck on a motor bike is loosing it on a left hand turn, second is loosing it on a right hand turn, I think another vehicle doesn't appear until fourth accident

I'm willing to give this a go but I'm doubtful, most motorbikes are well ridden but there's lot of crazee scooters out there

is this in effect as of now?

good post about the Bristol thing spindrift, thanks

The problem with scoots is that lack of training gives rise to lack of discipline around others. Also there is the born again factor. Many return to m/cycling after a break, but have forgotten most of the skills which kept them alive as younger riders. I would favour short compulsory refresher courses if a break of 5 years off m/cycles is had.

We see this all the time in cycling also with RLJing, pavement riding etc etc

I would be happy to see some form of better compulsory training for both modes for both the sake of themselves and those around them.

 

[summerdays]

Are they allowed in all bus lanes in Bristol? or only the ones where its marked on the sign? I didn't realise it was different in Bristol to elsewhere in this respect.

I'm now trying to remember my experiences of them in bus lanes ... I would say I'm not overly worried by them, but perhaps more so than by a bus in the bus lane who tend to be politer than the taxi's. They irritate me more when motorbikes go in the ASL, and then position themselves incorrectly and assume I'm not going to set off at a reasonable speed when the lights change.

 

[zimzum42]

Those who are moaning about bikers in bus lanes seem to be the same lot that moan about all traffic that's not a bike.

grow up dammit, it's so selfish to put the needs of cyclists over all others every time. I ride bikes, but i don't expect everything to be done with me in mind. this move will make life so much better for bikers, and so much safer, so am happy to see this change

 

[LLB]

Yup. I said that I walked to school alone when I was seven. Then I said that I wouldn't let my boy walk to school alone at 7 because the roads are too dangerous.

Using your incredible logic you drew from this that I had double standards. Which means that you either had your Mr Thickie hat on last night, or you think that I still live in the same house and my kids go to the same school that I did.

Which is it?

Are you saying that if the logistical circumstances were the same for your kid now you would be happy for them to walk on their own at 7 years of age now ?

 

[LLB]

Calm down. It was a realistic assessment of the situation, and absolultely no generalisation of motorcyclists. It's necessary linf, and your feigning offense will only halter a decent discussion.

So, if you can get over that, perhaps you'd like to comment on the differences in the vulnerability of the two groups that we are discussing.


So, again, please consider the circumstances of motorcyclist death, and the differences between that and cyclists. Perhaps you should start with some thought about the different risks involved in the two different transport types.

No generalisation my arse, I am both a cyclist and motorcyclist. I see both sides of the argument as I live with the circumstances which govern both of them.

If I thought you could put your prejudices aside, I'd be happy too, alas I fear I would be wasting my time after what you posted in the previous thread. You are always right, and cannot back down!

Getting back to the subject about Boris and his changes. I was in London today (using mixed mode transport - Circle line was closed and the District line was utter chaos with every train like sardines) and I think he is far more suitable than Ken ever was. Ken showed his prejudice to the majority of people who had the power to keep him there, and that is why he was turfed out on his ear

A new broom sweeps clean as they say, and Boris has show determination to get the capital moving again. Ken just wanted to clog the public transport system with chavy kids and far from providing a better service, just added further burden to an existing one

 

[simon l& and a half]

This is a tad more complicated than the posts above would have you believe.

I don't find PTWs in bus lanes a problem - I think of them as my personal snowploughs, piling into cars turning across. The difficulty is that cyclists who are perhaps less experienced or less confident, or just slower don't like mixing it with PTWs, and it's these less durable souls that the future growth of cycling is going to rely on.

And then....we now have bus lanes that are brimful of slow moving bicycles. Tooley Street is an example. On Blackfriars Bridge, Kennington Road and Stockwell Road there are times when bicycles outnumber cars. I can see PTWs working in bus lanes from zone 3 and out, but I can equally see a lot of conflict in zone 1.

And finally - every cyclists organisation campaigned against this. They were completely disregarded. You can say that it puts the CTC, LCC and Sustrans in their place, but those who voted for Johnson because he is a cyclist (of sorts) might like to ponder this. Actually he doesn't give a stuff. He was elected by the 'burbs, and the cycling vote is in zones 1 and 2. It's pay day.

None of which is going to stop the outpouring of personal reminiscence from LLB who knows nothing of London and cares less. And, lest any of you need reminding, cycling in London has been increasing dramatically, while motorcycling in London is in decline. Johnson has decided to offer a sop to the past for no reason other than to prove that he's a groovy libertarian.

Apparently he cycles down Amwell Street on his way to the GLA building........

 

[Milo]

I know someone that nearly ran him over in a car (not on purpose apparently he was a rubbish cyclist).

 

[LLB]

This is a tad more complicated than the posts above would have you believe.

I don't find PTWs in bus lanes a problem - I think of them as my personal snowploughs, piling into cars turning across. The difficulty is that cyclists who are perhaps less experienced or less confident, or just slower don't like mixing it with PTWs, and it's these less durable souls that the future growth of cycling is going to rely on.

And then....we now have bus lanes that are brimful of slow moving bicycles. Tooley Street is an example. On Blackfriars Bridge, Kennington Road and Stockwell Road there are times when bicycles outnumber cars. I can see PTWs working in bus lanes from zone 3 and out, but I can equally see a lot of conflict in zone 1.

And finally - every cyclists organisation campaigned against this. They were completely disregarded. You can say that it puts the CTC, LCC and Sustrans in their place, but those who voted for Johnson because he is a cyclist (of sorts) might like to ponder this. Actually he doesn't give a stuff. He was elected by the 'burbs, and the cycling vote is in zones 1 and 2. It's pay day.

None of which is going to stop the outpouring of personal reminiscence from LLB who knows nothing of London and cares less. And, lest any of you need reminding, cycling in London has been increasing dramatically, while motorcycling in London is in decline. Johnson has decided to offer a sop to the past for no reason other than to prove that he's a groovy libertarian.

Apparently he cycles down Amwell Street on his way to the GLA building........

Which is more than Ken did

 

[Milo]

Why did we even need a London mayor?

 

[MERV]

Those who are moaning about bikers in bus lanes seem to be the same lot that moan about all traffic that's not a bike.

grow up dammit, it's so selfish to put the needs of cyclists over all others every time. I ride bikes, but i don't expect everything to be done with me in mind. this move will make life so much better for bikers, and so much safer, so am happy to see this change

Not particularly moaning.Im a bit nervous yes I already share my cycle lane with motorcyclists and I know how they can behave with no consideration sometimes.Generally I try and keep out of the way and let them pass.