Coronavirus outbreak

[Rusty Nails]

There are two other people there depending on current circumstances. The Medical Officer and the Chief Constable mostly but often some other expert. They all add their bit.
At least she is there as First Minister unlike other countries where the head is off on holiday or something and some incoherent junior is delegated to answer questions where he clearly does not know the answer.
While I am ambivalent about Ms Sturgeon in some respects at least she gets on with the job and I cannot understand this unreasoning hatred of her. Is it fear that she seems capable and comes across as a coherent and capable leader?

Does not Sturgeon have coherent, capable juniors (sometimes called ministers of that government). Smacks of not trusting those ministers or of wanting to make herself the story. I certainly don't hate her and think she is a very capable and competent leader, who is miles better than Johnson, but I always have the feeling that there is an underlying agenda other than managing the virus in her handling of the virus.

Mark Drakeford of the Senedd alternates briefings between him or the relevant minister whose department covers the main issues of the briefing, and whom he has confidence in. It is called delegation and definitely not all about him.

I believe Johnson was possibly on holiday at the time of one briefing, but it could be argued that that was no disadvantage as he is even more incoherent than his ministers.

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

I was going to visit Lorca in Spain today (primarily for the Star Trek connection). However, although they were almost untouched in the first wave, they've announced 1000 cases in the last fortnight - in a population of 60,000! Bit of a hotspot to be avoided I think.

 

[tom73]

Oh turns out government do have a plan after all

Speaking to MPs, Health Secretary Matt Hancock ruled out the idea of trying to eliminate the virus and keep new cases at zero.

He pointed out that this strategy had not worked for Scotland or New Zealand - both countries have seen a resurgence of the virus.

And he rejected the notion of letting coronavirus rip among young people while trying to protect the most vulnerable, arguing that the death toll would likely be “too high to bear”.

So it’s looks like it’s suppressing the virus until a vaccine. How depressing we aren’t even doing that well either.

Notice he glossed over NZ are now back in control and just removed the last reminding public control measure last week.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

Does not Sturgeon have coherent, capable juniors (sometimes called ministers of that government). Smacks of not trusting those ministers or of wanting to make herself the story. I certainly don't hate her and think she is a very capable and competent leader, who is miles better than Johnson, but I always have the feeling that there is an underlying agenda other than managing the virus in her handling of the virus.

Mark Drakeford of the Senedd alternates briefings between him or the relevant minister whose department covers the main issues of the briefing, and whom he has confidence in. It is called delegation and definitely not all about him.

I believe Johnson was possibly on holiday at the time of one briefing, but it could be argued that that was no disadvantage as he is even more incoherent than his ministers.

If I remember correctly, Sturgeon started off with the chief Scottish medical officer, who then seemed to get confused about which was her first and second home at weekends, and had to resign. Since then Sturgeon's pretty much been the continuity role, with occasional TV appearances from the med chief.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

So it’s looks like it’s suppressing the virus until a vaccine.

I think this is a perfectly reasonable strategy for a highly connected and densely populated country.

The problem is that we've never had it articulated clearly, and have not operationally delivered what is necessary to achieve it.

The *only* way this can be done without harsh and onerous social distancing measures is:

1. Get cases to a low level through social distancing.
2. Get a highly effective track and trace system in place.
3. Only relax measures very carefully once in control.
4. Act consistently and rapidly if things go in the wrong direction.

See: Germany, South Korea as examples.

We managed 1 very well, from an extremely high base (see failure to act fast enough initially)

We have inexcusably and abjectly failed on the rest, and that's why we're now imposing restrictions in a wide ranging way across swathes of the population.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

.. Matt Hancock ruled out the idea of trying to eliminate the virus and keep new cases at zero.

He pointed out that this strategy had not worked for Scotland or New Zealand - both countries have seen a resurgence of the virus.


Notice he glossed over NZ are now back in control and just removed the last reminding public control measure last week.

I saw that. He picked two countries where it hadn't worked and ignored countries where it had, neglected the fact that NZ had got back on top of "imported" covid cases and the fact that Scotland has an open border with the most shambolic covid-managing country outside of the Americas.

 

[tom73]

I think this is a perfectly reasonable strategy for a highly connected and densely populated country.

The problem is that we've never had it articulated clearly, and have not operationally delivered what is necessary to achieve it.

The *only* way this can be done without harsh and onerous social distancing measures is:

1. Get cases to a low level through social distancing.
2. Get a highly effective track and trace system in place.
3. Only relax measures very carefully once in control.
4. Act consistently and rapidly if things go in the wrong direction.

See: Germany, South Korea as examples.

We managed 1 very well, from an extremely high base (see failure to act fast enough initially)

We have inexcusably and abjectly failed on the rest, and that's why we're now imposing restrictions in a wide ranging way across swathes of the population.

It all depends what they accept as low number of cases. As you say it’s pie in sky at the moment. We can’t even get the basics right. We never really went for it 1st time round either. As well as number 1 we did ok with number 3 but then got carried away.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

It all depends what they accept as low number of cases. As you say it’s pie in sky at the moment. We can’t even get the basics right. We never really went for it 1st time round either. As well as number 1 we did ok with number 3 but then got carried away.

The problem is that the government has become fixated by the entirely false dichotomy of more restrictions = bigger hit to the economy. So the plonkers paid us to go out into overcrowded restaurants to catch covid. This is literally true.

The reality is that the worst hit of all to the economy is if the virus gets out of control. The only weapon, other than social distancing, that we have to stop this is test, track and trace.

If cases are rising despite that, then we have to rapidly impose restrictions. If we don't, then those restrictions will still come, but have to stay in place for longer. If we remove some restrictions (schools for example) then we either need to improve testing *or* impose more restrictions. We did the opposite, we moronically told people to stop skiving, save Pret and catch covid.

It's really, really simple.

But our government are weak, incompetent and most of all, in denial. They are utterly incapable of leading the country.

 

[oldwheels]

If I remember correctly, Sturgeon started off with the chief Scottish medical officer, who then seemed to get confused about which was her first and second home at weekends, and had to resign. Since then Sturgeon's pretty much been the continuity role, with occasional TV appearances from the med chief.

Funny how other scandals regarding second home visits have vanished with no resignations. I have never seen what you get in England but any I have seen here there are two others there also depending on what happens to be of primary importance at the time.
I see nothing wrong with the same person giving out actual figures and advice or new legislation. At least we know where we are with clear and unambiguous statements.

 

[matticus]

Leaving aside the tragedy that happened, is this allowed at the moment with social distancing and rule of six?

View attachment 549673

It happened, so it was clearly allowed to happen.

I don't know what the "tragedy" was, so I'll let you decide whether to report this, and to whom.

 

[midlife]

It happened, so it was clearly allowed to happen.

I don't know what the "tragedy" was, so I'll let you decide whether to report this, and to whom.

It was the Custody Sergeant that was shot and killed last week.

 

[tom73]

The problem is that the government has become fixated by the entirely false dichotomy of more restrictions = bigger hit to the economy. So the plonkers paid us to go out into overcrowded restaurants to catch covid. This is literally true.

The reality is that the worst hit of all to the economy is if the virus gets out of control. The only weapon, other than social distancing, that we have to stop this is test, track and trace.

If cases are rising despite that, then we have to rapidly impose restrictions. If we don't, then those restrictions will still come, but have to stay in place for longer. If we remove some restrictions (schools for example) then we either need to improve testing *or* impose more restrictions. We did the opposite, we moronically told people to stop skiving, save Pret and catch covid.

It's really, really simple.

But our government are weak, incompetent and most of all, in denial. They are utterly incapable of leading the country.

sadly they’ve been help along way by much of the public who believe just that same. It now looks like mp’s are going to the chance to Wade in and force though the dichotomy removing much of the measures which are trying to keep the wheels on.Sadly health has been neglected for years. The rate of neglect now how ever is mind blowing.

 

[matticus]

Ah right. (I used to live just down the road from there).

 

[roubaixtuesday]

sadly they’ve been help along way by much of the public who believe just that same

Intuitively it does make sense. Unfortunately it's wrong. That requires clear, consistent leadership (NZ, Germany) to break through.

 

[PK99]

I just read that the bars in the houses of parliament have been classed as workplace canteens and therefore don't have to shut at 10pm or follow stricter mask requirements and test and trace data-gathering procedures. One rule for the mobs, no rules for the nobs.

You posted that at 1543, press reports at 1200 were already reporting that that unforseen wrinkle in the regs had been voided by parliamentary authorities choosing to close bars at 10pm, though they will continue to serve food.