Moaning About Petrol Prices Again

[ufkacbln]

Every time he does, I suggest getting a more economical car, or at least driving more economically rather than thrashing it like he's at Brands Hatch.

People whinge about the price of petrol, but do nothing to actually use less of it.

There are various, differing estimates, but the consensus is that most drivers could make considerable savings by driving responsibly.

One article I read was a boy racer, with the classic rev, accelerate to maximum, brake at the last minute style of driving. By driving legally (at the speed limit) and predicting the road ahead (how unreasonable) so you drove smoothly could save uo to 20% of their fuel use!

By driving at a lower speed the reduction was something nearer 30%

Mot drivers can reduce the use by driving reasonably

 

[ufkacbln]

Comparatively fuel is cheap.

When expressed as a percentage of earnings, or compared with other costs such as public transport, food etc, fuel is the only only one that consistently lags behind in its rises and on occasion drops.

 

[Fab Foodie]

What load of crap, me me me!

I work for myself (through choice) and earn way less than the "average" UK wage. In my job I need a 4x4 and not a pansy push-button one, I need a proper do manly one. I can't afford a Landcruiser or Range Rover so use a Jeep Cherokee, 4.0L............... 15mpg, it's essential. However, I only do maybe 2k (max) miles a year, I cycle when the 4x4 is not absolutely neccessary.

I'd like to have a comparison of our "green" credentials. How many miles do you do per annum on your commute, who is the fuel glutton here?

Work from home, get a job nearer to home, buy an LML 170mpg scooter (like me) instead of using your car to the job that you HAVE to drive to, quit whinging.

Not really.
You and there may be many others (Cue Linfordlunchbox!) that actually need a 4x4 for whatever reason - you're the exceptions to the rule. However the vast majority of 4x4 and gas-guzzlers do not share that need and it's the majority that need to be targetted, unfortunately, a minority will always suffer. Only doing 2k means that you have ensured the total impact has been minimised.
But be smug that for the rest of your transport needs you've made excellent choices!
How's the LML shaping-up? I still hanker for one

Because of changes to my work location (for which I got a car allowance) we are now back to 2 cars, the C8 family wagon which is used as little as possible and the tiddly C1 we bought this time last year. The C1 is the car of choice 90% of time, it's cheaper to run, easier to get around (especially in town) and is a lot more sociable and fun. The C8 gets used for for work as required (cruising down the motorway to Bristol, H'row and B'ham airports) plus family days out and camping trips. On the work runs, I've found my driving style can deliver anywhere between 38 and 47 mpg, so as stated, a little care on the loud pedal can have a big effect.

The other thing is that modern small cars are really excellent everyday weapons of choice. The C1 is about the smallest, cheapest and most basic you can get, but it's supremely versatile. It seats 4 in comfort, has 4 doors, it costs bugger-all to buy, tax and insure, it's frugal to run. Whilst acceleration is genteel when loaded it' can do 80 mph happily and 70's a cinch, steep hills are a bit slow, but nowt wrong with relaxing once in a while! I've done many motorway runs to Portbury and back in it and wondered why so many need the latest Audi/BMW exec WankPanzers to achieve the same aim.
It does make you wonder how different it could all be ....

 

[Fab Foodie]

Comparatively fuel is cheap.

When the oil runs out, we all finally realise what a fabulous material it was and the best we did with most of it was burn it ....

 

[Amanda P]

Funny how people moan about the price of petrol, but do little about it. Why is that?

I can think of two good reasons. First, for many, their car is an important part of their self-image. Yes, I find that hard to believe too, but I've found it's true. Otherwise quite intelligent people agonize for months over exactly what car they should buy next not on the grounds of whether it's efficient, or can carry their kids, or whether it'll fit in the garage, but on the basis of what their colleagues, girlfriends, golf club buddies etc. will think of them when they arrive somewhere in it.

And conspicuous consumption of fuel is equated with status. So people charge around in ridiculous "lifestyle" 4WDs. (Odd that the same people will also moan down the pub about the price of fuel, but there you go. They probably also drove to the pub to do it...)

The other reason: you drive your car around six days a week (say) and it doesn't cost you a penny! It's only the one day a week when you take it to the petrol station that you have to hand over a wad of notes to fill the tank. This is irksome, but it probably doesn't cross your mind when you start the thing up to drive it 500 yards to buy a paper, or ferry the kids half a mile to school or whatever.

If cars had a coin slot on the dash like old-fashioned electricity meters, and you had to shell out real, physical money every time you drove it, it'd make people think a bit harder about whether it's really appropriate to use a car for each journey.

(Is it too late to patent this idea now?...)

 

[benb]

If cars had a coin slot on the dash like old-fashioned electricity meters, and you had to shell out real, physical money every time you drove it, it'd make people think a bit harder about whether it's really appropriate to use a car for each journey.

(Is it too late to patent this idea now?...)

That would be awesome!

 

[GrumpyGregry]

400 miles on a tank full.


http://www.hayes-dt....itary.htm#bike2

Do these ever find themselves on civvy street....?

 

[MarkF]

How's the LML shaping-up? I still hanker for one

My post was rude, (apologies to Petaud) but that sort of argument (tax big engines), winds me up, nothing matters apart from how much fuel you consume. Same sort of crap with 2 stroke engines, they are simple, effiecient and extremely economical and hardly get chance to pollute because they don't get stuck anywhere, they don't sit there idly, well.............idling.

The LML has served the purpose magnificently, if I was not so skint right now, then I'd upgrade to the new 200. Recommended!

Funny how people moan about the price of petrol, but do little about it. Why is that?

Bang on, heard it all before but they'll never give their cars up, they'd rather target the 4x4 owners or the pensioner who might have a Jag for the weekly shopping trip, whilst all the while, hurtling round the UK, guzzling fuel.

 

[sunnyjim]

I sort of agree, but I think that if the objective is to change behaviour (rather than just to save money) then penalising country dwellers when they often have no viable alternative to the car is probably not such a great idea.

I'd rather see some element of congestion-based road pricing which would usually weigh heavier on urban journeys where alternatives (public transport, cycling, walking) are more readily available. But TBH I suspect you could get the same effect by taxing parking according to the value of the land it's built on

Why do 'country dwellers' need to drive so much ?

Because all the shops & work are in the towns.

Because petrol's so cheap, there's no incentive to live near work or build shops & factories near where people choose to live.

Because private vehicle fuel's so cheap, local busses aren't profitable.

More expensive fuel might be just what's needed to bring small towns and villages back to life, improve public transport, and even out house prices.

 

[Ste T.]

On my commute each morning I am passed by cars accelerating hard to the tail end of a traffic queue then braking hard. I cycle past them for a while, then the lights change and this all happens again, over and over for mile after mile.
Add this style of driving to the fact that there is no end of 4x4s and large people carriers to be seen doing 70 - 80 on our motorways, using a third more fuel than they would at 55mph, makes me think we have a way to go yet until prices are really hurting the majority of people.

 

[Fab Foodie]

My post was rude, (apologies to Petaud) but that sort of argument (tax big engines), winds me up, nothing matters apart from how much fuel you consume. Same sort of crap with 2 stroke engines, they are simple, effiecient and extremely economical and hardly get chance to pollute because they don't get stuck anywhere, they don't sit there idly, well.............idling.

The LML has served the purpose magnificently, if I was not so skint right now, then I'd upgrade to the new 200. Recommended!



Bang on, heard it all before but they'll never give their cars up, they'd rather target the 4x4 owners or the pensioner who might have a Jag for the weekly shopping trip, whilst all the while, hurtling round the UK, guzzling fuel.

If all that mattered was 'how much fuel you consume' than racking-up the price of gas seems the fairest policy, more consumption, more paying.
But it's not that simple, that's why a range of measures are required. Big vehicles require more resources to build and maintain, gas-guzzlers sitting in town traffic polute far more than efficient tiddlers's for the same journey, Gas guzzlers/large vehicles add more to congestion than small cars.
Ask yourself whether you'd rather scoot/cycle around amongst streets of Brutalist Range-Rovers or C1s and Pandas?

To me it's a no-brainer, it'll have to happen eventually, why not now? Mostly as Uncle-Phil said, it's a mental/status thing for most people more than anything else.

I actually think 4x4s should be means tested, you have to proove you need one.

 

[cd365]

Why do 'country dwellers' need to drive so much ?

Because all the shops & work are in the towns.

Because petrol's so cheap, there's no incentive to live near work or build shops & factories near where people choose to live.

Because private vehicle fuel's so cheap, local busses aren't profitable.

More expensive fuel might be just what's needed to bring small towns and villages back to life, improve public transport, and even out house prices.

I suppose only on a cycling forum do you get people saying petrol is not cheap, it's not, it has gone up massively over the last few years especially and is impacting on millions of people. Big petrol companies and the government are the only people gaining, everyone else is losing out including cyclists.

PetroChemical companies have spent years buying up patents which could have changed our usage on oil, this is scandalous.

The government said they were putting taxes up on petrol/diesel for green issues, rubbish it was just more taxation to give to people who won't work. If they had did it and put the money into education/job creation then I could have understood that. Cut back on tax and cut back on what we give to the scroungers (I don't mean the genuine ones who need help).

When petrol hit 80p a litre a few years ago I got rid of my 2.3L turbo-charged mercedes and bought a 1.5L diesel, best decision I ever made. Luckily I was in a position where I could afford to do that, some people with older gas guzzlers that they have had for a few years cannot afford to change car and are not in a position to be without a car.

I have been unable to get a job in my home town for over 20 years so I have to commute, my wife works for a company who moves her around so she has to commute. She has been moved to the same town as me so we car share. If she moves again and petrol keeps going up I could cycle, due to a medical condition my wife couldn't, not everyone is in a position to cycle, some cyclists seem to forget that!

 

[marinyork]

I actually think 4x4s should be means tested, you have to proove you need one.

Alternatively 4x4s could have required a difference licence. There's no reason why we shouldn't tinker with current classifications.

 

[cd365]

I actually think 4x4s should be means tested, you have to proove you need one.

100% agree with this, I call them kiddie killers

 

[Fab Foodie]

Alternatively 4x4s could have required a difference licence. There's no reason why we shouldn't tinker with current classifications.

That's a reasonable option too. We need more barriers to unneccessary vehicle ownership.