BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
Hairy Jock said:
Is that not what I was saying?
Ridden into by another cyclist
- Thread starter cupoftea
- Start date
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Is that not what I was saying?
BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
Ludwig said:
With the exception of a smoother ride, everything else you wrote is this: WRONG.
BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
Tynan said:
True. I wrote about this bit earlier, when I posted that the heavier thing also generates more friction, so all else being the same you can rule weight out completely. (might have been on bikeradar though)
Bent
The reason I mention weight is that together with compound it’s a factor with key in.
I wasn’t talking about knobblies
Why do F1 cars have large tires, and wing’s? Increased contact patch and greater “weight” / down force allow the car to turn and break faster.
Bikes with skinny tyres will not stop as quickly as a bike with fat tyres as the point at which skidding occurs will happen sooner.
If you want more info as the maths are really complicted and unfortuntaly most A level physis students would'nt be able to work it out.
http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/physics_racing/
The reason I mention weight is that together with compound it’s a factor with key in.
I wasn’t talking about knobblies
Why do F1 cars have large tires, and wing’s? Increased contact patch and greater “weight” / down force allow the car to turn and break faster.
Bikes with skinny tyres will not stop as quickly as a bike with fat tyres as the point at which skidding occurs will happen sooner.
If you want more info as the maths are really complicted and unfortuntaly most A level physis students would'nt be able to work it out.
http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/physics_racing/
BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
Bikes with fat knobbly tyres won't be able to stop as quick as bikes with skinny slick tyres either.
All else being the same, weight is not a factor in stopping distance. Aerodynamic downforce as found in racing cars gives increased R (which equates to more friction), but not increased weight, which is why it does have an effect on stopping and cornering.
All else being the same, weight is not a factor in stopping distance. Aerodynamic downforce as found in racing cars gives increased R (which equates to more friction), but not increased weight, which is why it does have an effect on stopping and cornering.
weight combined with velocity makes momentum, that's what needs to be stopped
any additional friction due to the weight is unrelated and isn;t going to balanced the additional momentum, the same bike with a fat bloke plus heavy panniers takes longer to stop
ever tried to brake in the car when it's full up with people and luggage, the additional 'friction' isn't going to help you there
as for stopping distance, that doesn't really happen in the London traffic
any additional friction due to the weight is unrelated and isn;t going to balanced the additional momentum, the same bike with a fat bloke plus heavy panniers takes longer to stop
ever tried to brake in the car when it's full up with people and luggage, the additional 'friction' isn't going to help you there
as for stopping distance, that doesn't really happen in the London traffic
Bent
I afraid weight is a factor with braking.
See if I can put this simply, , ,
If a bike had no weight at all what would happen?
It would never stop, as it wouldn’t generate any friction. You need a "certain" amount of weight to get the correct level of key in and generate friction. This needs to counter the force of momentum that’s being applied.
Most people will discount the key in, as it’s very difficult to calculate, I suppose it’s easier to think of tyre compounds and running soft slicks and how they key in and stick.
If you want to talk about MTB tyres I’m afraid that most normal MTB tyres will still out brake a road bike slick.
Put another way, why put slick tyres onto a bike? The rolling resistance of the MTB is greater; the force that required to rotate it is “related” to amount of breaking it can exert, even if you take out rotational mass.
Don’t forget that an MTB tyres deforms as it’s ridden so that it doesn’t ride on the knobbly bits. This allows the tyre to still present a large contact patch. Some people would also argue that as the road is not flat, and as the MTB deforms it will key into the road even further, than road tyre that is running at 110 psi which will key in less, and have a great rate of “bounce”
I afraid weight is a factor with braking.
See if I can put this simply, , ,
If a bike had no weight at all what would happen?
It would never stop, as it wouldn’t generate any friction. You need a "certain" amount of weight to get the correct level of key in and generate friction. This needs to counter the force of momentum that’s being applied.
Most people will discount the key in, as it’s very difficult to calculate, I suppose it’s easier to think of tyre compounds and running soft slicks and how they key in and stick.
If you want to talk about MTB tyres I’m afraid that most normal MTB tyres will still out brake a road bike slick.
Put another way, why put slick tyres onto a bike? The rolling resistance of the MTB is greater; the force that required to rotate it is “related” to amount of breaking it can exert, even if you take out rotational mass.
Don’t forget that an MTB tyres deforms as it’s ridden so that it doesn’t ride on the knobbly bits. This allows the tyre to still present a large contact patch. Some people would also argue that as the road is not flat, and as the MTB deforms it will key into the road even further, than road tyre that is running at 110 psi which will key in less, and have a great rate of “bounce”
Tyran
This is where is gets complicated
As the weight goes up and the amount of friction the tyres can now produce is not increasing as fast, the payoff is diminishing in relationship to the force of momentum.
There is a point of diminishing returns
The size of a bike tyre is a trade off between a number of factors;
On an MTB braking and traction has a greater level of importance than rolling resistance. On a road bike reducing rolling resistance is the major concern.
This is where is gets complicated
As the weight goes up and the amount of friction the tyres can now produce is not increasing as fast, the payoff is diminishing in relationship to the force of momentum.
There is a point of diminishing returns
The size of a bike tyre is a trade off between a number of factors;
On an MTB braking and traction has a greater level of importance than rolling resistance. On a road bike reducing rolling resistance is the major concern.
cupoftea said:
I'm glad you said that
I've got a decent 2:1 B.Eng, 'Integrated Engineering with Automotive Studies', so I've been into this area several times before, but 1/3 into post #41 all I was seeing was 'blah, blah, blah'
The main thing and possibly biggest variable is knowing the limitations of your own bike (and yourself)
bazzadigz C+
Senior Member
well im going to throw a spanner in the works and say that my hub brakes are better [
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