RLJ or no RLJ ???

[jig-sore]

serious question on RLJing. i recently tweaked my commute home to avoid rugby station but now i have this dilemma to contend with...

look at the image below, I'm following the route in blue, making a left turn.
when the lights are on red the cars in my lane are stopped and the oncoming cars are stopped.
the cars emerging from the road i want to turn into can only follow the yellow routes. this leaves me a nice safe space to come down the very short cycle lane and make my left turn BUT i have to RLJ to do it.

or do i wait for the green light had have two streams of traffic to deal with, both trying to get in my way. far more dangerous.

so i want to know what you would do in this situation, be honest

photo without my doodles, red arrow shows direction of hill, putting ASL at the bottom...

 

[gaz]

red for stop
green for go

 

[hackbike 666]

+1 billion.

 

[GrasB]

Why do you need to contend with 2 streams of traffic? The oncoming traffic gives way to the traffic stream you're in & if you're flowing with the traffic after it's has been stopped by the red light your left turn should be easy to get into.

 

[dudi]

Just go on green, when it's safe to do so. The same as you would if you were driving.
Your time is no more prescious when you're on your bike than it is when you are driving.

 

[jig-sore]

OK, true, i only have to contend with only one of two streams of traffic, BUT if i go on red i have a clear safe space to myself

also the road has a slight rise so if i stop i have to start off and clip in up hill as well.

the point is, in America in this situation the cars in my lane would be allowed to jump the light with caution if safe to do so. (correct me if I'm wrong, it's been ten years since i was in Florida)

I'm not going one way or the other on this at the moment but the question has to be WHY am i waiting JUST for the green light when it's SAFE for me to go.

legally its wrong to go but in "this situation" there is no "logical" or "safety" reason not to ????

just wanted to ask the question and see what people thought

 

[jig-sore]

if the road was wide enough at this point, would there not be a second lane for cars to turn left in this exact situation ???

 

[hackbike 666]

That looks worse than Bank Junction or Vauxhall Cross I must admit.

 

[Dan B]

Why do you need to contend with 2 streams of traffic? The oncoming traffic gives way to the traffic stream you're in & if you're flowing with the traffic after it's has been stopped by the red light your left turn should be easy to get into.

Important bit emboldened.

 

[Arch]

OK, true, i only have to contend with only one of two streams of traffic, BUT if o go on red i have a clear safe space to myself

also the road has a slight rise so if i stop i have to start off and clip in up hill as well.

the point is, in America in this situation the cars in my lane would be allowed to jump the light with caution if safe to do so. (correct me if I'm wrong, it's been ten years since i was in Florida)

I'm not going one way or the other on this at the moment but the question has to be WHY am i waiting JUST for the green light when it's SAFE for me to go.

legally its wrong to go but in "this situation" there is no "logical" or "safety" reason not to ????

just wanted to ask the question and see what people thought

I suspect a driver wouldn't get away with that reasoning, and neither should a cyclist...

Just wait. I would. If you're troubled by a simple left turn with traffic, you need some road training (I know you're not, I mean 'you' to mean 'someone').

BTW, the 'safety' reason for not going might be that a pedestrian trying to cross uses the traffic light phase as a cue to cross, and then you pile round the corner into them.

The American system you describe does work (they have it in some continental countries too), but that makes no difference to UK law. Campaign for it, by all means, but meanwhile, wait your turn.

 

[jig-sore]

so at the moment I'm having to indicate left with my arm, so I'm riding one handed,whilst starting off up hill and having to clip in whilst turning 90 degrees to the left and avoiding any possible traffic that may or may not be coming at me.

you have to sit there and think "why don't i just keep going ???" no ??

i know is logic against the law, and i know how people feel on here about RLJ but there must be hundreds of similar junctions across the country just like this one where you have to ask.... WHY ??

 

[gaz]

Indicate just before the light turns amber... then you don't have to start cycling one handed.

 

[GrasB]

So you're stationary, in this situation I'd be 1 or 2 cars back from the front probably in primary if not in a strong secondary. If you're stationary you should be able to tell when the lights are going to change, signal for a second or so then with both hands on the handle bars pull away & turn left. If clipping in is a problem don't even attempt to clip in an just pedal round the corner then worry about clipping in.

 

[brokenbetty]

i know is logic against the law, and i know how people feel on here about RLJ but there must be hundreds of similar junctions across the country just like this one where you have to ask.... WHY ??

Predictability. That's why we obey the road laws even in situations where we don't see any immediate need to. Every road user has to make some assumptions about what others will do, and the more predictable we can make the roads the safer we all are.

There's a lot of complaints about drivers, but most of them are pretty good and we rely a hell of a lot on them sticking to the rules. If it ever becomes a real free-for-all out there cyclists will suffer the worst.

More than anyone we have a vested interest in good road discipline and we shouldn't forget that.

 

[jig-sore]

BTW, the 'safety' reason for not going might be that a pedestrian trying to cross uses the traffic light phase as a cue to cross, and then you pile round the corner into them.

.

actually this is a very good point. i think there may actually be a crossing on the corner and phasing in the lights that allows peds to cross, i will have to look again, only been going this way for a week.

but even if this is so, then at the point when the traffic is moving then that would indicate that the peds should not be.

I'm also glad that you realise I'm just asking this in a hypothetical sense, yes i know what the answer is and should be but the point is, surely this indicates how the road system has be set up with just the car in mind.
a cycle path and advanced stop line thing has been added as an after thought but ideally there would have been a "left turn green light for cyclist only" added. OK these don't exist but if it was there the action I'm describing would be no more or less safe to do only legally correct.

i don't condone people riding across a crossing when people are in the way, or people crossing red lights simply to get away before the traffic but in situations like this you can see how temping it would be for some people to red light jump and all these moments add to the growing argument against cyclists.

is red light jumping "really" as clean cut as "red stop, green go" ??

and of course the other option...

do i jump up on the path to get round the corner ???