Saddle Height.

[SkipdiverJohn]

I have never been remotely interested in road bikes, preferring to look around and stop when I want as opposed to staring at an inch of tyre with my back doubled over.
Perhaps this is why I have never been uncomfortable enough to even entertain the idea of a bike fit?

The stupidly low back-breaking riding position fashion on road bikes seems a fairly recent thing outside of racing. When I was a youngster back in the 1980's I had a drop-bar bike (albeit a steel one, and fairly heavy at that) and I never experienced any significant discomfort. Why would this be? The reason, I suspect, is that I set the bars at a sensible height; i.e. only marginally lower than the saddle, rather than the current practice of setting them as low as the headset will physically allow. It doesn't surprise me in the slightest that a lot of cyclists who ride around hunched over the bars as low as they can get with their spines forced into an unnaturally curved position for extended periods, experience all sorts of cycling-related discomfort.

 

[davidphilips]

Is it that stupidly low back-breaking riding position fashion on road bikes seems a fairly recent thing that changes the cycling style, or is it that cyclists with drop bars from a few years ago cycled on the drops most of the time and on more up to date bikes are used on the hoods but some what near the same set up?
Only reason i ask is i have a few old and modern bikes and on the older bikes it seems more natural to be on the drops, no bar tape on the bar tops or rubber on the hoods? Whereas on a more modern bike i tend to cycle on the hoods most of the time?

 

[Heltor Chasca]

Reading Simon Doughty’s book ‘The Long Distance Cyclists’ Handbook’ and playing around on my bike trainer are the two most influential resources I have used to get my saddle position into the correct position. Among other things important to the ride comfort.

I mentioned this upthread, but just wanted to say it again to clarify why: In 2014 I bought a touring bike which I wanted to fit like a glove and as such went to a retailer in Bath that offered a ‘free’ bike fit as part of the deal and was plonked on a jig in their show room. Put it this way: I was very lucky that I even ended up with the correct bike size. Almost everything else was wrong. Saddle, stem, bars, lever position etc etc. But when you believe you are being dealt with by a pro, you believe it. It took 3 weeks for the gloss of a posh bike shop with a fitting service to wear off and for me to realise what a pigs ear they had made of the fit. I have changed almost everything on the bike to get it to fit. I have never been back to give them any further business.

That was my first ever bike fit and a hugely disappointing experience which has tainted my view of fittings. I guess I am still annoyed, but not to the point where I wouldn’t consider a decent fit. It isn’t a closed chapter and I’m not a cut and dried anti fit person.

 

[Slick]

Is it that stupidly low back-breaking riding position fashion on road bikes seems a fairly recent thing that changes the cycling style, or is it that cyclists with drop bars from a few years ago cycled on the drops most of the time and on more up to date bikes are used on the hoods but some what near the same set up?
Only reason i ask is i have a few old and modern bikes and on the older bikes it seems more natural to be on the drops, no bar tape on the bar tops or rubber on the hoods? Whereas on a more modern bike i tend to cycle on the hoods most of the time?

I'm not sure if that's correct. For what it's worth, I feel it's more to do with exact fit, as I have two modern road bikes one slightly more stretched than the other so one I only go on the drops when I'm up to speed and settling in to a rhythm. The other bike feels a bit squashed, so much so at very low speed I can catch my foot when turning full lock but it is very comfortable on the drops whatever the circumstances.

 

[Slick]

Reading Simon Doughty’s book ‘The Long Distance Cyclists’ Handbook’ and playing around on my bike trainer are the two most influential resources I have used to get my saddle position into the correct position. Among other things important to the ride comfort.

I mentioned this upthread, but just wanted to say it again to clarify why: In 2014 I bought a touring bike which I wanted to fit like a glove and as such went to a retailer in Bath that offered a ‘free’ bike fit as part of the deal and was plonked on a jig in their show room. Put it this way: I was very lucky that I even ended up with the correct bike size. Almost everything else was wrong. Saddle, stem, bars, levers etc etc. But when you believe to are being dealt with by a pro, you believe it. It took 3 weeks for the gloss of a posh bike shop with a fitting service to wear off and for me to realise what a pigs ear they had made of the fit. I have changed almost everything on the bike to get it to fit. I have never been back to give them any further business.

That was my first ever bike fit and a hugely disappointing experience which has tainted my view of fittings. I guess I am still annoyed, but not to the point where I wouldn’t consider a decent fit. It isn’t a closed chapter and I’m not a cut and dried anti fit person.

Good and bad in every walk of life but keeping an open mind like you obviously have is the secret to success in most walks of life I find.

 

[vickster]

The stupidly low back-breaking riding position fashion on road bikes seems a fairly recent thing outside of racing. When I was a youngster back in the 1980's I had a drop-bar bike (albeit a steel one, and fairly heavy at that) and I never experienced any significant discomfort. Why would this be? The reason, I suspect, is that I set the bars at a sensible height; i.e. only marginally lower than the saddle, rather than the current practice of setting them as low as the headset will physically allow. It doesn't surprise me in the slightest that a lot of cyclists who ride around hunched over the bars as low as they can get with their spines forced into an unnaturally curved position for extended periods, experience all sorts of cycling-related discomfort.

I thought you were in your 70s or older from the way you talk!!

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

r is it that cyclists with drop bars from a few years ago cycled on the drops most of the time and on more up to date bikes are used on the hoods but some what near the same set up?

My drop bars had tape all the way up and the Weinmann brakes had extension levers so you could brake from the top of the bars with no need to change hand position. I used to ride on the bar tops for at least 90% of my total mileage. The only time I used the drops was if I was riding into a headwind and wanted to reduce my frontal area. All other times I sat up and took in the view. I just think many cyclists today have become really obsessed about going fast to the exclusion of everything else.
The way I look at it is I typically walk at between 3.5 and 4 mph. If I can do a journey on a bike at 15 mph, it's still 4 times faster than walking. i just don't see the benefit in breaking my back just to achieve an extra 3 or 4 mph.

 

[vickster]

15mph is fast for pootle cycling

 

[bpsmith]

A lot of people complain about bike fits not feeling right instantly. The thing is, any change of the bike will feel different to most people and will take time for your body to adjust. If the fit was way out to start with, and you’re asking a fitter to set your bike how it should be for your chosen ride style, then it’s only natural for it to feel alien for a while.

I completely agree that there are bad fitters out there, although I wonder whether some people would have a different opinion if they stuck with it for long enough for the adjustment phase to pass?

My guess is that some of the poorer experiences may be where there was a bigger change in how the bike is fitted. I also wonder whether many of the unhappy people go back to the fitter and discuss the fit further?

 

[Heltor Chasca]

Is it that stupidly low back-breaking riding position fashion on road bikes seems a fairly recent thing that changes the cycling style, or is it that cyclists with drop bars from a few years ago cycled on the drops most of the time and on more up to date bikes are used on the hoods but some what near the same set up?
Only reason i ask is i have a few old and modern bikes and on the older bikes it seems more natural to be on the drops, no bar tape on the bar tops or rubber on the hoods? Whereas on a more modern bike i tend to cycle on the hoods most of the time?

This is interesting. For the last 6 weeks I have been using a training app called TrainerRoad which was recommended to me on here. In summary it puts you on a programme of ‘tailored’ sessions and intervals. It is brilliant. And while you are doing your session, coaching prompts appear on screen. These get you to hone your breathing, pelvis position, power techniques etc. But one thing it does bang on about is improving your aero position. It encourages you to get yourself used to riding more on the drops and taking advantage of a smaller aero profile and the free efficiency. It makes sense to me and I am beginning to ride more on the drops which on my Audax bike is quite comfortable maybe due to the compact bars or the fact I have a strong upper body.

But on the rides I do, virtually everybody is on the hoods. The last Audax I did, another rider actually passed comment on me being in the drops. Am I missing something or is it just fashion? Surely an American training programme wouldn’t offer vastly different advice on technique just on what’s trending at a point in time.

 

[SuperHans123]

All the bike fit people on this thread refer to drop bar bikes.
Maybe that is the issue, that these bikes just don't naturally 'fit' people because of the unnatural handlebar shape?
Just a thought from a hybrid riding snert!

 

[Slick]

All the bike fit people on this thread refer to drop bar bikes.
Maybe that is the issue, that these bikes just don't naturally 'fit' people because of the unnatural handlebar shape?
Just a thought from a hybrid riding snert!

I suppose it depends on how you determine unnatural. It feels natural to me.

 

[SuperHans123]

But on the rides I do, virtually everybody is on the hoods. The last Audax I did, another rider actually passed comment on me being in the drops. Am I missing something or is it just fashion? Surely an American training programme wouldn’t offer vastly different advice on technique just on what’s trending at a point in time.

Perhaps people ride on the hoods because it is comfier?
And if they spend most of their time there, why not get a hybrid?

 

[SuperHans123]

I suppose it depends on how you determine unnatural. It feels natural to me.

What, bent over double?

 

[bpsmith]

My drop bars had tape all the way up and the Weinmann brakes had extension levers so you could brake from the top of the bars with no need to change hand position. I used to ride on the bar tops for at least 90% of my total mileage. The only time I used the drops was if I was riding into a headwind and wanted to reduce my frontal area. All other times I sat up and took in the view. I just think many cyclists today have become really obsessed about going fast to the exclusion of everything else.
The way I look at it is I typically walk at between 3.5 and 4 mph. If I can do a journey on a bike at 15 mph, it's still 4 times faster than walking. i just don't see the benefit in breaking my back just to achieve an extra 3 or 4 mph.

If your bike is set up for your riding style, then you won’t be “breaking your back”. You might have the bars very low, if you want to do shorter fast riding, but higher if you want to do longer more relaxing rides. You would also have the geometry of the bike chosen for the style required. You can’t expect max speed and max comfort. Perhaps you could have some of your multiple bikes set up in different ways to suit different rides maybe?