Titanium Itch

[SkipdiverJohn]

Gravel is a fly in the ointment here. Initially I didn’t want it because I don’t ride on gravel. But it feels as though the marketing boffins have set out to convince the world that they need a gravel bike, and subsequently they are everywhere... and are the latest models with the latest tech. Maybe it’s just me, but looking at standard audax/tourer type models which are now a couple of years old makes it feel like I’m shopping for an iPhone 4.

I guess I’m just looking at the Etape and thinking that this is a frame that has remained virtually unchanged for ten years. Is the gravel or adventure frame a development that I should be buying into. If I go for an Etape, is it equivalent to buying a Walkman just as the discman arrived on the scene. Or is it a minidisc?!

I suppose I’m trying to future proof, and avoid buying something that might not exist in a couple of years, because the gravel bike does everything the tourer did and more. The traditional ‘do everything’ bike superseded by a new type of ‘do everything‘ bike.

All you are doing is allowing the marketers to con you into believing that change automatically equates to progress and therefore whatever is the latest cycling fad must be better in some way than everything that preceded it. A very small proportion of change gives real world improvements, but 99% of it is just cycling industry BS designed to get you to keep replacing perfectly good bikes with new bikes that are just different to, but no better than, what you already have. Until recently, I was still using an iPhone 4, and it was just as capable of doing calls, texts and emails on than my current one. If I was buying one for myself and it wasn't work issue, I would still have one as I see no benefit to the latest models that are twice the size and several times the price!

I find the obsession with having latest spec especially odd in the case of something like a Titanium bike, because you are presumably going to keep it for a long time given the expense. Therefore, regardless of what spec you get when you buy, it will be "out of date" in a couple of years anyway, because the industry keeps changing things to try to drive upgrade sales. Unless you are prepared to stump up for a new one every couple of years, even at Titanium prices, you are going to fight a losing battle. You might as well settle on a useful, long-term, spec at the outset, irrespective of whether it is the latest hyped up fad or not. The reason some frames go for years without endless geometry changes is because they got the geometry right in the first place, so it doesn't need to be changed. Any bike that gets revised geometry every year or two must have had crap geometry to begin with, and the customers who bought them paid for the privilege of being used as the test guinea pigs.

 

[MrGrumpy]

your completely missing the point here @lejogger you can have more than one bike . New developments are good it gives more choice, just do your homework ! General bike design is unchanged, just materials have. However if this is an interest and for some it is , spend your money on what you want. Cyclists are generally tight bar.....ds on the whole and most will be quite happy with their original butcher boy 3 speed sturmey archer bike from 1940 . The rest of us......... , well your a long time dead so why not enjoy it whilst your here !

 

[glasgowjim]

Yes Ribble has been looked at, as has the Dolan, Kinesis, Genesis, J Laverack, Reilly etc.

Tricky to know where to start.

Avoid, crap frame warranty and even worse customer service-See here
https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/kinesis-uk-avoid-second-bike-cracked-poor-customer-service.262578/

 

[jamin100]

I’m literally doing this now

had a carbon road bike but fell in love with the Laverack r.jack a few years back. I can’t justify spending up to £5k on a top spec di2 bike, especially as I already had rim brake eTap on my current one. So whilst I would have liked disc brakes, from a financial point, I would have had to go back to Shimano 105. Whilst there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with mechanical shifting, I just really like my eTap. So have stuck with Rim Brakes.

But after waiting for a bit, I found a second hand r.jack Laverack frame at a bargain price and am currently waiting for some parts to build it up.
I'm moving most of my parts over from my carbon bike to try and keep costs down, but all in i think it will have cost me around £1500 to "upgrade"

Ignore the tan sidewalls, red saddle and extra cable outer heading towards the rear brake, they’re coming off..

I would say though I’m not looking for gravel in anyway shape or form. Purely road for this build

I've never ridden Ti, only Carbon and Aluminium so i'm both nervous and excited to see how it rides and compares to my carbon road bike.

 

[tom73]

That's a bike looking bike for sure.
I'd forgotten about Laverack till this thread. I've seen them before and at the time thought they had something.
Now I'm really getting to like the look of Laverack i'd need some really heavy duty brownie point's.
I've no special birthday coming but next year is our 20th wedding anniversary so ....
They are now bookmarked so you never know

 

[Mark pallister]

Have a look at Reilly bikes
I know a few people with them and full of praise

 

[lejogger]

All you are doing is allowing the marketers to con you into believing that change automatically equates to progress and therefore whatever is the latest cycling fad must be better in some way than everything that preceded it. A very small proportion of change gives real world improvements, but 99% of it is just cycling industry BS designed to get you to keep replacing perfectly good bikes with new bikes that are just different to, but no better than, what you already have. Until recently, I was still using an iPhone 4, and it was just as capable of doing calls, texts and emails on than my current one. If I was buying one for myself and it wasn't work issue, I would still have one as I see no benefit to the latest models that are twice the size and several times the price!

I find the obsession with having latest spec especially odd in the case of something like a Titanium bike, because you are presumably going to keep it for a long time given the expense. Therefore, regardless of what spec you get when you buy, it will be "out of date" in a couple of years anyway, because the industry keeps changing things to try to drive upgrade sales. Unless you are prepared to stump up for a new one every couple of years, even at Titanium prices, you are going to fight a losing battle. You might as well settle on a useful, long-term, spec at the outset, irrespective of whether it is the latest hyped up fad or not. The reason some frames go for years without endless geometry changes is because they got the geometry right in the first place, so it doesn't need to be changed. Any bike that gets revised geometry every year or two must have had crap geometry to begin with, and the customers who bought them paid for the privilege of being used as the test guinea pigs.

I do have a rather large, modern iphone... a marketers dream!

Seriously though, I’m just exploring every avenue, and ensuring my final choice is thoroughly researched. I’ve suffered buyer’s remorse too many times to rush into this decision.

You talk a lot of sense. Choosing titanium because it will last a lifetime and then choosing a non-traditional geometry because it’s the latest fad makes zero sense.
Ive mentioned ’gravel’ primarily because I want it to be ruled out, rather than ruled in. You’ve very much helped in that regard, especially given that there have been no audible supporters of it so far.

 

[lejogger]

I’m literally doing this now

had a carbon road bike but fell in love with the Laverack r.jack a few years back. I can’t justify spending up to £5k on a top spec di2 bike, especially as I already had rim brake eTap on my current one. So whilst I would have liked disc brakes, from a financial point, I would have had to go back to Shimano 105. Whilst there is absolutely NOTHING wrong with mechanical shifting, I just really like my eTap. So have stuck with Rim Brakes.

But after waiting for a bit, I found a second hand r.jack Laverack frame at a bargain price and am currently waiting for some parts to build it up.
I'm moving most of my parts over from my carbon bike to try and keep costs down, but all in i think it will have cost me around £1500 to "upgrade"

Ignore the tan sidewalls, red saddle and extra cable outer heading towards the rear brake, they’re coming off..

I would say though I’m not looking for gravel in anyway shape or form. Purely road for this build

I've never ridden Ti, only Carbon and Aluminium so i'm both nervous and excited to see how it rides and compares to my carbon road bike.

View attachment 530103

Keep us posted. Looks lovely, and I’m not completely against a tan sidewall!!

 

[lejogger]

Have a look at Reilly bikes
I know a few people with them and full of praise

Yes, they look nice - but I can’t see a road geometry with rack mounts I don’t think.

 

[vickster]

Yes, they look nice - but I can’t see a road geometry with rack mounts I don’t think.

They’ll custom make for you. They can certainly add rack mounts

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Ive mentioned ’gravel’ primarily because I want it to be ruled out, rather than ruled in. You’ve very much helped in that regard, especially given that there have been no audible supporters of it so far.

Replace the word gravel with tourer and see if that works better. Would you like to go touring and if so, which sort? Having clearances for wider tyres and touring geometry and fittings isn’t necessary a handicap unless your going to try and win races on it.

 

[Brads]

What is it with you people.?
I spent all night last night looking at Ti bike builds for my next "two sets of wheels, road / gravelly thing" and then I come on here to even more encouragement to splash the cash.
Ridiculous.

 

[kingrollo]

40 years old ? - there's still time for a Pinarello with 60mm deep section wheels !

 

[SkipdiverJohn]

there's still time for a Pinarello with 60mm deep section wheels

Expect to see an increase of these on the secondhand market later in the year as financially distressed dentists seek to raise cash......

 

[classic33]

All you are doing is allowing the marketers to con you into believing that change automatically equates to progress and therefore whatever is the latest cycling fad must be better in some way than everything that preceded it. A very small proportion of change gives real world improvements, but 99% of it is just cycling industry BS designed to get you to keep replacing perfectly good bikes with new bikes that are just different to, but no better than, what you already have. Until recently, I was still using an iPhone 4, and it was just as capable of doing calls, texts and emails on than my current one. If I was buying one for myself and it wasn't work issue, I would still have one as I see no benefit to the latest models that are twice the size and several times the price!

I find the obsession with having latest spec especially odd in the case of something like a Titanium bike, because you are presumably going to keep it for a long time given the expense. Therefore, regardless of what spec you get when you buy, it will be "out of date" in a couple of years anyway, because the industry keeps changing things to try to drive upgrade sales. Unless you are prepared to stump up for a new one every couple of years, even at Titanium prices, you are going to fight a losing battle. You might as well settle on a useful, long-term, spec at the outset, irrespective of whether it is the latest hyped up fad or not. The reason some frames go for years without endless geometry changes is because they got the geometry right in the first place, so it doesn't need to be changed. Any bike that gets revised geometry every year or two must have had crap geometry to begin with, and the customers who bought them paid for the privilege of being used as the test guinea pigs.

If you check, you'll see titanium frames were there in the early 70's. There's nowt new about titanium frames.