Taking the flexitarian road?

[mudsticks]

How much better are free-ranging animals like Cumbrian sheep in this respect?
(they probably get enough water without our help :P )

We don't generally eat the traditional Cumbrian sheep.

The crossbred lambs from those hardy ewes are usually brought down to the lowlands to be fattened.

We eat them.

We could still raise meat in the uplands, at lower stocking densities , and mainly grass finished, or with a bit of locally grown grain to top them up

Some farmers there are doing that now.

They're getting better profit margins with lower inputs.
And doing direct or niche marketing again

We do need to stop overgrazing of the uplands though.

For peat preservation, and to allow a bit more natural tree regrowth .

Both will be good for carbon sequestration, and flood prevention downstream.

 

[sasquath]

Replacing meat with soy immitation is wrong on all levels.
It's not healthier, maybe less saturated fat and heme iron, but full of salt and God knows what hemicals are used to make it meaty.

In environment front, do you really think that cutting down jungle for soy farming and flying/shipping it across the globe has less impact that locally grown meat? Really?

I eat one , max 2 meals containing meat a week. Even then meat is part, I would say no more than 50% of the meal. And that how I was raised. All meat from local butchers, guaranteed UK source, some is even cheaper than supermarket Brazilian or whatever meat they sell.

 

[mudsticks]

But the water is quickly recycled though.

Depends on how polluted it is.
Slurry from feedlots is a big pollution problem.

And methane emitter.

Cowpats on grassland however encourage soil biological activity.

And draw down carbon into the sward roots.

Trampling hooves of herbivores on natural permanent pasture, encourages grass to tiller (expand at the growing tips) and encourages further deep rooting.

Again.

It's the how, not the cow.

 

[sasquath]

Depends on how polluted it is.
Slurry from feedlots is a big pollution problem.

And methane emitter.

Cowpats on grassland however encourage soil biological activity.

And draw down carbon into the sward roots.

Trampling hooves of herbivores on natural permanent pasture, encourages grass to tiller (expand at the growing tips) and encourages further deep rooting.

Again.

It's the how, not the cow.

Methane from barn waste can be harvested and used to power farms. Just like methane from landfills(no longer active) is harvested for decades now. It's methane into H2O and CO2 conversion, but it's better than methane escaping to atmosphere.
For the right way of meat farming to meet the demand the latter has to drop. But still it's not the cow, it's how

 

[Arrowfoot]

To place examples here. Birdseye Green Cuisine Meat Free burgers have 1.5g of salt per 100g. Birdseye Quarter Pounder Burgers have 0.73g salt per 100g.

Double the salt intake...

Beyond meat is better at 0.75g salt per burger but is almost £20 per kg! The Birdseye Quarter Pounders are £6.61 per kg...

Salt to me is important as too much spikes my blood pressure and i certainly couldn't afford all these meatless products. Sure, there are other ways to do it, but i can enjoy lean meat at a fraction of the cost and is less detrimental to my health. I have lost a significant amount of weight eating lean meat...

Think i'll stick to meat...

Agree and important point. Vegan and plant based does not necessarily mean healthy.The amount of salt and food additives in processed food are the ones to watch.

 

[mudsticks]

Methane from barn waste can be harvested and used to power farms. Just like methane from landfills(no longer active) is harvested for decades now. It's methane into H2O and CO2 conversion, but it's better than methane escaping to atmosphere.
For the right way of meat farming to meet the demand the latter has to drop. But still it's not the cow, it's how

It can be done well yes.

In truth at the moment there isn't enough truly regenerative grazing being practised just yet .

But awareness is building, not just UK and us but globally.

I was at a regen ag event, in SE UK earlier this year.


Lots of trad farmers there, big landowners, who had hitherto been going down the conventional chemical ag route, now really getting excited about soil building, biodiversity, mixed cropping, and all the good things that flow from that .

We've still a long way to go, but it feels like the ball is rolling a bit faster now.

We've just got to keep out a watch for the bio tech companies trying to exploit what should be regenerative practices with stuff like GM.

But that's another discussion.

 

[Arrowfoot]

This is an example of plant based food that I am keen on. Not processed but all fresh. Probably very cheap. Recipe says Creamy coconut curried green lentils with rice and baby spinach. I wish they sold this in the ready made takeaways at Tescos.

https://www.thefullhelping.com/creamy-coconut-curried-green-lentils/

 

[vickster]

To place examples here. Birdseye Green Cuisine Meat Free burgers have 1.5g of salt per 100g. Birdseye Quarter Pounder Burgers have 0.73g salt per 100g.

Double the salt intake...

Beyond meat is better at 0.75g salt per burger but is almost £20 per kg! The Birdseye Quarter Pounders are £6.61 per kg...

Salt to me is important as too much spikes my blood pressure and i certainly couldn't afford all these meatless products. Sure, there are other ways to do it, but i can enjoy lean meat at a fraction of the cost and is less detrimental to my health. I have lost a significant amount of weight eating lean meat...

Think i'll stick to meat...

My BP is low, no salt concerns, indeed I’ve been told to have more in the past cos of hypotension.
There’s nothing wrong with eating meat but perhaps at least check where it comes from / how is reared.
Also presumably those shunning processed foods never eat bacon, ham, salami etc, or at least in small quantities only (meat, especially processed in excess can lead to bowel nasties)

 

[presta]

I didn't set out to do so, but my meat consumption is less than a third of the UK average (25kg/82kg PA) even though 53% of my dinners contain meat. I also eat about a third of the maximum recommended consumption of red & processed meat (25g/70g a day) because I eat a lot of chicken, and less than a quarter of the maximum processed meat (4.5g/20g).

I did make some effort to cook more though, so my dinners are split 25% processed, and 75% home cooked.
The processed veggie stuff I eat is:
Sainsbury's Love Your Veg! Indian Inspired Lentil Quarter Pounders x4 454g | Sainsbury's (sainsburys.co.uk)
Tesco 4 Vegetarian Cauliflower Cheese Grills 397G - Tesco Groceries
Tesco Plant Chef 4 Corn Fritters 280G - Tesco Groceries
There are some spicy bean burgers too, but they're not on the website.

 

[presta]

The missus stretches mince with the quorn substitute - does that count? But apart from that I’lll eat anything that comes to hand. Apparently there are social ramifications to that?

I used to use half mince half soya mince in chilli con carne and spag bol, but then Tesco stopped selling the stuff.

 

[presta]

I also find the term 'processed food' interesting, as most food, even that that looks natural, has quite likely undergone some form of process, and everything is a chemical.

I think this is the latest thinking on that score:
http://archive.wphna.org/wp-content...1-3-28-38-Monteiro-Cannon-Levy-et-al-NOVA.pdf

 

[presta]

That processed plant based foods, are better for the environment than processed meat products of industrialised animal agriculture, is probably the case.

Per calorie, the greenhouse emissions from producing beef are 30 times that of rice or root veg, and 60 times that of wheat and pulses.
Environmental impacts of food production - Our World in Data

 

[the snail]

... 15, 0000 litres of water to get 1 kg of beef...

A lot of that water comes from aquifers, totally unsustainable. Once the aquifers are drained, the farms will go out of business, as is already happening in the U.S.

 

[Arrowfoot]

A lot of that water comes from aquifers, totally unsustainable. Once the aquifers are drained, the farms will go out of business, as is already happening in the U.S.

Thats means the generations to follow will be left with ............. Anything that cannot be replaced is cause for concern.

 

[HelenD123]

Yes "plant based" term is new and refers specifically to processed food that does not contain meat. The key differentiator form normal veg is "processed". Yes on the account they are to replace meat.

I thought 'plant based' was used by people as an alternative to vegan, for those who adopt that way of eating not particularly to avoid killing animals but because it's better for the planet or healthier. Or perhaps it's Whole Food Plant Based that I'm thinking of.

Anyway, for anyone that wants to increase the amount of non-meat containing meals they eat I would highly recommend checking out Pick Up Limes or Avantgardevegan.